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DH met with SD's counsellor, SD texted to say she never wants to see him again

Daenerys's picture

SD10 saw the counsellor for the first time last week. My husband met with her yesterday. She suggested at least one more supervised visit with GBM, to which my husband essentially said "HELL NO". He explained what she did last time (hovered over us the whole time) and gave a bit of history (she used to interview SD after her weekends with us to get her to say bad things, she used to email DH to tell him he was a horrible father and to criticize the amount of CS he was paying - $1,200/month at the time). The counsellor then agreed that GBM is not an appropriate supervisor. 

My husband asked if either my mom or my sister could be the supervisor. They both live in the same town as BM and SD. SD knows them well - she calls them "grandma" and "auntie" and likes spending time with them. The counsellor said that she will ask SD this week if she is comfortable with one of them doing the supervised visit with us. I was a little surprised by that - I thought it's giving a child a lot of control over the situation. If SD says no, then the counsellor said she will make an appointment for both my husband and SD to see her at the same time. Apparently SD told her that she is still "scared" of my husband.

The counsellor wants to see me at some point, as well as BM's husband. She told my husband that she thinks we're on track for SD to come for an entire weekend again in about a month, when my in-laws are coming for a visit. SD hasn't seen them in nearly a year so my husband insisted that she needs to be there.

After the supervised visit with GBM last weekend, my husband texted SD to say that he was glad to see her. A couple of days later, she texted him back to say that she doesn't want to see him anymore. Of course we don't know if BM actually sent the text or had some influence on it, but it was still pretty devastating for my husband to get it.

I'm still just amazed that this whole thing is happening. The good news is that court is done with for now. As long as BM cooperates with what the counsellor suggests, DH shouldn't have to go back, although I'm not holding my breath on that one. I really hope the counsellor discovers what's really going on here. I'll have a hard time not expressing my opinion on the topic when/if I meet with the counsellor myself.

At the same time, part of me doesn't want SD to come back anymore anyway. This whole thing has been very stressful and I still don't know how the situation got misconstrued so badly - I can't help but think SD really did play a part in it. I think it's too far gone and if she doesn't stop coming now, she'll stop coming in a couple of years anyway. This will not be the end of drama from BM.



Siemprematahari's picture

I think BM is manipulating and brain washing SD. She's a big influence on her and its unfortunate that all this drama is a result of a coniving and miserable person. I can relate to not wanting SD around because of the stress and hope you all can compromise and come to a happy medium.

Daenerys's picture

Thanks. BM is definitely brainwashing SD. My husband is really hoping for the supervised visit with my family because it will give him an opportunity to actually talk to SD one on one about what's been going on. 

When SD left our house on Easter Sunday, she left as a very happy, well-taken care of girl. She had done a reading at church and was so proud of herself. The girl we saw last weekend was sad and broken. Whatever happened between then was because of BM and GBM brainwashing her. 

Wookiee_Momma's picture

Honestly, if SD is still playing this game I wouldn't even be involved anymore.

Maybe she will realize in due time that she misses her father and messed up and come around again. 


nengooseus's picture

If OP's DH wants to have a relationship with this kid, he really has to stay present and involved.

My SS--6 at the time!--refused visits with DH for almost a year while BM refused to have him seen by a therapist.  SS would literally hide from DH and act like he was afraid of him, which tore him apart.  Once he got the boy in with a therapist, SS started visitation almost immediately.  He needed someone (other than DH--and BM wouldn't) to say it was OK for him to have a relationship with his dad.

Daenerys's picture

Wow. That's really interesting. I'm wondering if maybe that's what will happen with SD. BM and GBM have painted this picture of my DH being an awful person so that's what she has believed. But if someone else says it's okay, then maybe she'll think it is. I don't know seems like she's pretty convinced that she has been abused.


Wookiee_Momma's picture

This child accused her DH of physically abusing her, and involved authorities and CPS.

His need to have a relationship with this kid could very well be at the detriment of Dh's and OP's livelihood. Acting like you're afraid of your dad at 6 years-old is one thing, telling the cops your dad is abusing you at 10 years-old is a serious matter. God forbid the kid is punished in the future and starts this all up again. 

My own SD is 11 and I can tell you she knows the difference between right and wrong.


Daenerys's picture

Yeah, good point. Going forward, things will never be the same. I know my husband will definitely walk on eggshells around SD and up his Disney Dad game out of fear of doing something that she won't like. He'll be afraid to discipline her or tell her no. 

nengooseus's picture

He has to stay present.   This dad isn't willing to wash his hands of the kid, so OP has to decide what she is willing to do.  

As a SP, allegations of abuse are my boundary, and DH is well aware of that, so the situation would be somewhat different in my house.  In my case, I do not allow myself to be alone with SS, even now (this all happened 3 years ago), and we plan accordingly.  My bio DD is never alone with SS.  DH is 100% responsible for him when he's in our house.

Our (former--and terrible) therapist actually encouraged DH to go Disney Dad on SS.  She told him not to correct the boy, and to only do things that he enjoyed for while.  My DH didn't, but don't be surprised if your DH does out of fear.  Also, if you haven't already, you might want to read the book Divorce Poison.  It discusses the issues of PA and how to counter them.  When/If your SD is around again, it will be important to be aware of what these folks do to kids.

Daenerys's picture

Thanks, I'll look into getting that book. I've been reading some things on Dr. Childress's website already about PAS.

Daenerys's picture

Yeah, when my husband told me that the counsellor wants to meet with me at some point, my first instinct was that I want nothing to do with it. I work full time and I've got two kids. For me to drive into the city to meet with the counsellor over drama that BM/SD have caused doesn't seem worth my time.

SD is going to be a different kid going forward.....I don't think it's worth my time or effort to try to change anything. Life could be good without this nonsense.

momjeans's picture

While I feel bad for your DH, and that text - whoa, I feel especially bad for your SD. It is so blatantly obvious that she is in the thick of some major parental alienation and emotional abuse. 

I agree, that for your own sanity and emotional well-being, you just have to take a step back and let go in hopes she’ll come back around and want to see your DH.

Daenerys's picture

Thanks for the support. 

Honestly, the only way I want to have anything to do with this is if BM is willing to meet me and discuss her "concerns" face to face. She's a keyboard warrior who loves to accuse me of doing things when it's behind the safety of her computer or her lawyer. I've graciously offered to meet her many times over the years to discuss whatever she wants because it's more productive than sending passive agressive emails or making accusations via third parties. The only response she gave to these offers was to email my husband and tell him to tell me that she wants "nothing to do with a woman who would steal another woman's child."


MoominMama's picture

'Life could be good without this nonsense'   Indeed it could. I wouldn't want to be around an SD that had done this. There's no trust left. I think it is nigh on impossible to rebuild that relationship again. I know it's your DH's daughter and he is desperate not to lose her but usually with PAS they are lost before you even realise it.

My DH has had to accept that his daughter will never be in his life again. BM will not allow it. She has totally poisoned all of that girls thoughts. I never really believed that she might 'come round' and realise as she got older because once they have been poisoned to that level it's hard for them to go back on it. There might be a time when doubts creep in or they start to miss their father a bit but then they would have to admit they were wrong and that would NEVER happen.

I think it sounds like the counsellor is pretty sure the abuse didn't happen otherwise they would not be suggesting the weekend visit. I wonder if she is playing a waiting game for the right time to address the PAS with SD?

Daenerys's picture

I'm sorry about your husband's experience with PAS. It seems to happen so often.

I guessing the counsellor could tell there is no abuse, just like the police and CPS could tell. My husband said she didn't mention anything about PAS but I wish he would have brought it up. Maybe she wants to see SD a few more times before deciding if it's something to explore.

Dontfeedthetrolls's picture

The only real advice I have is get nanny cams if the child ever does come back. Place on in every shared space like the living room and kitchen. If possible point one towards the bedroom she stays in and do your best to remain out of the room. Doing this prevents the possibility of false accusations again and if there ever is one then you can easily prove that BM is doing this.

I don’t like how the therapist is even asking the girl about who is doing supervised visits. That is incredibly inappropriate. There is no way you can trust the girl is speaking for herself or if it’s BM speaking through her. I would demand a neutral party and be willing to pay the fee that goes along with it.

You are dealing with a child here who is being manipulated. My last piece of advice is to read the book Divorce Poison.

Daenerys's picture

I agree, asking SD to approve the supervisor is not right. When my husband told me that, it didn't sit well with me at all. That's giving a child an awful lot of control. I guess the only good thing is that BM won't (or likely won't) know ahead of time that the therapist will be asking about my family being involved in the supervised visits, so she won't be able to manipulate SD's response ahead of time. 

I was telling a co-worker about the latest updates this morning and she was also appalled that the therapist would give SD that much control. She pointed out that if SD says no, the therapist will likely ask why. SD might then say "Mommy said so" or something, which would be very telling. She shouldn't have a reason of her own to say no - she really does love my mom and sister. They've always been very good to her.

Thanks for the advice about the nanny cams. I've considered it in the past and now would be a good time to do it.

Dontfeedthetrolls's picture

I don't see her outting mom. I see her claiming that grandma and auntie are bad people too who scare her.

Daenerys's picture

I really can't see her saying that. It's one thing for her to say she dislikes me because I have to discipline her from time to time and she has rules to follow at our house. But my mom and sister have always been the fun auntie and grandma. If she says no it will be because she thinks BM will be mad. 

My only concern about bringing my family into this is that it opens the door for BM to start making allegations against them or saying that they're not appropriate supervisors because XYZ. But my family is aware of this and they still want to help if they can.

Journey0623's picture

2 years ago before DH and I were married and living together.... SD accused DH of hitting her (it was a complete lie) child protective services were involved.. and it was dropped and SD saw a social worker... she also strangled another child at school and was almost expelled and blamed it on her dad.. she was 8 at the time...

so it’s over 2 years later and SD is now the biggest mini wife and does not say a negative thing about her dad... she is always all over him and is obsessed... I don’t think BM coached her into the lies, but rather she did it for attention....she barely talks to her dad when she isn’t here... but wants all his attention when she is here... her and I have an okay relationship... 

i guess i am just saying their relationship can go back to what it was.... my DH didn’t give up on her... I 100% understand not wanting her to come back though 

Daenerys's picture

Thanks for sharing your story. Maybe things can go back to the way they were, but in our case BM will have to change her own behavior. 


Ispofacto's picture

SD will never feel safe unless she is out of her mom's custody.  It sounds like you have a lot of documentation to make that happen, if you live in a reasonable court jurisdiction.  Otherwise, this tug of war will never stop.

If you have crazy emails from BM, forward all of them to the counselor.

Daenerys's picture

There are no "crazy" emails from BM, but there are definitely emails from her where she constantly says no when my husband asks for extra time with SD or asks for information about SD, like how she's doing in school, if she's been to the doctor, etc. BM does everything she can to keep him out of SD's life. 

I'm not all that optimistic anymore about this situation. When they first went to court, I thought BM was definitely going to get reprimanded for making allegations with no proof, esepcially since both CPS and the police didn't open cases when she went to them. I was shocked that the judge said, "okay, let's see what a therapist has to say about it" and "yes, GBM can be the supervisor for visits in the short term". 

I do think my husband didn't give the counsellor enough information about the things BM has done. I wish he would have insisted that this is PAS and asked the counsellor to explore that possibility when talking to SD. It's not over yet though. SD is going to be seeing this counsellor for a while. She wants to talk to me eventually and she'll be seeing my husband again as well.