DH's wandering eye update
Every response I got yesterday from you people was awesome and appreciated. I was able to vent my heart out to someone other than my best friend who has her own shit to deal with. I am truly grateful.
Last night I sat in my room and chain smoked cigarettes (I quit in 2008 but decided last night I wanted to drown in smoke and sorrow) and really thought long and hard. I was crying because I know the odds are stacked against us and that all signs point to it not working out. That is so hard for me to admit to myself.
I told DH this. I told him I actually, for the first time, am serious when I say I can't live like this anymore. I told him starting today the drama has to end or I have to leave so we can both eventually be happy again. The slate has to be wiped clean if we are to try one more time. Which means I need to stop throwing the past in his face every time I am stressed out. I need to ask him for help, with actual words, instead of expecting him to read my mind. And he has to show me affection, appreciation. He has to parent his kids. He has to meet me halfway more often.
I told him to delete the random women. To at least do that. He tried to spin it on me and tell me he wanted all of my phone records. I was so offended. He once saw me messaging a male friend and took it way out of context. For him to compare it to his random friend requesting and attention seeking is disgraceful. I refused and told him to delete them or I walk. And I meant it. He ended up deleting Facebook entirely. I could actually see his insecurity last night, how he fears I can do better so he is trying to prove to himself that he's "still got it." How high school is all of this? We are in our fucking 30's... by the way, for anyone who may have assumed (and rightfully so) that we were 15.
So today is a new day. I am heartbroken and anxious. I threw away the cigarettes. I showered and put concealer on my puffy eyes and I am putting my faith in some higher power that maybe I don't have to lose my family. My fucked up shitty amazing family.
Oh and PS: it is a skid weekend. Not even sure how to handle it.
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(((HUGS)))
(((HUGS)))
THIS In the past, my DH has
THIS
In the past, my DH has pulled things like this when I confronted him with things I've stumbled on. Pure reflection of his own actions.
The good thing is OP's DH knows he was wrong. The bad thing is that he can set up a new FB account without her knowing it. I would be suspicious of FB being deleted entirely, unless he wasn't on FB often to begin with.
He is 100% not savvy enough
He is 100% not savvy enough to make another page. I would catch him in and instant and he knows it.
That's good. Hopefully
That's good.
Hopefully you'll figure things out soon either way so you can start feeling better.
I don't believe he has ever
I don't believe he has ever physically cheated. Some argue the facebook thing is cheating, I think it is borderline and still unacceptable. I would be lying if I said I never engaged in a little flirtation with a handsome man over the course of my marriage. I have, but I know it was innocent. If he was caught physically cheating? He better pack up and go because I would chop off his penis and run it through my nutri-bullet.
I know it's a shot in the
I know it's a shot in the dark and that my marriage is basically ruined. If it comes down to me leaving I just want to know I tried everything to save "us" first. As foolish as it is I am hoping he feels the same way too. If he doesn't...well...byebye
Only you will know when
Only you will know when you've tried enough. Everybody has their own limits. I had an ex that I was told to break up with a year before I did. My therapist kept saying to end it, but I just couldn't. When I finally did, I knew inside immediately it was the right move, and had no problems moving on. You'll know when you tried enough.
If you've been together a long time and things are rough, he might just be looking for validation to make himself feel better. He may or may not act on it, but you would know better than strangers on here.
As for minor flirtations, I know my DH enjoys that. It could be as simple as talking to a woman on the train on the way to work, and he thinks it's "cute" and likes to tell me the stories about his new train "girlfriend". Recently he was trying to read another woman's t-shirt, and the woman caught him and then sort of flaunted her assets at him. DH loves the idea of men being interested in me, but I've got our 3 young boys with me at all times...not exactly about to happen!
Emotional infidelity can be a big problem.
"he fears I can do better"
"he fears I can do better" Of course - because you CAN do much better than this manbaby.
I think you're doing the
I think you're doing the right thing.
My DH and I have survived his emotional cheating. Your DH has to be willing to do everything you ask to show that he is devoted to you, your happiness, your security. If his chatting with a hot bimbo is more important that your security, then there is no chance for your relationship. It is a long journey back and I wouldn't have made it without a good therapist. DH continues to see his own therapist because the emotional affair(s) stemmed from his OWN insecurities and had really nothing to do with me. It took me a long time to really understand that.
Sure, you have a role in your imperfect relationship. But his cheating has ZERO to do with you. That's on him.
I insisted that my DH see a therapist. If he wouldn't agree to do that, I would have walked. He knew it. He had an appointment by the end of the next day.
Some people say once a cheater, always a cheater. I don't believe that. I think if people are willing to face their demons and do the hard work of making changes, then the relationship will survive and thrive. It's just that most people won't do that and they go back to their unhealthy habits.
Good luck. It's a journey, not all of it will be pleasant, but you will learn a lot, no matter where the journey leads.
Thank you. I am really hurt
Thank you. I am really hurt and it is nice to read a positive story. I know it is going to be work; I just hope he understands it too. If not I know we will not work because I can't be the only one putting in effort. It sucks.
I should look for a new therapist for both of us.
My DH "sort of" emotionally
My DH "sort of" emotionally cheated on me. It was very one sided. He had a coworker who really fell for him when we got married. My DH loved the attention. She would buy him gifts, and tell him all sorts of personal things. She even bought our baby gifts when our first was born. I know it was one-sided because he told me about their conversations everyday, so he didn't see the big deal about anything. The problem is that he allowed it to continue for pretty much as long as he worked at that company. The problem also was that she wanted to spend time with him outside of work, but refused to meet me. This woman was also married, mind you. My DH did hang out with her a couple of times early on, but stopped after he got tired of fighting with me.
He mentioned her recently and I said that I didn't want to dig the past up. He actually didn't remember much of what she told him, and I told him all the inappropriate things. Based on our conversation, he must have loved the attention from her, but really didn't care about her, at least not remotely the same way.
I also think there are different limits for people. Recently an ex-boyfriend of mine contacted me. I told my DH about it, and he was fine with me talking to the guy. Not long later, my DH said he was uncomfortable with the contact and didn't like the guy being my friend. I did tell him that's exactly how I felt about his former coworker. So I cut contact with my ex-boyfriend. I sent him a message saying not to contact me again and I blocked him on my phone. DH and I are on the same page finally about two particular people, and it feels really good. I know I had no problems dropping contact with someone I hadn't seen in 10 years.
I think when people say that relationships can get stronger after something like infidelity, I think it's because the communication is so open when two people want it to work. It might take a while to trust completely, but when you realize you haven't worried or snooped in a while, and have no desire to do it again, it feels great.
Wow, yes! That's very
Wow, yes! That's very similar! Imagine her refusing to hang out with you around, while he still sees her everyday. He didn't understand why I was so upset, and at one point had even said he would refuse to stop being friends with her. (Meaning only have whatever professional contact was needed to do the job.) I think it took me having contact with an ex-boyfriend (who claims he hadn't had sex in 3 years) for DH to truly see it's uncomfortable, and luckily I have no desire to give my DH a hard time and fight dropping the ex.
I think sometimes my DH misses the ego boost from having a little groupie. I think that's why he likes to tell me about the women he meets while commuting or new women at work that act like he's wonderful. Thankfully he's in a new job where he is very high profile in the company, so he doesn't have the time to have the same sort of "friendships".
Yes. Anyone that is not a
Yes. Anyone that is not a friend to the marriage/relationship is NOT a friend of the individual. If you are my friend, you support my marriage. Not negotiable.
Thank you very much for those
Thank you very much for those resources. Looking into them now.
What a fantastic website. I
What a fantastic website. I loved the part about emotional needs and the needs the woman often considers the most important are the least important to her husband. It is so applicable... because I realize I have a strong need for conversation and I feel I wasn't getting enough of that with DH. He has a strong need for us to share recreation time, he would often be hurt if I didn't want to join him for a day of water sports or a hike or whatever.
3kids gave you some great
3kids gave you some great advice on the last thread that addresses the root cause of these issues. Your husband does not feel respected or appreciated. He doesn't think, in the current state of things, that he can get any admiration from you.
Men don't open up when they are hurting. They either withdraw and shut down or they act out. You've now seen that your DH is doing both of these things. You've got a big problem and you're looking to DH to fix things. What about you? You can't control DH, you can control you. You are part of this dynamic. Once the relationship is in a downward spiral like what you are seeing, you need one person to step up and get it out of the spiral. Yes, even if they don't think the other is doing enough. One person can turn things around.
Men don't receive love the same way we do, because they have a different need. They need to feel that their woman respects them. He hasn't been getting that from you. You are too wound up in your own anxieties and insecurities to see that you are neglecting your man. He doesn't feel like he can get through to you and so he's thinking about turning to other women.
One resource that I'd highly recommend to you is "The Surrendered Wife" by Laura Doyle. I know, I know. "Surrendered" sounds so awful. It's not about being subservient. It is about lessening your own anxiety and learning to self-soothe instead of projecting negativity onto your relationship and looking to your DH to make you feel better. It is about learning what your husband needs from you and giving it to him. It is about loving, respecting, and trusting, and being feminine and accepting.
I can personally attest to the fact that it frickin' works. I grew up thinking that by virtue of being a woman that I was entitled to man's love. I used to be highly anxious and a big nag, and it drove my SO away. I started the techniques in the book, and it led to bliss. Once I let go of my anxiety about things that didn't matter, and started focusing on meeting my man's needs, he was thrilled to be able to start meeting mine. I liked myself better. Suddenly I was low stress, life was a great deal more fun, and our relationship reached new depths.
I had to work to become vulnerable. It was frightening. I had physical reactions to trying to handle situations that would normally stress me out in a different way (there was one where I was shaking because I was so scared to let go of my damaging habits that I thought were protecting me.)
Men don't hold grudges like women do. If you start operating in a different way, once your DH notices, he's going to start modifying his behavior, too. It will take him a while to trust that things are truly different, so stay resolute. Do not expect an immediate turnaround; it has taken you a long time to get to this place, and it will take time to get out of it. Stay on the path and do not go back to being an anxious insecure nag. Be loving, accepting, feminine, and vulnerable.
Do not tell him what you are doing differently and why, just do things differently. He'll notice. If he asks, just say that you want to try to improve your relationship by being less anxious and more loving.
You can get that guy that loved you and wanted to make you happy back, but it requires turning everything you think you know about relationships upside down and becoming resilient and doing some really hard work on yourself to remind yourself that your DH doesn't owe you anything. He deserves to be happy too.
So many women let go once they get the ring and/or the kid and feel entitled to their husbands working to make them happy. They assume their husbands are stuck with them and have no alternatives, and that is not true at all (as you are seeing.) Very few women ever stop and think about what they are or are not doing to make their husbands happy. I think so many marriages could be saved if women started understanding that they don't get to stop trying and have the efforts of a good man handed to them when they've stopped trying to be a good woman.
You are unhappy with how things are. Your husband is unhappy with how things are. I really recommend you think about doing a 180 and handling things differently than you have before.
One thing you did that is the antithesis of what you need to be doing is that when he asked for your phone, you should have given it to him. You are married. If the man wants to see your phone, be vulnerable and let him see it. (Yes, I do realize that an abuser would want to control your phone. I don't' think your DH is an abuser. He's a man that is hurting and is on the verge of turning to other women. Is that what you want? If not, do better. Love him in the way he needs, not the way you need.)
Thank you. This opened my
Thank you. This opened my eyes to a whole new way of looking at things. I will also look into that book.
It changed my life, AJanie.
It changed my life, AJanie. I was like you - anxious, depressed, scared, and expecting to get my man to fix it for me. All it did was bring him down with me. By fixing myself and committing to doing better, he treasures me and wants to be the man that I love and respect. Instead of contributing to the downward spiral, start an upward spiral and commit to contributing it. At this point, you've got nothing to lose.
Truly... thank you. I will
Thanks, but I'm not
Thanks, but I'm not submissive nor am I telling her to be submissive. I'm a pretty powerful and accomplished woman in real life. I don't do submissive. I do vulnerability and femininity. Big difference, my friend.
No, her husband is absolutely not abusive. That is bullhonkey. He was angry and was reacting to her accusations and feeling like she invaded his privacy. He asked to look in her phone and she refused. She refused out of stubbornness and principle, thus showing him yet again that she considers her needs to be the most important part of the marriage.
Telling her that she has the power to change the dynamic is much different than blaming her. I have seen in my own relationship that one person does have the power to change the dynamic. It takes two to create it but only one to change it, which is an awesome thing. Sure, she can give up and walk away, but it doesn't sound like she wants that. She wants her DH to care about her again. But she can't get that without caring about him again, because men are human beings too.
What I spoke about was not about loving someone's problems away. It's not about fixing someone else. It's about taking personal responsibility for your contribution to the negative direction your relationship has taken, learning to make yourself happy, and to stop looking to someone else to do it for you. If you want to interpret that as fixing someone else, then I don't know what to tell you, because it's the exact opposite of that.
AJanie, by her own admission (and as anyone can see reading her posts), is anxious and insecure. And she has been projecting those things outward by trying to have control over her man and their life together and it is sucking the life out of him. He's unhappy and he is acting in ways an unhappy man acts.
So she can continue with the anxious domineering "He's abusive!" stuff that furthers her undeserved entitlement or she can suck it up and realize that marriage does not entitle her to a man working to keep her happy when she's not been giving much that is positive back to him.
I am so tired of men being treated like window dressing. Even here, many of see the BM's doing it all the time and feeling entitled to their exes simply because of reproduction. Then the same women who hate the BM's entitlement further this belief that women can do no wrong and if their husbands are unhappy it's all the husband's fault. It's promoting more entitlement, plain and simple.
Men and their feelings matter, even when we're married to them. Especially when we're married to them.
Sounds like an instruction
Sounds like an instruction guide for women who are so desperate for a man that they will do and put up with anything.
Why is being vulnerable a
Why is being vulnerable a good thing? The definition of vulnerable:
easily hurt or harmed physically, mentally, or emotionally
open to attack, harm, or damage
I have only read part of the book, but if I remember correctly it says the woman must let the man control all aspects of the family finances. How is that not submissive?
Sue - I can't write that well
Sue - I can't write that well when I'm well rested and you did it when you are tired!
Great advice.
WOW!!! Sue knocked it out
WOW!!! Sue knocked it out of the park. OP, please keep reading what Sue wrote.
Do not let anyone tell you that your husband is not abusive and that somehow you are responsible for his actions. He owns his choices not you.