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Simpleton21's picture

SD does not have COVID.  Now that little bit of drama can take a rest but I have a feeling it will happen again. 

Now onto other SD news.  DH sends me some texts she sent him yesterday during the day (when she is supposed to be doing her virtual school) telling him that she "came out" to BM.  Well as far as I know this is at least the 3rd time she's "come out" to DH and her mother.  I'm sure I've mentioned it in previous journals.  I used to think that she might actually be a lesbian and I have no issues if she is.  The issue I'm having now is that it seems to be just another SD attention seeking game. 

After work BM texts DH telling him that SD is grounded from her phone and if he wants to talk to SD he has to do it through BM. SD is 16 missing assignments and was "being mouthy" so she took her phone until Fri.  Kind of seems to me like BM was mad that she "came out" again and was punishing.  I agree that SD should have consequences for not doing her work and missing assignments but how in the world did BM the "reading specialist" at a SCHOOL not monitor this better?  In our area and BM's we all have ProgressBook where you can go in at any time and see what is missing and grades for your student etc.  I get notifications when my son hasn't turned anything in and I don't wait until he has 16 missing assignments to address it!  Also, taking SD's phone is BM's go to punishment but I've yet to see positive results from this punishment.

Also, just in case anyone is overly sensitive/offended easily I want to make it clear that if SD is indeed a lesbian/gay/pansexual/whatever she choses to identify with I will not treat her any different and I will support her. 

 

Comments

Kes's picture

Like you I have no problem with sexuality whether it is lesbian, gay, straight, bisexual, or whatever.  But SD23 "came out" as bisexual to NPD BM when she was about 13 or 14, I seem to recall.  Over the years since, she has not once had a girlfriend, although numerous boyfriends, so I think it was just an attention seeking device.  One of many.  

Once kids are teenage, I honestly see limited benefit of "standing over them" metaphorically speaking, while they do homework.  My attitude was, if they want to fail, fine.  By age 13 or 14 they ought to be able to self regulate sufficiently to get their assignments (or most of them, most of the time) in on time.  If they don't, they can take the consequences themselves, I didn't get involved hardly at all.  Needless to say, both my bios went on to get degrees in business studies and technology. 

Simpleton21's picture

Yep, agreed, I can see this continuing for the rest of SD's life because it is an attention seeking tactic and one she uses fairly often.  I get annoyed that BM will take her to the therapist for anything and everything but never address the real issue....ATTENTION SEEKING....and any time DH gets involved with going to the therapist and it becomes obvious that this is an issue BM quits taking SD to the therapist and then later finds a new one.  I won't be surprised if she now decides she needs therapy for deciding she is gay.

I agree with the not hovering/standing over them at this age either in regards to school work.  My ODS is 13 as well.  However, I do address it with him when I get a notification that he is missing work and tell him he won't like it if he has to repeat a grade while his friends move along.  I do think it is an age where they should be able to self regulate but apparently SD cannot do that b/c she has been coddled her entire life.  Not saying my ODS is the best student either but I know he isn't missing 16 freaking assignments in the first quarter!

advice.only2's picture

My BD14 tells me she bi, gay, trans, gender neutral all the time.  I roll with it and figure once she finally starts dating then we will see.  It seems to be a trendy thing to do for that age range.  The only thing I did tell my BD is she negates the true struggle people go through by using this as an attention seeking item rather than understanding  what  any of those lifestyles really entail. 

Gimlet's picture

Yes.  I would never want to discourage a young person from talking to their parents about their sexuality.  I'm happy that it's become an easier conversation and that the stigma is fading for many people in many places.

But I also agree that doing it for attention is an issue.  It's hard to make that call and separate the two, but if it were my child I would have some conversations about the history of LGBT advocacy in this country (and others for reference).  I have gay and lesbian friends who had a terrible time coming out and who had to choose between some of their loved ones and living an authentic life. 

Even just a few years ago, I was walking with a lesbian couple friend downtown.  Our city is regarded as being gay friendly and when we were walking down the street, the couple was holding hands.   A truck drove by and threw a drink at them and was yelling slurs.  Never once in my life have I had to worry about holding hands with a boyfriend, you know? 

Young, attractive women tend to get more positive attention for being bi because it fuels male fantasies as long as they play along.  It's certainly not reflective of the issues that many gay/lesbian/bi/trans people face.

Simpleton21's picture

Gimlet, I agree with everything you wrote.  I also have good friends that are lesbians and I know that they have struggled with acceptance and hate and other issues because of this.  It is really heartbreaking because they are all truly wonderful people. 

 

Simpleton21's picture

I do agree that I see this a lot in this age range.  SD has been doing it since even younger though.  I feel like she could actually be gay/bi/whatever and that is fine.  I like your response though, that is a good one and I'm gonna hold onto that in case she ever opens up to me personally about it.

JRI's picture

Thank God that attitudes are more enlightened nowadays.  I attended the wedding this weekend.  People keep subtly asking what I think about it.  All I want is for her to be happy and she is.  I hope they can navigate all the issues.  Life can be tough and that will add pressure.

Sadly, her wife, "M"'s family has disowned her, only an aunt, uncle and cousin attended.  M is a lovely, kind, sweet person.  They sent pictures from their honeymoon.  I told DH, want to see 2 happy people?

Simpleton21's picture

Awww, congrats to your granddaughter and her wife.  That is a shame that "M"s family chose not to be accepting and supportive of their relationship.  I would be very annoyed if people kept asking me what I thought about my own grandchilds wedding just because it was same sex.  Obviously you support her and her happiness if you are there!  I feel that is a bit rude! 

 

thinkthrice's picture

NONE of his relatives on his father's side attended.  Now quite a few live down near Savannah Georgia and don't travel outside a five mile radius, but he has an Uncle here that refused to go to the wedding; most likely because Awesomeson's wife happens to be caucasian.   When I was married to Awesomeson's father, his family was quite prejudiced to say the least and said many racist things while I was sitting right there in the same room.  Nobody batted an eye.

Simpleton21's picture

Ugh, I can't wrap my head around people with this mindset.  Hating others and not accepting them for being different in any way disgusts me.  I had a friend that had a mixed baby and her family disowned her.  I don't get it.  However, if that is how people chose to act then good riddance.  I wouldn't want to be around them.

JRI's picture

My granddaughter's wife, "M", is such a sweet, good person.  I just could not understand why the parents were not attending.  Oh well.  The aunt was very nice, she was aggravated that her brother, "M"'s dad, was taking that position.  She was telling me about "M" volunteering in a soup kitchen and other kind acts and said when she heard about her brother's reaction, vowed to attend.  They came about 400 miles.   Last year, my granddaughter and M came to my sister's funeral, a 5-hour drive in winter weather.  Good people.

Simpleton21's picture

Well I'm glad that "M" had her aunt there to make up for her asshat dad.

I'm honestly tired of seeing all the hatred and division and lack of compassion for others going on right now.  The election isn't helping matters.  I'm almost just embarassed to be an American at this point.  We are supposed to be land of the free and everything feels so oppressive!  So divided Sad

nengooseus's picture

We now have primary custody of SD--now SS--but the story is still the same.  Hugely narcissistic BM and SK desperate for attention at any cost.  The medical games, the transient sexual identity, etc.  It's like there's a playbook for these crazy HCBMs and their spawn.

We're at the stage where SD--now SS--has decided that he's transgender (first out as lesbian, then non-binary, then transgender).  He wants to change his name, wants to start hormone therapy, and have top surgery, all of which has been announced progressively over the last 5-6 months.  And SS doesn't understand anything going slow, so he's creating conflict between BM and us that we're not even creating.

I can say that by having him in our house, we are better able to manage his school stuff.  That's a thing.  And he's able to drop off the college track (where he doesn't belong) and work toward a vocational diploma, which is great, but everything else still sucks.  He just doesn't know what to do other than create drama, since that is all BM has taught him.

nengooseus's picture

I pointed it all out because of the drama.  I get that it's a process, but it doesn't have to be so freaking wrought with BS.

I literally don't care if he's a boy, girl, gender neutral, who he has has sex with, what his name is, etc.  I just want the drama to stop.

Simpleton21's picture

nengooseus, YES, all of that!  It does seem to go hand in hand with NPD BMs and that is exactly how I feel.  We are living in similiar situations.  I honestly think it would be better if SD lived with us because I think BM's parenting is toxic to her.  I don't even understand all the terminology.  I will support whatever she identifies with if she is happy and it is what she really wants but you are so right.  It is the drama!  Everything is wrought with drama with BM and SD. 

nengooseus's picture

You're right, that's exactly what we're dealing with because kids in these situations grow up to learn these toxic patterns of behavior and think they're normal.  A lot of the drama with SS is that he doesn't understand that parenting doesn't have to be toxic, so it's weird for him to adjust to our non-toxic patterns and he thinks that BM's is "normal," even though it feels off.  He works SUPER hard to make BM's toxicity "normal."  We saw it again this weekend, and it's SOOO hard to deal with.  SS thinks it's normal for his mother to scream at him in the front lawn of her house.  For her to cry about how SS's proposed name change hurts her feelings, etc.  It's sad.

And as far as disengaging goes, it would be great, but it's hard when you have 70% custody to be disengaged.  And honestly, SS's issues (and BM's BS) affect DH which affects the rest of our family, which includes me, and ultimately, I actually do care about SS.  SS creates drama because that's all he knows.  I have a chance to help him learn how to be a functional person.  I hope it will work.

Simpleton21's picture

Yes, all of this^^^^!  You described the dynamic perfect.  SD doesn't seem to know what to do with herself if there isn't any drama going on but it all stems from BM and BM's toxic traits.  It is hard to deal with and it is hard to disengage from because it does affect DH and then the rest of the family as well.  BM has always tried to cause issues in our family and drag my family through the mud to fit her agenda. 

It is step hell for sure.  I see why blended families fail more often than first families.  I'm at a breaking point in my marriage before.  The high conflict ex wife, the needy/attention seeking child, the crazy trashy MIL, it is all just to much and destroying my peace of mind Sad

If I thought there was a chance of helping SD I would but I think that she is to far gone with BM and her manipulative mind games. I do care about her. 

Gimlet's picture

Have you thought about finding a therapist for just you?  Not for your marriage, or your husband's family dynamics, or SD.  Just for you.  You can sort through what your needs are and decide how you want to move forward with advocating for them. 

BM here has died down a lot since the kids aged out, but even before that I decided to disengage from the drama cycle and crisis manufacturing.  When there literally isn't anything you can do about something, it makes no sense to give it any time or energy.  Same with my DH's family - I have let him know what I need for my mental health and he can choose to set boundaries or he can interact without me.   I certainly wouldn't inflict my family on him, although they are much more flagrantly dysfunctional than his.

You are deserving of support and consideration too.

Simpleton21's picture

No, I hadn't really considered personal therapy for just me but you are right, it could definitely help me.  I am at a breaking point with all of this.  My DH is part of the problem too.  He doesn't respect my boundaries or wishes when it comes to his family.  He continually forces his mom on me and does not respect my feelings about it. 

I don't feel like I have his support.  I actually told him this last night and again today.  I feel like instead of him being my partner he is against me.  We aren't a team.  This actually wasn't even in regards to SD or BM.  It was in regards to him being upset that I was nominated for an award rather than excited for me.  It makes me feel bad about myself when he isn't proud of my accomplishments and instead is upset because if I win he can't go on the trip with me.  There are just so many more issues. 

So yes, yes, I do need counseling for me!

MissK03's picture

I've had a bunch of conversations with SD13 on this topic because she has come home saying "so and so says they area bi etc." 

I am a full supporter of the LGBTQ community. I've explained to her that most (based on the girls she describes ) of is attention seeking and more importantly it's really unfair to the kids who actually could be struggling with the fact that they ARE feeling a specific way. 
 

Sometimes I feel that SD actually might be "on the fence" with this topic. I've never expressed this to SO but, I want her to feel that she can talk to me about it if maybe that's how she is feeling. 

Simpleton21's picture

I think you handle the conversation/topic well.  I am also a full supporter of the LGBTQ community.  Always have been and always will be.  I wouldn't want to speak to her in a way that would be harmful or discourage this if it is indeed what she really feels.  Hard telling with my SD though b/c she has so many attention seeking tendancies.

Also, she doesn't ever discuss this with me.  If she did try to discuss it with me I would be open to that.  However, BM has made her leary of me since day 1 so we don't have that type of bond.  I am glad that she feels she can discuss it with DH and he is always supportive of her feelings.

Cover1W's picture

OSD came out as "bi" to DH and I at a restaurant dinner with BM and YSD. NO I didn't want to go but I did, kept my mouth shut. The whole evening was just wierd.  When she told us DH and I kind of just went "Um, OK, that's fine." Not a big deal for any of us. However, I think OSD was disappointed it wasn't a drama - she demanded BM get the bill and she practically RAN out of there. DH was PO'd at her attitude.

I simply told DH I didn't care WHAT she identified as because a b*tch is still a b*tch.

When we last saw her over a year ago on our family trip she kept ranting about how terrible men are and how she doesn't understand how lesbians EVER get together with men (they are inferior in her eyes). I had to tell her to, basically, shut up one time because she was NOT going to make judgements about my friends whom she knows nothing about. DH's sister thought it was an attention ploy and a way to identify with BM (we think BM is either a lesbian or asexual, more likely a closet lesbian for whatever reason).

But neither SD has/had (when living with us) ever really been on a date or had a crush on anyone or even been interested like a 'normal' kid would. They both have relationship/people issues for sure.

Simpleton21's picture

I find it interesting how many SDs come out as bi/gay/asexual/whatever.  I mean it could just be coincidental but in these cases it always seems to be for attention and they all seem to have some sort of personality disordered bio parent.  That is definitely a weird way to make the announcement and it seems you are right that she was mad that it didn't garner the attention she was seeking. 

I think that was part of SD's "being mouthy" with BM.  SD "came out" this time via text to BM while BM was at work and BM told her they would talk about it at home and then DH got the text from BM about her being mouthy/missing assignments and losing her phone.  I believe the time prior to that SD "came out" via text to BM from a friend's house and then BM blew up and told her she couldn't stay the night with girl friends anymore if she was gay/bi/etc.  I think BM's reactions/drama/etc are what keep causing SD to "come out" over and over again.  DH is usually like, okay, if you want to talk in person we can and I support and love you no matter what.

It is honestly hard to really determine motives but when there are patterns of the same behavior it becomes more evident IMO as to the motive. 

I guess SD had a bf that she broke up with (based on the text DH showed me) she stated "yes I broke up with xwy b/c I don't like boys I like girls".  I was suprised she had a bf b/c she is a bit immature and she really doesn't seem into boys/guys.  I think SD wants the attention/drama but I also think that she is gay or bi.  SD also seems to have relationship/people issues and I have no doubt it stems from BM's whackadoodle/controlling/narc type parenting.  Also, just to be clear I don't think DH is fault free here either.

NoWireCoatHangarsEVER's picture

I have two step daughters and four daughters. My youngest is six but the other five have all said they are lesbian at some time or other and then change their mind and then change it again and then change it again. SD21 I think really is and I really really loved her last gf. The others are young and just jump on the band wagon. All their friends back and forth too with being trans or binary or something else. I just say I support you and I do but do I think it's a fad, yes I do. Especially Dd15 I see the way she bats her eyes and twirls her hair around boys and to myself I think , "yeah.ok." Her friend Ashley was Ash for about two years here but is now back to being a girl and now wants to be called Willow. All of their friends at school are like this too. Their Instagram bios say they are a whole litany of different sexualities and some of these kids are 11

Simpleton21's picture

Wow, so way more common than I thought.  I don't have any bio daughters and me and my friends didn't go through this phase/fad.  Growing up my mom's bf was a lesbian so I knew about being gay/lesbian/etc and was taught acceptance.  I don't know all the terms anymore either.  I think SD said she was pansexual once also.  IDK, maybe she is. 

thiscantbenormal's picture

Twin 12 yr SDs here broke alienation silence to tell their dad one was a lesbian with a girlfriend and other was bisexual with public tiktoks announcing it.  We don't care if they really are but feel this is just an attention grab and opportunity for their mother to put another "I'm a mother of this oppressed class of society child" sticker on her car.   The more broken they act (such as having the feelings hurt by just a glance or a kid going out of turn or being a commonly bullied identity or faking a "sensory processing disorder") the more attention they get from their mother.  

Simpleton21's picture

Ugh, yes, everything with my SD is an attention grab also.  BM here thinks she is MOTY but she is really just a controlling narc.

caninelover's picture

Ugh I am glad to read this thread.  My SD23 identifies as:  non-binary trans masculine asexual vegan latinx (even though she is white, her grandmother on her mother's side was from Colombia).  Requires they/them pronouns (but now recently said they will 'allow' he) and goes nuts if someone makes a mistake.  Changed their name to a gender-neutral name as they didn't want name BM gave them (they don't speak).  We had started family therapy and the first therapist actually quit on us because narcissist SD sent an email complaining of hurt feelings that therapist didn't use the correct pronoun (once, it was an accident).  Next therapist was nice, but useless, and used validation therapy which I don't think helps with a raging narcissist like SD.  SD sent an highly obnoxious email after one session saying they didn't appreciate us sharing our experiences of moving away from home in our early 20's since they are trans and started hormones and are growing facial hair and feel like a 14-year old boy, and therefore us cis-normative (basically) simpletons should not speak of our 'easy' lives because they are so special.  They also feel we should not "pressure" them to confirm when they are having surgeries (huh?  I never asked to know any of this and never once asked about any surgery plans.  They actually brought it up themselves!). 

I disengaged after this and am so much happier already.

Simpleton21's picture

Yikes!  Well your situation sounds way more complex and crazy.  I honestly don't even know what all that identifies as "xyz" means.  At least my SD isn't that deep into it.  Not that I would judge her.  I just would be confused and then accidentally offend someone.  I accidentally offended a friend because I didn't know that she was part hispanic which apparently she really identifies with.  I didn't mean to offend her but telling her that I didn't realize that she was part hispanic was apparently offensive.  I didn't say I don't like hispanics.  I try hard to respect others feelings but man it can get complicated sometimes.

I don't blame you one bit for disengaging. 

caninelover's picture

It's insane and out of control.  I think most people would try and respect someone's genuine wishes to be respectful, but narc SD always uses accidental missteps as a gotcha, then never lets it go.  They don't realize that behavior is alienating and why they have so few family or friends in their life.  Sad but not my problem anymore.