Prenup help / advice pls!
here is the situation: getting married to 20y older husband w/4 kids (15,17,19,21). me in late 20s no kids but a high profile career which will give me a >100k salary in a few years. He is well-off with quite a few assets, big retirement accounts, including a house we live in.
We dearly care for each other but...He insists to have a prenup stating in course of divorce he gets the house and all he owns at time of entering marriage. I first felt hurt bc I don't have much assets now and don't think it's fair to have NOTHING after lets say 10ys of marriage. But I do understand that he can't start all-over if we split everything 50-50.
The law in CA states though that even without prenup, separate property is by definition everything everyone owned at time of marriage and will be treated like separate at divorce.
Does that mean assuming he retires in 5 years, I earn big bucks by then, we divorce (god forbid), I go empty-handed and he gets to keep all?
So why the prenup then??????? I just want a fair agreement considered that my non-financial contribution to marriage is my youth, chance of not having kids plus career compromise to stay near him nothing more.
Pls help! Advice very much appreciated! THX!!
20 year difference? Wow. He
20 year difference? Wow. He is protecting his assets so he has something to leave all those kids he has.
This is very common. I would push for an 8 year agreement, that if the marriage lasts 8 years.... then the prenup is removed.
If he has no desire to ensure that if something happens to him, you are cared for in the style of which you will become accustomed.... then you have a problem.
At a min, I would STRONGLY suggest that you get a huge life insurance policy on him based on the fact, that if he dies, you will be alone, his kids will get everything, and you MUST be able to proceed with your life.
Also... I would seriously think long and hard before I stepped into what he is offering. WHAT IS HE OFFERING ANYWAY? His companionship? He wants a young beauty on his arm, a trophy wife... but... he is OFFERING NOTHING?
Its not like you BOTH are wealthy and protecting your assets equally.
Also understand that anything you get TOGETHER during your marriage will be split 50/50. If you have no real assets, as your career grows, and he retires, he will benefit greatly from your success, but since his career has ended, etc... he will keep what he has and benefit from you. HE wins the biggest, you lose the MOST.
I am concerned for you.
Good Luck.
Just to clarify the statement
Just to clarify the statement "if he dies the kids get everything" is not accurate (at least in the state of MD). When you are married, and you die wihtout a will, the property automatically shifts to the spouse 100%. With that said, you should make sure you are taken care of properly in his will, and vice versa. While at 20 you feel invincible, everyone should have a will. Especially if you are going to be rolling in the big bucks, or when you die, all of your property goes to him (and probably HIS children, by exension). And, anything bought together, again, is not necessarily split 50/50 upon divorce. There are so many nuances. You should speak with a lawyer. What if YOU are the one who becomes incapaciated during the marriage and he wants out. Then you have signed away any needs you may have (forget about wants). If you invest years with this guy and you become dependent for some reason, you cannot sign away your future.
I married when I was 26 and my DH was 16 years older than me. He was clearly more established in a business and made 75% more than me. He gave me a pre-nup to sign (since he was divorced with 2 children and didn't want to do it again either). I was hurt as well, but not dumb. He is a lawyer (a divorce one at that!) so he thought I would just sign it. I told him I wanted my own lawyer to look at it. He sent me to a friend/colleague of his. I was a little nervous at first thinking she would take his side, but she told me the minute I walked through her door I was her client and she would do what was best for ME. So, she made a TON of changes to his document and I gave it back to him. He was really ticked off thinking he could get away with that. That should have been the writing on the wall... Needless to say, we never did sign a pre-nup. LOL.
I think it is fair that he
I think it is fair that he wants a pre-nup - he wants what he brought into the marriage - if God forbid that you divorce you will get whatever is made during or purchased (ie homes) during the marriage. You stated that you will soon be making more than 100,000 a year - Prenups are tricky because it makes us think of divorce but so many people men and women have been screwed over without a prenup.
You are choosing to not have kids, plus I am confused because you say you are getting ready for a >100K salary in a few years but at the end you are stating career compromise - not to be mean but no one is putting a gun to your head to give all of this up and while youth is an asset you will also get older - if you want the marriage you will need to sign the prenup - your FDH did not get to be as rich as he is by being stupid and it would be stupid not to have you sign a pre-nup.
If 10 years down the line you get divorced you can fight for alimony - I don't know your background how long he was divorced or how many time married but rich men will make sure that they keep their money and rightly so - they earned it - so sign the pre-nup and make sure your marriage is a priority and work at it and make sure it does not fail but if it does - I suggest putting away money each month in an account in your name only and make sure that all of the jewelry that he buys you - you keep under lock and key - I read where a husband left his wife and took all of the jewelry and sold it at auction and the wife was left with nothing. Just be smart about putting away for a rainy day. Good luck!
Can't you stipulate that you
Can't you stipulate that you get so much $$$ for every year of marriage? Also if it's separate property I think if it's owned free and clear before the marriage - I may be wrong but I wouldn't pay a dime in maintenance, mortgage, taxes or upkeep if you are not gaining ownership in the house.
I agree. DO NOT PUT A DIME
I agree. DO NOT PUT A DIME TOWARD HOUSEHOLD EXPENSES. Put your share in a private savings. You will not get CREDIT for it later.
Now... you can have the house appraised.... if he still has a mortgage on it.... then in a divorce, you can have it re appraised and he will have to split 50/50 any gain in equity.
Its a nightmare none the less. I would keep your money separate, and make some wise investments with your share. Honestly.
VAStepMom: Thank you so much
VAStepMom: Thank you so much for your input. Regarding "property at death": I believe by law I am entitled to min 1/3 of all assets even if defined as "separate". The kids are entitled to the other 1/3. He is not very close to any of the kids.
I never looked at it the way you do and it was shocking for me to realize that I was way too benign.
Also: the increase of value of his assets (house etc) will be counted as marital property too...and no waiver of rights towards retirement accounts or other properties are included in the prenup regarding death at all. We did agree on 10y limit after which the prenup goes invalid or will be renegotiated.
is that fair enough?
thank you all for your input!
thank you all for your input! are you sure about "all goes to his kids at death" ? I read that I would be entitled to at least a portion of all, including retirement funds etc.
caregiver1127: by career compromise I meant - I have job offers from outstanding places that I would have accept without hesitation --- if I haven't met him and if there was no age gap. We are painfully aware that time is precious in our case so I am willing to stay local for a smaller paycheck bc he has enough to provide for both of us and bc he can't change his high earning job.
that's also the very reason why I don't want to regret my choice for "us" if one day "us" goes down the drain.
in addition, I am from a very wealthy family and my family insists on a prenup -- oddly enough.
I know why your family wants
I know why your family wants one and so should you if you come from a wealthy family and something happens to your parents or grandparents then you need to protect your assets as well from your hubby and skids - have your family lawyer write up a prenup and check the prenup your hubby wants you to sign
and Sueu2 - I did not mean that she blindly signs a prenup without consulting a lawyer and luvethemall I can assure you her future hubby will not marry her without one - but in this case it seems they both need one!
Ignore everything you've read
Ignore everything you've read here (and no I haven't read any of it) and go get an attorney who specializes in them and have them send the bill to Daddy.
By the way - forget my advise and RUN. The life you'll live won't be worth the money.
it appears to me that you ppl
it appears to me that you ppl can't grasp the fact that we are a happy couple after all and it is our joint decision for each other for a life. This is not a war! So pls spare your comments such as
"By the way - forget my advise and RUN. The life you'll live won't be worth the money."
I guess I am done here unless there are sincere advice given.
thx nevertheless
I just saw this thread. Of
I just saw this thread.
Of course, you need to talk to your attorney, like everyone else said. I don't think I would tell you to run..it's not like he has small children and you are going to be dealing with all of that hot mess on top of what you are trying to work out financially.
I have a friend that had a pre-nup-she sold her house and married him, and they bought a new house together. part of the pre-nup was that if they divorced before 5 years was up, he has to reimburse her the full amount of what she sold her old house for, and invested in the new one. They are still together, by the way, 7 years now. The husband had a lot more money than her, and at the time she had young children. She just wanted to make sure she didn't walk away with nothing.
Please do not put all people
Please do not put all people in one category - then you become like the people who tell you to run - I never said to run I said you will have to sign a pre nup if you want to marry your rich finance - nothing wrong with it just get your family's lawyer to look it over and also have your finance sign the pre nup from you and your family.
If you post something then you need to read through take the advice that you can use and grow a little thicker skin or you won't last a week on here!
I went through a rough time
I went through a rough time being with someone divorced and kids. I was about to walk away many times! but we worked through this and even if it sounds selfish: we both admit that bc he doesn't have much bond to his kids (hence they never visit, no xmas presents or vacations ect) we can build a happy relationship our own. Which we did and our bond is stronger than ever.
After hurtful moments, and YES feeling "like a woman sells herself to a man, while he calculates her worth....as little or nothing."
...I do understand him being terrified to remarry at his stage of life and therefore agree willingly to give him the security to keep his house if we divorce. I am expecting to build my own wealth within the next 20 years.
Pls correct me if I am blinded: At this moment, the prenup actually favors me, bc I don't have much assets. In 10 years it's up to me to renegotiate bc then I will have more to protect when his earnings and savings are starting to be depleted.
I guess to me I think it is fair to share everything we accumulate from day1 50-50 which also includes appreciation of house etc. Just afraid that I am too kind which I know is my weakness always been.
Didn't Tom Cruise do
Didn't Tom Cruise do something like that too?
Yes he had a 10 year prenup
Yes he had a 10 year prenup with Nicole Kidman and at 9 years about 9 months he left her.
I think it's ok he asks you
I think it's ok he asks you to sign one-i've seen many men dragged through the cleaners. Just have an attorney you hire look it over.
Personally I'd be more concerned w/his character and why he isn't bonded w/his kids...i mean you said no xmas presents, they never visit. I'd find that very odd.
I don't know. My DH has
I don't know. My DH has stellar character, and he is treated the same way by his kids.
Maybe their mom has PAS'ed them.
overit2: he tried for many
overit2: he tried for many years to bond, was always available, did the disneyland dad out of guilt, bought car for kids to drive up (20miles) to visit him out of the visitation time ect etc...now he gave up bc he was devasted to realize how much time and effort was wasted. kids never call, not even on his Bday, xmas, holidays.... when he had an accident and couldn't walk, not a single one asked how he was nor offered help. But if they need a new phone... they'd call.
so yes, I was concerned too but learned the better. And now all that's left is college fund partially covering each one's education and then that's IT!
Please go see an attorney.
Please go see an attorney. Let the attorney give you the latest and greatest advice for you and regards to the state you live in.
Many of us who have experience with Prenups have given you good advice, but we are NOT your attorney. He has the best advice.
Good luck.
EvilTrophyWife, I am 15 years
EvilTrophyWife,
I am 15 years younger than my DH. I was early 20's when I met him. He was very financially secure and successful. I.....was not! HA!! We had discussed prior to dating exclusively if he would ever be interested in marrying again and he said if he did remarry there would HAVE to be a prenup. So, I knew that before we were even exclusive. Needless to say, we are married and YES I SIGNED A PRENUP. It seemed rather obvious that I would. What if I was a gold digger? What if after a few years I decided I didn't like the age difference or being a step mom? What if I met someone "my age" and wanted out? These are all valid fears for him. He would have been stupid not to insist on one!! It was a difficult process. In the beginning I was totally ok with a prenup. As it progressed I was always ok with the idea of a prenup. When we got into the nitty gritty I had many moments of being upset about it as his general theory of "whats yours is yours, whats mine is mine, and whats ours is ours" sounds like a good idea - but what if nothing was in "our" name while we are married? Upon marrying I stop working soooo how was that supposed to work? What if he divorces me after 20 years and then I am in my 40's and have to go back to the same lifestyle I was living in my early 20s?? Hmmm... I don't think I would be so happy with my chevy cavalier and renting a townhouse........ ANYWAY! Yes, the ladies here are correct that you *HAVE* to have your own attorney that will look out for YOUR best interests. You will find a compromise that works for both of you, I promise. It involves some tough conversations and maybe some hurt feelings and probably some disagreements (or complete blowout fights in my case!) but you will get through it if you two are meant to be. It really does take out a lot of the romance of getting married, I will warn you, so try to do this before you plan any wedding stuff - get the business out of the way first!! In the end, I think it is nice that we have an "agreement". Should we divorce it will be very simple, it was all agreed upon prior - although it was depressing planning out our divorce. And, we don't ever argue over money. We had all those tough conversations prior to getting married so there are no surprises and we had already discussed and planned for how finances would work. He is happy that he feels protected and I am happy that I will be taken care of to an extent I feel reasonable. Feel free to PM me if you want to talk about it. Oh, last but not least, yes some people have a time limit on their prenups - that is a personal decision - my lawyer said he does not like that because some people may start to panic and divorce, especially if they are having a rocky year. For example, let's say your prenup only applies to 8 years and 7 years into it husband gets the "7 year itch" - he may panic and think "OMG I need to get out of this NOW so she doesn't get half my stuff in a year or two." - I'm not saying I agree with the theory but that is just how he viewed things. Just because you are younger, he has children, and/or he wants a prenup doesn't indicate you are doomed. You will just have different challenges than a traditional marriage.
GOOD LUCK!
They always say, "No one goes
They always say, "No one goes into marriage preparing to get a divorce..." There really is no reason to be hurt over this. It makes things safe - for you and your soon to be new hubby. Don't take offense to it - pretend it's just a way to protect yourself - it is! I am all for prenups! If something would happen - I refuse to let someone take everything I have earned myself!