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Talked to a social worker

justmakingthebest's picture

In my desperation in getting letters from the genetics clinic that we took SS to stating that his diagnosis procedure in no way put him in any harm and was just a simple physical exam, I wound up breaking down crying (like an idiot) with the head of the clinic. She asked if I wanted to talk to the hospital social worker for advice. So I did.

She told me that in our state, Munchousen Syndrome by Proxy would be investigated by CPS and that we have grounds to open that case. She said we need to report it in the county that SS lives in. I have reached out to our attorney again for his thoughts on the matter. The social worker said not to mention that there was a custody case. Only state your concern for SS's mental health. Give them all records that states he is healthy. Let them do the rest. 

Has anyone opened a CPS investigation on BM? Did it have any effect in court? 

Comments

Survivingstephell's picture

What have you got to lose if you do this?  What have you got to gain?  Can the social worker be an ongoing resource for you?  

justmakingthebest's picture

Probably not on going. SS was only seen at the children's hospital once for his Non-diagnosis. They have closed his file at the specialty clinic since there is nothing wrong with him...

Honestly that is where I am at. I mean, what can we possibly lose at this point. This is a real concern, one that I have shared here numerous times! BM is crazy convincing SS that he has these diseases and disorders and there is NOTHING wrong with him. The fact that he told his dad that the doctors lied and that DH was a liar about it, it scary. 

Survivingstephell's picture

I just did a short google search on this and I think some time looking for stories on this and how this all played out for the differernt situations might help you decide what to do with the documentation you have.  

Some of these cases ended  with murder.  Crazy stuff!  

tog redux's picture

DH called CPS on BM once when she left the country and left then 14-year-old SS with a 17-year-old caregiver for 2 weeks.  Needless to say, it went nowhere. They took the report and then decided it was just fine to do.  As did the judge.

I would be very wary of making a CPS report during a custody battle. BM will undoubtedly spin it as an attempt on DH's part to get back at her.  Also - DH should be talking to the clinic, CPS etc.  For your own mental health, please don't try to fix this for him.  I speak from experience, you can't fix it.

My mantra is:  I didn't cause it, can't control, can't cure it. (Yes, I stole it from Al-Anon).  This is DH's problem to sort out. You can support and help but don't take it on in the way you are.

justmakingthebest's picture

With DH's job he can't make these calls. There aren't enough hours in the day. As his wife I am fine with helping anyway I can. I understand that some don't see things the way I do. It isn't that DH doesn't care. I get texts all day long from him. But he can't physically get on the phone the way I can. 

tog redux's picture

Listen - I know that's your reasoning, but this is not your place, or your responsibility.  It just isn't.  DH can find time to make phone calls at work, or ask for some time off.  If he really wants to do it, he will find a way.

I'm not suggesting he doesn't care. I'm just telling you, from experience, that you are owning way too much of this. Yes, you can support and help - but you dealing with the doctors and lawyers and CPS is way over the top. It's causing you enormous stress and you can't fix any of it.

Survivingstephell's picture

You can't fix it becauase you don't have a legal leg to stand on.  That doesn't not reflect on you as a person or will condemn you to hell.  Its just the way it is.  SS was born to DH and BM.  For what ever reason, those are who his parents are.  

It might be time for DH to take a day off and make those calls from a list you give him.  

tog redux's picture

Yes, exactly. I tried so hard to solve this problem for my DH and I lost myself in the process - and we lost SS anyway.

I still help out with certain things, but I have learned to let go and bite my tongue unless he asks for my help and I'm willing to help - and let him do it his way, even when it makes me anxious.

advice.only2's picture

I know you probably don't want to hear this, but I think it's time to take a step back and let this battle play out how it will and start focusing on other things in your life.

It's kind of like life after a major tragedy or event, those first weeks/months everything is laser focused on that event and going over every detail and trying to figure out ways it could have been different.

As time passes you start to realize that the more you focus on it the crazier it makes you feel and it's a relief to put it aside and not focus on it as often.

I think you need to shift your focus, this battle will continue to be here and it will continue to fight until SS is 18, but it's time to start shifting your focus and letting this go as it may.

This is already affecting your health and mental state.

justmakingthebest's picture

Honeslty and not to be rude, I get how y'all feel. I really do. I am not stopping though. It isn't in my nature. I have the abillity to take this on with my husband and I will do so for as long as I can stand it. He can't take leave to make phone calls. If he starts down that path there will be no leave left. We have trips planned, we have a hearing to attend. Someone has to do the collection of this stuff. He gave me authority through a POA so I can. I will continue. 

All I really wanted to know is has anyone ever called CPS on BM and did it have bearing in court? 

tog redux's picture

I already told you above. Yes, and no, it meant nothing in court. It just made DH look vindictive and gave BM another win.

still learning's picture

Calling CPS will have no bearing in court unless there are findings. Did I read that you'll have to submit a claim in a different country?  That's going to be tricky and they may just throw it out after making a call to BM.  ExH made a CPS claim against me just as we were about to divorce. I was investigated and the charges were unfounded. Guess who looked like an @ss in court when it was brought up, him.  I would tread very carefully when involving social workers and CPS into your life. One thing that may happen is that your home life will be investigated as well and I can tell you it's intrusive and stressful.  

I agree with others that your DH needs to take the helm on this if he really cares.  When it's revealed that the father does not have time to pursue this and that is was SM making the calls and filing claims it will refelct very poorly on your case.  

tog redux's picture

I didn't even think of that - but that's true.  BM here would have spun that as it being my jealousy and wanting to take SS away from her and make him mine (which is what your BM is concerned about anyway).

justmakingthebest's picture

It is a different state than us, and would have to be filed in that county. I would not be the one to make that call. DH or his lawyer would. 

I am just unsure of moving forward. I don't want it to look bad in court as being spiteful but at the same time if she is filing for sole custody and no visitation based on us taking him to the doctor and finding out he isn't sick... I mean.... Hopefully the judge will have enough sense to stop this BS?

still learning's picture

I misread county rather than country, still making claims across state lines is going to be time consuming and difficult to prove. How do you know that she didn't take him to a doctor and have him diagnosed for a certain disorder? Have you seen ALL of his medical records and spoken to his doctors?  Doctors often come to differing conclusions and diagnoses.  

Her motion to stop visitation is spiteful and yours claiming she is medically abusing him is in retaliation to her motion may be viewed as reactionary by the courts.  

I don't know what the answer is but you've certainly opened up a can of worms and honestly it doesn't look favorable on your end.  

advice.only2's picture

Considering she has already filed an ex parte hearing against your DH stating that SS is scared to be around you both, you guys filing this will appear to be tit for tat.

tog redux's picture

Yep, I agree. CPS reports filed during a custody battle are viewed very skeptically. Especially something as hard to prove as Munchausen's by Proxy.

NoWireCoatHangarsEVER's picture

It escalates.  That's how they get attention and it escalates.

Also, I was watched the Stephen King miniseries IT from the 1990's the other day and I thought about you and your stepson.  You should watch it. One of the kids has a BM like in your situation.  He doesn't really have asthma but uses an inhaler with no real medicene in but camphor that smells like medicene.  The pharmacist tries to tell him when he reaches age 11-12 what his mom his doing to him.  So when he's an adult and he goes back to the town and he sees the pharmacist and he has that memory and realizes he has lived a life that is a lie and that he was never sick and fragile but that his mom was a sicko and that he never married and he never had kids was real eye opening for him in the book and in the miniseries.  But it made me think of your SS and his mom because that's where your SS is heading.  She tried to cut him off from friends and his dad and cripple him emotionally for her own selfish sick needs.  But in your case, it's not fiction.  It's playing out in real life.  So heck yes call the social worker  

Major Blunder's picture

Hey Just, I'm all behind you fighting for your SS and standing by your DH in whatever capacity he may need, I have done it, am doing it and would probably do it again.  As for a CPS case during a custody battle I have never been involved in something like that but I'm sure what others are saying is true that it would look skeptical, on the other hand the child is at risk so the question here is less what will it look like in court and more , what is the important goal here, the welfare of SS or visitation time, ending alienation etc?  The obvious answer here is the welfare of SS, I would report it, just know that it will be a difficult battle no matter how it looks to the court.  I'm still praying for all of you.

tog redux's picture

I totally get how frantic this feels, I used to feel that way too.  SS used to come into our room crying at night because BM had pressured him to lie to his attorney and he had done it.  It was horrible to watch what she was doing to him and be able to do nothing. She manipulated teachers and therapists and SS and everyone believed her.  I got way overinvolved in trying to support DH and we got absolutely nowhere.  50K in court and SS ended up alienated anyway.

The problem is that Family Court is not like real court, you know,  where evidence matters. If you even get to present any evidence, all that you've said is he-said, she -said.  You get your doctor's info submitted. She gets her doctor's info submitted. She gets a therapist you've never met to say SS is afraid of DH. In between that, there are 4 adjournments and flights to her area and 30 hours of attorney time, and the next thing you know, 50K is gone. 

And then you get a decision, which is that BM will keep custody and DH will get visits, no one cares about is he or isn't he really sick, he doesn't seem in danger, so who cares.  So here comes time for a visit, and BM says she won't send him because he's terrified and angry that no one believes he has an illness, so he's NOT GOING.  So DH again retains his attorney and files a motion and flies to her area, rinse repeat ...

There is no winning against a mother who is so determined to win that she will destroy her own son in the process. I'm not saying to give up - but to be realistic and spare yourself all the stress.

 

We so thought that truth would prevail in Family Court.  HAHA.  The best liar wins in Family Court.

advice.only2's picture

Agree and I think that's what I was trying to convey is that this isn't necessarily a battle DH and OP will win and she can't let this keep affecting her to the point it's causing her health issues.

We spent 7 years fighting in family court, and we had custody! Meth mouth kept getting arrested and put in jail and family court didn't care, she would come in cry and cry and cry and the judge would give her more time, more visitation, more anything despite the fact that she was a completely unfit drug addict.

After seven years of this affecting our lives, our health and our finances it didn't end on a good note. Spawn moved out never to be heard from again and we haven't spoken to her in three years...she hates us for everything she perceives we did to her meth mother and refuses to see that we spent all that time and money trying to protect her.

Ispofacto's picture

CPS doesn't care about emotional abuse.  If SS isn't being illegally medicated, or receiving dangerous and unneeded medical procedures, they don't care.  They are required to intercede only when a child is in clear and immediate danger of harm.

Calling CPS when there is a pending court case looks vindictive.

But the judge will be interested in hearing BM's unsubstantiated claims about SS's "illnesses" and DH's evidence to the contrary.  The court may not label it what it is, but they'll be thinking it, if they're smart.  That's what happened in our case.

The word "Muncausens" is too controversial, and should be avoided.

DH's petition had this wording "Third, DH alleges that BM has expressed beliefs that she and SD suffer from a variety of medical maladies."  And then DH let BM run her mouth without any proof, and he had proof otherwise.  And he won.

If you're judge isn't willing to listen, there's nothing else you can do.

 

justmakingthebest's picture

Dh is calling his commander now. He is going to ask if we should have fleet and family come do a preimptive investagation at our home. That is basically the military's CPS. We figure if we get ahead of it we might have the abitlity to shut her down. I have no problems letting anyone in my home. We have a lovely home. All my kids have their own rooms with beds and decorations and dressers full of clothes. We are clean, we have fresh food and cubbards full. There is nothing to hide so if it will help- Game on BM! 

advice.only2's picture

I don't understand why you would intentionally want to get government agencies involved in your private life.  We had CPS investigate us and it's intrusive, they talk to your children with out your consent, and getting his command involved won't look good either.   And yes I have a military background and work for the government so I know how much you don't want them involved in your private affairs.  

lieutenant_dad's picture

I don't think BM has MbP. She isn't making SS sick. She isn't (seemingly) using his "ailments" for attention for herself or to gain sympathy from others. My guess is that, outside court and your family, BM hasn't breathed a single word about SS being sick. If she had, no school or coach would take the risk of SS playing a sport. Most kids have to get physicals before they can play, and unless a doctor wants to risk their license, they won't exclude serious diseases from the record.

Just like with the accusations of abuse/neglect, she is using these ailments to alienate and punish DH. She is using everything she possibly can, and it's working unfortunately. I don't think you can nail her for MbP.

What you CAN do is something that Futuro mentioned above. Use the conflicting diagnoses to force BM to interact with DH when it comes to medical care. Force BM to make SS available for school conferences when DH is in town. Force BM to adhere to the custody agreement and sign the darned journal entry.

Remember, BM had to PROVE that DH is a danger. If he is, then she needs to explain WHY she let SS spend alone time with him less than a month ago. She needs to explain the other things, too, and the judge is likely not going to be happy that she has called them all back in front of court when he handed her EVERYTHING.

I don't know how this will play out, but I can't imagine that this judge will be happy with BM showing up proofless and not having had her attorney do the one thing he needed to: sign the darned journal entry. She may have overplayed her hand, and Podunk Attorney is throwing around wild accusations to help gain favor with the judge (and get more cash out of BM). BM is losing her grip, which means she is likely to slip up.

Thumper's picture

Here is the thing.

 The Socialworker  at the Hospital had ZERO authority tell you that you have grounds to open a case. SHE or HE is operating outside their scope of education. She didnt read medical  records, she didnt consult with Doctors, she did NOT Interview ss and she did not interview bm. 

YOUR going to do what you want to do.  

IF a Doctor thought ss was in danger he/she is required to notify cps. 

Here is another one....based on what YOU told the social worker at the hospital. SHE too is required to call cps. IF she thought ss was in danger of being at moms.  Did she?

You dont have to anwer that. ok?