Annoyed

lilnik99's picture

I don't dislike my DW 8 year old son. He is just annoying. And I know it really is how he is patented most of the time. I will give her credit as she has started to become more structured and consistent with him but it was a battle to get there. However, he still acts as though he doesn't get it. He really acts like he is 5 and not 8. I expect him to be a kid and want to have fun but know when to take direction from his mom and older sibling when it's time to relax. He cries a lot when he doesn't get his way. And honestly I'm trying to put myself back at 8. I just don't recall crying when I was told no at the moment or asked to do a chore, brush my teeth, or take a shower. I try not to engage with him much mainly because when I had the opportunity to kind of build a little bond that was disrupted by bio dad and my DW. Long story short. I coached his sports team and I figured that was a space I could try and build with him for 2 months. My schedule is rather busy so I knew this was the only team I would ever coach. I asked  my DW to allow me to have this space this one time. Explain to his Dad, I'm just trying to bond with him and just to allow me this space for 2 months. Not the rest of his life or years but for 2 months to try and start a foundation. Nope, couldn't do it. Dad would go against everything I would tell him in practice, downplayed sportsmanship and teamwork. My voice faded and that was it. Nothing to build off of and grow. He placed the cape on his Dad and I have been in the trash ever since. And his Dad is terrible, all he cares about is sports, sends no money for anything, doesn't call to talk to him unless it's about sports, could careless about anything else. It's crazy. It's just frustrating dealing with the 8 year old at times and honestly, I just don't like being around him as much. There's always going to be him asking can I have, crying about something, or talking like a baby (annoys me the most). I disengaged after the whole sports thing but im still anooyed just by how he acts and how it's handled at times. I know this was a long rant but just needed to say it so I could move forward on how to cope or a resolution with how I feel. Thanks Steptalk family! 

lilnik99's picture

*parented *annoyed

the phone typos are real. Lol. 

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Rose_Pedal's picture

Gosh I felt this so hard.
I also have an annoying SD11 (and am bio-child free) that acts similar, very immature for her age and cries about everything because she never had structure or discipline-can't be told no. These kids have no grit these days anymore.

I think it's phenomenal of you to try to make the effort to coach and attempt to build a bond with him. Most people would not do that with a rather obnoxious child. Sounds like you've done all you can and have come to a place of acceptance of what it is and always will be.

It's a tough place to be. I understand it all too well.

*Hugs*

Rags's picture

Start giving the 8yo the facts about bio dad. No money, does not call except for sport, etc..

Tell DW that she starts smacking daddy with an contempt motion every time he deviates from the CO, including missing a CS payment, or there will be dire consequences to the marriage.

Your home, your marriage, your rules. DW either participates in making those rules of she complies without participating in setting the expectations but she will enforce them or you will.  All three of them, DW, 8yo, and your DW's poor choice in failed family breeding partners abides by them. PERIOD. DOT!!!

Stop being their victim.

lilnik99's picture

You are right! I don't want to get to a place of resentment and I feel like that's where it's headed. 

ESMOD's picture

I would say that your best line of defense here is disengagement.  I don't think that you were going to have much success trying to compete head on with his dad.. in sports.. which is literally his dad's "thing".  You may be a better person than his dad... but he is his father.. and when it became a "you or him".. (asking dad to step back).. his dad was always going to win.

Now.. the problems with your SO... She should absolutely be getting Child Support for the child.. if it has been ordered.  You say the older boy does not live there.. so perhaps their arrangement is no CS because they are each primarily supporting one of their kids?  If so.. it's somewhat unfair to ding him for not paying for things in your home.. unless your wife is paying for things re the 13 yo at his home.

Please let your wife take the lead on parenting her child.. but you can absolutely get on her for not making her son respect boundaries in your home.. not being civil to you etc.. she should be holding him accountable and giving reasonable consequences for failures to maintain standards of behavior.

Now.. the crying.. the kid is 8.. and what you did at 8 may or may not be how he is.. not all kids are going to mature emotionally at exactly the same rate... and.. it does seem that kids these days are more "emotional".. for lack of a better term.  I'm GenX and all the "feels" and leaning into mental issues just wasn't a thing so much for us.  It's not as easy for me to understand when I would not have been supported the way kids are now. 

But.. he also behaves the way he does because he has been trained and allowed to by parents.. consistent and calm instruction and holding feet to the fire.. results in less drama.. but it sounds like your wife is very very hesitant to do that... 

I would be questioning her as to why she doesn't want her child to have a happy and successful life.. because she is setting him up for more struggles by her lazy parenting.

lilnik99's picture

I bring up the money because we do take on the bills for the 13 year old. Flights, gifts, etc. she is always helping out but he never asks or even tries to provide money for those things. It's a respect thing. Go half on flights, go half on gifts, I am fine with that but we are just racking up the bills. Never was trying to compete with the dad. I stay in the background. My DW begged me to coach and I thought it would be a cool way to build a little foundation towards a bond. It was a kiddie league, nothing serious and that's why I asked for the space. And the crying thing. I would never compare kids to how I was or anybody else. The issue is, it is excessive for regular things. Like throw your napkin away... it's a full on I just lost the Super Bowl cry.. that does fall back on lazy parenting and accountability being taught. 

ESMOD's picture

If you are personally subsidizing your DW's ability to pay for things for the older child when her EX does not reciprocate in any way.. then it's a wife problem.. and you are enabling this problem by giving her access to that funding.  Go with separate finances.. and then it is at least not your money.. and you ensure she pays her household obligations before the "wants".

One thing you did say is "gifts" though.. I do not in any way believe that divorced parents should pitch in together for presents for the kids.. except in the very rare occasion for some super high value item like a car on 16 birthday.  Each parent should buy their child gifts within their own budgets and NOT expect the other parent to pay for any of it.  That parent can give their own gifts.  She should not be sending her ex half the money for what he spent on 13 yo Christmas.  She should send her OWN presents.. or gift them when she celebrates Christmas. (or  birthday.. etc).  My DH's EX used to ask him to pay her for Christmas presents ... he always said NO.. he bought his own gifts for the girls. 

I'm not sure about the flights issue.. in what context is the kid flying?  I mean.. if it's a vacation for your family (with her).. she should pay for her own child's flights.. and her EX should not be paying to send his kid on vacation with his EX.. that isn't sensible.  If it's trips to see her family.. again.. that's a "her" expense.  I was kind of getting from the post that her EX and other son live local.. so I am assuming it's not for visitation.. but if it was.. the CO should dictate that.. and absent it saying anything.. I would say that parents should generally split that.. but it could also be that the person who moved would be more responsible if it came down to that.

I didn't mean that you intended to necessarily compete with the father.. but you did ask him to step back so you could bond with his son... basically.. so HE could have seen this as competition.. and it was in a area that the father is very interested in.. sports.. so while I get that mom asked you to... and that having some time with the boy could have helped improve your relationship.. it probably was not destined to be as successful given his father's area of interest..  and I guess even fathers can feel defensive and be a problem if they percieve someone trying to step in.. or in their minds "overstep".. should people be happy that the kids have more people to support them? yes.. but there can be a lot of ego and posessiveness with parents and kids.. and it obviously hit a nerve with the EX.

So the bottom line is I don't know why your DW is paying for things outside your household.. I mean.. sure.. she can buy her other son presents.. but she shouldn't be subsidizing her EX.  Depending on the flight reasons.. I don't know.  But sounds like you need to separate your finances and make her accountable with her own income.. and not force you to pay.. or not pay because you make it possible.  As for her younger son.. I would imagine that his emotional issues would come out at school and that his mom would be getting feedback from there.. I don't know that you can point out that you find it unusual or some problem without her becoming defensive.. but I would mostly try to let her manage her son and his behavior and address with her when there are lapses when they are hills to die on.

 

lilnik99's picture

The flights are visitation for him to see his Dad. We do not live local. We don't mind going half but we have been paying for all the flights and to me that makes no sense. I can get the defensive thing because he "thinks" sports is his thing but it can be other people's things as well. And I just wanted these two little months to try not anything else. I get it though. I have talked to DW but she does get defensive. I did even bring up the gifts like why does he keep asking you to go half on gifts? If he can't afford them, he does not need to buy that particular gift at that time. It was unfair to us. I don't count other peoples pockets but I've told her we can't support his home becuse he is jealous of what we can do financially. Comments have been said about our finances and for me, my hard work and income is of no concern to him. We are not asking him to keep up with us but to help with one kid the way we help with the other. 

ESMOD's picture

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by you had asked your wife to ask him"allow you that space for 2 months".. because that sounds an awfull lot like you wanted the boy's father to back of contact or being in  his life.. which honestly.. not cool..  It's not right to try to carve something out and away from his dad like that.. the kid is going to want to share his life with his dad.. his experiences.. and talking to dad about his time on the team..doesn't really undermine your ability to have had time with the boy.. and does not stop you from teaching all the kids the value of good sportsmanship.

I can't imagine most of the other stepmoms on this site would get a better reception from their DH's EX if they told their DH to ask the BM to back off so that they could bond over something like dance class or competition cheer etc..   There is nothing wrong with you wanting to coach the team.. to hoping it would improve your relationship and create some common ground with the boy.. but no way should his dad have ever been asked to "back off" or give you that time.. like not contact the kid?  

It was a bit confusing when you were talking about his dad interferring with your coaching of the kid.. I thought dad was attending the games and practices and yelling out interferrance.. which he obv could not have been doing remotely.. so I'm guessing you heard him talking to his kid and giving him a more competitive viewpoint on sports than you were hoping to get across.. 

But again.. the issue of flights.  If your DW has a court order that stipulates she pays.. then she pays.. it's not her Exes place to volunteer to pay what he isn't obligated to.

If your wife is the one that moved away from where her EX is living.. again.. I can see the flights being her responsibility if she moved beyond a quick car ride.  But.. if it's just because she feels like that your household is so much better off financially? um.. that's not really fair to you.. especially if YOU are the reason why you are doing so well.

Ultimately.. you can separate your finances.. you pay your share of JOINT costs of the house.. utilities.. groceries.. SHE pays for 100% of any child related costs.. because they are her kids.. if she wants to spend her money on flights and gifts.. that is her choice.. as long as she is paying her share of the household bills.. 

But the bottom line is that you do have control over whether she spends your money.. you can say NO. and maybe you need to start doing that?

lilnik99's picture

You read that all wrong. No one EVER asked for anyone to step away. The space was to be encouraging to his son to let another person in his life spend some time with him  in a fun and positive way. Not remove himself but to encourage and not be demeaning. That's what I've been saying the entire time. No one mentioned anyone backing off or out of their kids life. To even take it there is totally insulting. 

ESMOD's picture

I'm sorry.. it was the way you said.. that you had her ask him for space.. the guy is not local right? she doesn't have to ask his permission to let her SO be around her son.. that's ridiculous if she thinks that.  I think that it must be a language interpretation.... If someone asked me to give space.. that would sort of mean that I have to somehow "vacate" some of that space to allow it? 

I don't know.. I'm just trying to wrap my mind around why she was "asking for space".. not just saying.. Little bobby is playing Tball and John is one of his coaches.

Or were you trying to get his dad to convince him that he should like you.. give you a chance?  (I would also not expect most stepmoms on here would have gotten positive response to that kind of request either..lol).  I mean.. I really don't think there is a univers that exists where my DH's EX would have actively encouraged her daughters to get closer to me.  It is, however your wife's job to expect respect for you in your home.. to encourage her son to get to know  you etc.. unfortunately.. this is just not something that an EX is going to do well asking anyone.

and.. yes.. sad that parents can't see past their bitterness to see the benefit for their kid.. but it is what it is.

I did not mean to be insulting.. just totally did not get exactly what was being asked by your wife to her ex.. because asking for space in my head meant asking him to "make way" for you in some fashion.. though you are saying and I understand that was not your intent.

lilnik99's picture

Furthermore, it wasn't about a competitive view point, it was interference when saying, don't listen, do this or do that, they don't know what they are talking about, that person is stupid. I believe that is interference, I've coached at various levels, parents do not have to physically attend a game to be a distraction. His job is to support and not try to interrupt his child's experience with nonsense. The ask was for him to respect the space, which he chose not to do by demeaning the experience for me with his son. Respect means to not say the things mentioned above to an 8 year old. Those comments have nothing to do with being competitive at all and if you think that, it's sad. 

ESMOD's picture

When you said that his dad "downplayed sportsmanship and teamwork".. I took that as he was one of those fathers that is so "competitive.. as in winning is the ONLY thing kind of guy.. and you were trying to deliver a message that it's not all about winning or losing.. but how you play the game so to speak. 

No.. of course I don't see being competitive as telling your kid to not listen to a coach... or even to be a poor loser etc.. or to play dirty tricks. etc.. But there are people that are competitive to a fault.. as in winning is the ONLY thing.. and they may do things that aren't in the fair spirit of play.. wrong of course.. but still competitive.

To be competitive also means to be trained at a skill level to where you have a relatively decent chance of success..where you play at a similar level to others on your team and competitors teams. (why many leagues have different levels based on kid's ability).. because not everyone is competitive at the same level.

But.. I thin we are getting closer to what your issue really is with his dad.  Respect.  You feel that your wife's EX owes you respect.  and.. in a polite world people would get along.. they would be able to happily coparent with their spouse.. stepparents and Exes.. all for the common good of the kids.  But.. you know that is not how it works in most cases.  That is why most people are here because they have problems with their stepkids, the Exes.. and often also their spouses.  Stepparents often fall very short of getting adequate respect for the effort they put in.. not only from the skids.. and the EX.. but even from their own spouses.. who can't support their spouse by insisting that they are treated respectfully in the home.

Unfortunately, the person you cannot control is her EX husband.. he can call you "that big doofus" and there is probably little that you can do about it.  He can tell the kid that your baseball advice and coaching is crap.. and his kid may or may not believe it.  

But.. what you CAN expect is that your wife insist her kid act respectfully to you.  If that means the kid gets yanked from playing ball because he can't stop saying "but my dad said you are stupid".. fine.  SHE does that.  If that means that she has to step in and cut calls short when they become bash the stepdad sessions? maybe she needs to do that?

What can you do?  You can prove his dad wrong.. Because if you are there in that kids' life.. day after day.. being a decent person.. being nice to him.. showing him what a quality person is.. then it is going to be hard for him to ignore that right? That is really all you can do.. that and insist your wife step up with her kid... 

She can also tell her Ex to knock it off.. but I would bet that he will double down if he feels he has gotten a reaction.

Again.. I guess with guys.. the issue of Respect can be a big one.. and very difficult to get past.. but you are going to have to probably adjust your expectations because there is little chance you are going to get his dad to be "on your side"  While the kid is in your home.. it's your wife who should be driving the parenting bus.

lilnik99's picture

I'm not seeking his respect. For the sake of your child and him living with someone else who will have an impact in his life small or large. Respect spaces. That's it! You don't have to respect me to respect the space. It's not down talking to your son about me or his mom. Period. It's being an adult. We don't do that to him and we surely do not do it to the son he has with him. It's respect so the kids can be comfortable and not feel like they need to choose. That's it! It's not as deep as it's being made. 

ESMOD's picture

You are right.. it's sad that a parent can't be happy and supportive of someone wanting to be a positive influence on their child's life.  But, many parents have a "sense of ownership" for lack of a better way of saying it.. and when their EX has a new partner.. and that new partner appears to be wanting some bond or connection with their child.. it drives them nuts.. and with the fact that this boy is basically FT in your home.. I'm guessing his dad is probably also jealous at the fact that you have daily access to his child in a way that you don't.

And.. when people are jealous and posessive?  well.. they act like a jerk sometimes.. they say things to demean that other person.. or to make them seem "less than" to their child.. so their kid won't "like them more".

But.. while it is difficult to hear that he has said those things to the boy.. you are living in the home with him FT.. with his mother.. and have an opportunity to show that what his dad says is wrong to an extent.  I'm not saying you should be going all in to coach his teams.. but he will have a chance to see you in action.. on a day to day basis.. and it's tough to reconcile the things his dad may say with the reality of what he sees.. It's easier for him to do the PAS.. if he has full custody.. but he doesn't.. the kid is in your home (again feeding into his insecurity over his son).. 

So.. you know that you can't make his dad be a decent dude.. so you focus on the things you can change.. and can impact.. and that's how your life is run.. how much of YOUR money goes to support her kids.. if any at all.  You can insist on respectful behavior in your home.. and you can work with your wife to set rules for your home.  You can also encourage your wife to deal with issues re her sons.. if they need help.. therapy.. whatever.. to improve their lives. I'm not saying to to her and say her kid cries a lot and there must be something wrong with him.. but expressing concern for his future because he seems to get emotional over fairly small things.. and how it worries you and how you wonder if he would benefit with some help.  Because you want to see her kid live the best life he can.. 

of course.. that's if you want to pitch in like that about her kid.. but you have to be very cautious you aren't coming off as finding fault.. more that you are trying to help him be a happier person.

Her EX?  he is what he is.. he isn't going to (and doesn't have to at this point) "give you space" to build a relationship.. in his eyes? that's not something he wants you to do.. he wants his ex miserable with a dude that his kid dislikes.. just like a lot of BM's want their EX to be miserable.. to make sure their kids don't like the new partner.. very old story here.. and if we focus on the EXes.. it will drive most of us nuts.. haha

 

lilnik99's picture

I've already stepped back as that was easy to do. I'm ok with how any of this plays out as I'm not trying to be his dad. That's not my goal. I was just trying to cultivate a space that would be nice for him and his mom. I think she would like another influence on him other than his Dad. His dad is not the best person. But I'm ok stepping back. It's really not a problem. I was just simply stating the kid is annoying. Lol. And it really comes down to the way he is handled. So really the parenting is annoying. That's all I was saying. 

Harry's picture

I would never spend my money for SK to see there BD.  I would insist on DW getting BD to pay support, medical ect. She must go to court and get them involved.   DW must have your back.  I didn't not mind paying for SK .  Money wasn't a big thing with me.  But to let BF get off free is a big no.
These woman don't really hate there ex.  When my DW ex BF died. DW ask me for money to put BF to rest pay for his funeral .  Of course I see no. I would give $25 what he did send one time.  But you know where you stand 

ESMOD's picture

We do need more understanding of their actual custody order and their circumstances (the bio parents.. that is).

There are apparently 2 children that she shares with her EX.  There is an older boy that her husband has custod of.  So, it's not out of the realm of possibility that CS was not ordered based on that split arrangement.  It's also possible that if BM was the one who moved away.. and created a situation where flights were now necessary.. it is not really wrong to consider those extra costs to be her responsibility.. if she had stayed local there would be no cost (i don't know that she moved.. but the fact that she is willign to pay the flight cost it seems plausible).

I also think it's fine for his wife to want to buy gifts for her other son as well as the one she has custody of.. but not necessarly to be the one buying gifts with or on behalf of her EX.

Where the hard line is drawn is that her husband (OP).. should not be required to pay any of these costs.. that he should not have to subsidize her expenses to pay for these things.  If they must be paid by her? she should be paying them from her own money and not joint funds.

If she cannot afford that? that is an issue she has to resolve.. and one option could be her husband helping her... but he has to understand that her ex does not have to show gratitude.. and it's not "for" the ex.. it is paying money for a legal obligation his wife has.. as if he were paying her car payment (assuming these costs are legit legal obligations).

If she is just being generous because she now has access to a bigger pot of money?  that is a hard conversation with OP.. and he may have to cut off her access if she won't voluntarily agree to stop dipping into it.

If she does not have any agreement.. and there is valid reason to see her ex pay more? of course they can look into whether bringing a court action is worth it.  

CLove's picture

And there are many different flavors. I read some comments and responses, so I see that you are good with disengaging and have actually put the blame and annoyance where it belongs - the bio parents.

I wasnt going to comment because you already have gotten some fabulous advice. Just wanted to say 2 things:

1. ESMOD is one of our best commentors. She puts thought and empathy behind every comment she makes. There is no malice or accusation in anything she sais. So please do not continue to be defensive. She has the best of intentions.

2. I came into my SDs life and the youngest was 8.5. She was such a happy camper. Now shes become a Power Sulker at 16 almost 17, and IM like "where did that sweet happy kid go?" Shes off with her friends and mother a town over by the beach, thats where. I guess your SS is annoying now, but you never know...some time with our DW giving structure and consequences, and just being the sane parent might make all the difference. And YOU. I think you will have a bigger effect than you know right now. SD 16 PS quotes me back to myself. Shes doing things and exploring the world, and I like to think I was a small part of her postive growth.