Went to marriage counselling
So DH and I have started marriage counselling to deal with the unnatural relationship he has with his DD. He has agreed to try to be a husband first and put BS and I first. I truly have my doubts, but wanted to give my marriage a last chance by counselling. If after this he still doesn't live up to his part of the partnership I am gone. SD and I had one nasty letter exchange a while ago and I have been disengaged from her for quite a number of months (she is 36 in case you don't know my story). Younger SD had a birthday last week and we all went out for dinner as we usually do. Older SD at first didn't want to go if I was going but when she realized no one really cared and we would go any way she changed her mind and came out to dinner with her 3 kids. She arrived at the restaurant first so had setup the seating by being there first - this is fine because she was sitting very far away from me so I did not have to say a word to her. What really got to me though was DH's reaction to her when we arrived. She was already sitting at the table and as we prepared to sit down he kept looking at her and said, "my, don't you look pretty tonight", like a star struck teenage, barf. It really is sickening and so wrong in every way. A few minutes later, DH realized what he did and then turned to me and said, Oh and YOU look very pretty tonight too. A little too late for that blunder. I even said to DH at the counsellor's office that he wants his DD in my body....or something like that. He laughed and said I was ridiculous but made him think about it. Today he was getting ready to go away for 3 weeks and he wanted to rush over to SD's to get a few pictures of Gkids to show some friends while he away. I said, do you have any pics of your son to show???? Our BS? No he didn't, well that HURT alot. I told him I couldn't believe all he cares about is his gkids and doesn't even consider our son. What an asshole.... I really don't think there is much hope for DH - he is so far up DD's ass he'll never find his way back out. 
Buy him a tent a flashlight
Buy him a tent a flashlight and tell him he may as well actually camp out in her sphincter.
LOL - Good one. Thanks I
LOL - Good one. Thanks I needed a laugh
I'm very sorry dear heart. I
I'm very sorry dear heart. I know it hurts. One time, years ago, my ex-dh asked me to get some pictures of his grandchildren around for him. When I asked why he said because some co-workers of his had asked to see photos.
This was after - years before that - he got bitten by the "religious bug" and stopped carrying pictures of our children in his wallet because he considered it "unchristian." (I'm NOT knocking religion here - just saying that my ex-dh went way off the deep end). So...nobody had ever been shown photos of our little ones but off he goes with photos of his grandbrats. VERY hurtful.
I will keep my fingers crossed for you that the counseling helps.
I have a question for you: does he fawn over your sd2 like he does sd1? Or is it just the first one?
Hi ownedbypedro, funny thing
Hi ownedbypedro, funny thing is DH and younger SD are practically estranged. They only see each other 2-3 times a year for a couple of hours. Younger SD is 29 years old and still lives with BM. There was a lot of PAS on the BM's part with this SD. Younger SD and I have no relationship either - mostly due to her and Dh's estrangement. Younger SD looks a lot like BM and DH really despises his exwife. Older SD - mini wife - looks more like DH - huh go figure.
Do you think your SD's looks
Do you think your SD's looks merit the admiration that DH is giving to her? Attractiveness is in the eyes of the beholder. So actaully he was telling himself HE is good looking by telling SD, who looks like him, that SHE is good looking. I guess that's the ultimate compliment a narcissist can give themself. LOL Everyone has a different opinion of what beauty is. My DH once accused all the women in his family of being jealous of SD. If you could see SD you would know there is no reason to be jealous of her. The women in his family and I were insulted because SD tends to treat all women as if they are invisible and just communicate with the men. I am insulted by OCC's comments, find them uncalled for, and will flag the ones that are offensive.
good idea and yes they are
good idea and yes they are intrusive.
I was thinking the same
I was thinking the same thing. Leaving in a huff like that would make SD's day for a long long time. She would relish in that moment and relive it to make herself feel superior. I just don't plan to be in DH and SD's company at the same time again - problem solved. He can woon all he wants - I just don't want to witness it again. Thanks for your help and thoughts.
He has a long way to go,
He has a long way to go, doesn't he? This really DOES sound like emotional incest! I mean he's completely gaga over his daughter to an extent that is just plain creepy. Anyone would have been hurt that he wanted to show off pictures of the Gkids but did not have one of his own son. He isn't upholding his part of the agreement to place your marraige and BS first. It would truly be sad if BS found out about this. I agree with smdh. Buy him a tent.
He may have grown up in an
He may have grown up in an unhealthy environment where looks gave you worth (I did). My DH would never do this with his daughter (26 y/o), it's pushing boundaries. Why in the heck did he say "oh and you look nice too"- that makes it worse. It puts the spotlight on you as if everyone knows she is your competition. Very unhealthy. If I say anything about SD looks (e.g. she looks pretty) my DH looks uncomfortable b/c looks was not what was promoted at all in his family. I would feel pretty uncomfortable with the way he is acting around her.
That would have been really
That would have been really embarrassing for you, and the way he did it made it obvious to everyone else that he was appeasing you, no doubt that incident was not lost on SD. I will never understand how these grown men can be so openly incestuous with their daughters, and even though it is not physical, it is emotional incest and is every bit as damaging to their daughters and to their relationships with their wives.
The fact that he wanted to rush over to his daughter's to get some photos of the grandkids while not having any of his son has two problems, one: Surely he had photos at home of his grandkids that would be suitable for him to take, so he was just making yet another excuse to see SD and more importantly, if your son ever found this out it would be emotionally damaging for him.
My husband always carried a photo of his daughter in his wallet, yet he never had room in his wallet for his two sons. Disgusting. One time when his daughter was her, he opened his wallet and said, LOOK, and showed her that in his wallet was a photo of HER, his daughter, not his sons, not his grandson, and certainly not his wife. Is it any wonder we are all emotionally damaged by these men to the point we almost have nervous breakdowns and some of us actually do. Stupid, stupid men.
If it can be any comfort to
If it can be any comfort to you at all, you have really been trying to make this marriage work despite this problem with your husband and his ill relationship with this daughter. If, in the end, you end up leaving him, at least you can the peace of mind that you did everything you could, this problem is ultimately on him.
That is exactly where I am at
That is exactly where I am at - giving it one last kick at the can. DH is very much a follower especially with his relationship with his DD. I am trying to give him a chance to undo some of the damage over the past few years. So far, I really don't see much progress except that he has stopped getting angry at me for disengaging. I am having a difficult time coming to terms with this reality and it hurts. BS is away at a therapeutic boarding school to try to help him with some of the problems he has been having so he was NOT aware of DH's neglect at having a picture of him to take. Thank god for that - that would have been terribly damaging to him. I think a lot of our BS problems stem from him knowing his dad cares more about SD and her kids than him. DH denies it, but it is soo obvious to everyone, including our son. Feeling really sad today.
Oh god much though it would
Oh god much though it would hurt and make me :sick: , I think you ought to bring that comment about you at the restaurant up in the counseling because, as EBU said, it would reveal to SD that he thought you thought you were in competition for his sexual interest and this is intolerable. He has got to come up with an explanation of why he did that and really really learn never ever to do such a thing to you again, and the only way to do it I think from his pov is for him to be forced to examine his brain there with expert help.
Good luck with this, I think that he was making a first baby step to trying to make things right there but it resulted in abject failure becuase he just did not have the emotional tools at the time. Maybe he can learn to use them.
yup, she sure is a jealous
yup, she sure is a jealous old cow, isn't she? there is nothing wrong with her dh acting like that toward his daughter, as long as he doens't act on it, right? :sick:
i suppose you think a woman who is nauseated to find out her dh is a pedophile is "jealous" of 10 year old girls, too. you really are sick. instead of acting like dr phil on crack on this site all the time, YOU are the one who should be getting serious help. i highly doubt you are even married.
Well OCC that is precisely
Well OCC that is precisely why I am going to counselling with DH - to try to sorth this mess out. I don't know if BS would be better or worse off if we divorced to be honest. If he doesn't feel loved or wanted - does he really need that in his face evey day???? Of course now that BS's problems escalated to the point they are at, DH cries over him and misses him. I think a lot of that is guilt myself. Only time will tell if we can work this mess out.
Oh and OCC, whether or not DH
Oh and OCC, whether or not DH had our son to "please" me is irrelevant. He needs to man up and start being a loving father to a young growing boy instead of drooling over his 36 year old DD.
You think it's ok for spouses
You think it's ok for spouses to stay in a marriage if, according to you, the guy wants to sleep with his own daughter, who is sister to his son, FOR THE SAKE OF THE SON? Surely the son needs to see both his parents and his sister follow emotionally successful lives, even if that means by separation OCC. There are no unwounded people in a family that does not prevent sexual closeness between a parent and a child. Personally, I do not have your feeling that the father is replacing his interest in his ex by suddenly becoming attracted to his nearly middle-aged daughter. And I don't think you have any evidence for saying that this man had a kid just to please 20Y, but perhaps you know more of her history and blogs than I do. I think that second comment is unwarrantedly nasty and should be withdrawn.
this isn't the first time he
this isn't the first time he has suggested it's ok for grown men to be attracted to their daughters. a while back, he said it was perfectly natural for a man to look at an 11 year old's exposed crotch and that as long as he eventually looked away, it was ok. he is clearly sexist, twisted, and shows (to me at least) signs of pedophilia in his whacked comments about dads and daughters and men and girls in general.
don't expect an answer. he never answers to his ridiculous and psychotic comments. i have an idea about exactly what kind of person he is. (lives in moms basement, and we will leave it at that, i think you can guess the rest.)
http://www.steptalk.org/node/
http://www.steptalk.org/node/68189
ewwww. Looking at an 11 year
ewwww. Looking at an 11 year old's crotch is OK according to OCC? I think i am going to :sick:
I don't think that just
I don't think that just because he thinks his daughter is pretty or he admires how she looks, this means he is sexually attracted to her. If she is pretty, she came from him, he may be in awe of how he managed to produce such a nice looking person lol.
Yeah in awe. Like he wants to
Yeah in awe. Like he wants to crawl into her skin and live through her and her thoughts. It is beyond weird in my opinion.
Like he wishes he was her DH instead of her dad.
I guess it is gone. I wonder
I guess it is gone. I wonder if he deleted or the moderators did. That is just so inappropriate.
I was going back over some of my recent posts to copy some stuff for our next counselor appt next week. DH is struggling and I don't really know if he can man up and be husband and father to our young (14) BS first and foremost. SD was at our guest cottage for vacation last week and started complaining to a good friend of mine about me in the street (they happened to bump into each other). She complained about the cottage too - bottom line - not good enough for princess. Well I have a solution - dont' go!!! Just don't understand the stupidity of her at all. As well, I was never consulted on her using the guest cottage - DH and her discussed and he gave her the keys. Very disrespectful of DH to do this behind my back.
Am glad to hear you are
Am glad to hear you are having couples counselling and that DH went with you.
Not glad to hear your DH is STILL doing things behind your back though. I would be LIVID. Urgh, not to mention your grown sd is not adult enough to realise how classless it is to badmouth your family to random people, criticise free hand outs (your cottage). Seriously I am with you. If its NOT good enough, then she can F off I say.
What is it with family who think that because they are related by blood to our OH's they can use OUR things and badmouth us? My SIL would do this. She would always want lifts, loved to ride in our car (when we had our convertible) and yet two minutes before had been calling ME a bitch. She would also throw a fit if DH was unable to give her a lift because he was picking me up from work...she would tell DH to make "her" (me) wait. Shit. The ONLY reason we could afford the bloody car was because of MY salary. However my DH was so sick of his twisted sister and her demented logic he told her to do one and that was one of the last things he EVER did for her. Now we dont speak to the psycho witch anymore (I LOVE the peace and earned it from the years of abuse).
How many sets of keys do you have to this cottage? Well gather them all up and keep them in YOUR possession and do not tell DH where they are. Then change the locks (just in case your sd has made a spare...wouldnt be surprised) without telling anyone and keep those too. If he cant be trusted then he doesnt get to BE trusted. Sounds a bit over controlling I know, however lets look at it this way. Regardless of the fact your DH IS going to struggle with changing his ingrained learnt behaviour, meaning he is going to fall at the hurdle at times, it doesnt mean you have to like it or continue to put up with it, ESPECIALLY when you have an adult relative using and abusing you like sd. I don't CARE if she is his daughter, this doesnt give her the right to have access to joint things considering she is unable to behave when it comes to you. IMO everyone on this planet has to earn the right to have access to things they do not belong to, so when it comes to relatives allowing you to use family holiday properties, that means you don't slag the one of the owners off or that property.
In this instance, I would wait for the counselling session and tell your DH that you have changed the locks (do it just in case sd/DH has spares) because your sd has lost your trust, respect and right to use the things that belong to you too. That the keys to the property will be in your possession alone, that seeing as you cannot trust DH when it comes to sd you will fear the worse until he can prove to you he deserves to be trusted and respected again. Your DH has to realise that in effect this is the manner he has been treating YOU like. Sneaking behind your back, controlling you by omitting information, colluding with his DD.
If HE refuses to respect you then treat him in the same manner. If he has a problem with that then suggest he buys you out of the cottage so that you can buy your own holiday home, where you have the right to control who enters and who does not. Remind him this situation is a consequence of HIS and SD's actions, not yours. Oh and don't buy the BS of "this is the reason I lie to you...because of your extreme reaction..." the reason you react the way you do IS BECAUSE you are lied to and as DH does NOT respect your RIGHT to refuse his DD things. Well time YOU refuse to RESPECT HIS opinion and decision making, and have lied by omission about changing the locks ....after all arent THOSE the rules you are ALL playing by now?
I hope counseling can improve
I hope counseling can improve things for you.
I think it is great that he wants to be an involved granddad but the way he's doing it now is not working. He can and should be an involved granddad without pushing bs to the sidelines. Why can't he carry pictures of ALL the kids, including bs? Why can't he carve out time to call bs at school, or a few hours for father-son time when bs is home?
I also think that it's ok for a dad to tell his daughter she looks beautiful. But I think it was the straw that broke the camel's back to hear him compliment someone who consistently treats you like $hit. I think you should tell DH you don't have a problem with him wanting to be an involved grandfather or saying nice things to his DD. You have a problem with him pushing bs to the side. He needs to find a balance that works for ALL the kids involved, including bs. And you don't have a problem with him complimenting his DD. You have a problem with him not doing anything about her treating you like $hit. And that if he would try to make things fair for ALL the kids, and not tolerate SDs treating you like $hit, you'd be a much happier camper.
I can't imagine what you're feeling right now but (((HUGS)))