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Hard for me to empathize although I do sympathize with you all!!!

Nise's picture

I KNOW that I’m gonna get some serious flack for this…and my intent is not to put any kind of division in the forum b/c I am truly grateful for and appreciate ALL of your perspectives and opinions…they are what get me through the day most days!!! But I’ve been wondering this for a while now (ever since there was a thread a while back about it in which half of the group indicated that this was their situation) and I just have to ask…is there a different dynamic/expectation level when we are talking about marriages that began as adulterous affairs? I hate to even make any distinctions but I even seen a smidge of difference when the couple is living apart and going through a divorce (paper work just not complete yet but both know it is over) vs. when there is an affair….this is my first marriage and so I can only see I through one set of lenses…I guess my question is what do we/you expect when you “come into” your marriage this way…my dad and stepmom (I ADORE them BOTH and I think you all know that!) started as an affair…it was a LONG ROAD TO HOE…and in a way I feel like whatever she went through…she definitely asked for it! She has since apologized to my mother for being my dad’s mistress and they (she and my mom) have a GREAT relationship…but from the kids perspective…there are things that she would say that would piss my younger brother off like… “Oh, I was going to go to that even with you and your dad…” and my brother will feel a cringe like… “HELLO LADY…my dad and mom were still together when my dad took me to that event!!!” She doesn’t even realize that she does/says little stuff that set him/us off and we are all grown now (10+ years have passed)…So I guess my point is…we well I don’t know what my point is…just a rant really but…as a wife…it is REALLY hard for me to “get it” when we are talking about adultery…OKAY…you can all Tar and Feather me now!!! Just promise that you’ll still be my friends afterwards!! *SMILE*

Comments

Allyceson's picture

My relationship with my husband didn't start until after the divorce had been filed and they were living in separate homes, so I can totally see your point Nise. I don't think it's logical to expect the same respect if your relationship started as an affair with the ex's husband. Not that most of us get respect from biomom anyway, but we do have the right to expect some, whether she gives it willingly or not. If you've slept with biomom's hubby before they separated, I can't imagine what would give you the opinion that she has to respect you because you're part of the picture now.
I can also sympathize with the ladies out there dealing with this. It's not right, but doesn't automatically make them "bad" people, either. Just someone who's made a pretty big error in judgement. Sometimes it seems as though they get the "husband stealer" wrap. The guys are just as accountable, if not more so. They're the ones having the affair, then going home to the wife. But how many of these wives are willing to take the hubby back, some even beg for him to come back, then act as though the mistress deserves to die?
It makes me want to vomit when I hear the "he's just a guy" excuse.
I wouldn't want to be the mistress and have to deal with that label for the rest of our relationship. I have a hard enough time getting people to see me as something other than the interloping second wife as it is.

StressedSM's picture

Being a Stepmom is hard nonetheless, getting respect and courtesy and trying to "work with" the BM in all of the challenges of raising the kids, going to events, holidays is pretty tough. If it started out as an affair, I think the road to travel is much harder, and much longer. A lot of the issues would be the same, but obviously, some not so much. I am a SM and also a BM. My ex-husband is remarried and I am also an "ex-wife". When they first got together, I didn't want anything to with her, I didn't want see her, and the though of meeting her made me ill. I'm not sure why. Maybe partially becuase of the EX-H, but mainly becuase they are my kids that she is spending time with. She also had nothing to do with my marriage dissolving and I still had a little grudge. A little jealously. But I moved on, got over it, and now I like her. We aren't friends by a long stretch, but I can speak to her in a civil manner and we chat and get along fine. I actually like her more than I like my ex. On the other hand, I dread seeing my husband's ex.

bubbles's picture

It seems as if this started initially becuase of my post earlier. I don't expect my hubby's ex to embrace me. I just feel that her feelings are her feelings and she shouldn't impose those feelings on her kids. That's an issue amongst herself, my husband and me. She can hate me all she wants, but will she ever see that I have never hurt her boys or been mean in anyway. I am caring, loving and understanding towards them. Maybe I can't expect that becuase of how our relationship started. I feel a little uneasy about the comments posted, but at the same time, even though i already knew the feelings from the other side, its a blow hearing it from strangers. Sorry...

Allyceson's picture

The comments were not directed at you. Smile Every situation is different. The ex probably doesn't believe that you wouldn't hurt her kids because in her mind you've already hurt them by breaking up their family. I'm not saying that's the case. I know that there wouldn't have been an affair if there weren't already issues in the marriage. I do think that you'll probably have to just make the best of a bad situation, as I think the ex would have to be a really big person to want to see you anywhere around her kids, regardless of whether or not you're nice to them.
Please don't feel judged. I have people close to me who have had affairs and it's usually out of loneliness and frustration, which lead to things getting handled in the worst way possible- not because they're awful people.

StressedSM's picture

Not my intention at all if I hurt your feelings. I would NEVER judge anyone. I have made many mistakes in my life. Many. And I do believe that sometimes things just happen. Fate, destiny, I believe in that. Maybe this was destined to be your path. The only point I was trying to make was that it should be expected that your path would be harder than some. Not that it was right or wrong. It just was.

NOW, that doesn't mean that everyone, including the EX should do anything other than what is best for the kids, including attempting to blend the families and blur the lines of separation. They should be allowed to feel like your kids are their step brothers and sisters. She can hate you, but she also needs to step up and do what is right for the sake and sanity of all involved.

I wish you the best of luck and have my fingers crossed for you that things will improve!

hopeful's picture

I take it that I must be the half of the couple referred to as just about divorced but the paper work isn't signed yet but they both know it's over....I will share my comments.

I don't know if the expectations are different if a relationship starts as an affair because I have never been in that situation. However, I do know that many couples who are co-habitating have relationships that I would classify for me as less than a marriage. My husband was in a marriage like this and his wife did have an affair on him. So in the end he was hurt and she moved on with someone else. Would it have been better for them to stay together unhappy? Happy, fulfilled people who love their spouses don't need to have affairs. So if one of the partners did have an affair in that situation and this resulted in separation and remarriage with the new partner... perhaps that is what was meant to be. I don't know....I only know that I hope in the end both people can create happiness in their own lives...everyone has the power to do this if they choose to do so!

Constant arguing, hassles over exs, etc. for me just doesn't work as a marriage. That is what led to separate dwellings. I did not want any of our teens to see that unfold or to view that as normal. In the end, we probably should have waited until our children were older...I don't think in hindsight that it was a fair decision for them to be thrown together in one house as teens with different backgrounds and expectations. That was our choice, not theres. In the end, I am pleased with my decision to get my own place and see what happens. Everyone has to do what is right for them to be happy!
I do know that statistics for divorce in second marriages is very high because of all of the issues discussed on this excellent website and I will do everything that I can not to be a statistic, but most of all I want to be happy, along with my spouse and our children, whether that be separate or apart. Life is just to short to be fighting and disagreeing all of the time. I don't see the end for us at this point at all...in fact this is a huge learning curve and I am having to learn about new experiences and new ways of communication as well. It is not all about the husbands or the exs...sometimes it is about what we need to do to change and grow.

skye22's picture

I think that this is a touchy subject. And I don't think that anyone is trying to make you feel bad. It is what it is. But I can say as a wife and a mother the thought of my husband leaving me for another woman makes my skin crawl. But even worse is "her" helping to raise my children. I wonder if this type of situation could change me into the wicked BIOMOM that we all hate! But I also have a friend in the exact same situation that you are talking about. He was married and she was his mistress for 5 years before he finally left the wife to be with her. They even had a daughter together in the meantime that the wife was helping to raise on his weekend visits. What a mess! Well to make a long story short, I love my friend, she is a great mom and person. She made some bad choices which we all do. But she truly loves this man with all her heart. And they seemed very happy together... until last week my husband confided in me that while he was having a few beers with the guy in our backyard, the guy told him about a high school sweet heart he has started seeing again... but not to tell anyone. Well the guy is my husband cousin and the girl has become on of my best friends. I want to tell. Any idea what I should do?????? But back to my point. BUBBLES... these type of men don't change! ANd more than likley he will do it to you too! Just my opinion.....

happy mom's picture

That's an interesting question. My husband and I started our relationship when he was in a middle of a divorce. I'm sure ex wife was even more pissed off when she found out he was w/me. I know she hates my guts even though we say HI to each other when we see each other. I never even thought about if there was a difference in the treatment I get from ex wife and also my inlaws....until I read your blog. I'm lucky to say that my inlaws are great towards me. If anything they might have judged my husband and not me in the past. But I say no matter what, bad treatment you get from ex is expected no matter what the reason of the separation was.

-happy mom

happy's picture

My mom was with a man I basically considered my dad from the time I was 6 to 23.. And even though I was an adult I was very angry with the new woman.. I was very civil to her even though I blamed it totally on her. But after about a year. I relized #1 if I want him to be a part of my life still I have to accept the fact, #2 it was not her fault totally, my mom and him did not have a great relationship and he says that she got really weird after I moved out at 18. There are 4 kids and I am the baby. I seen things after the fact, like my mom was not always very nice to him, I mean he would no sooner walk thru the door and she was going off about something.
His now wife (mistress) I blame her in the fact that if she liked him great, she could have waited to see him till after there separation. I must also comment my mom and him never married..
Today I still see him and his wife and I am ok with things. Both parties involved are very happy now.
Although I was not happy with the situation it really was not about me.. As SK get older they will realize that when parents separate yes at the time the kids are hurting. but later on they should realize that life is to short.. Life is about being happy and learning from your mistakes.. We all make mistakes. I can relate to a childs point of view on this subject not a ex-wifes.. But looking at the big picture, if you are married and your husband gets a mistress then something is wrong at home.. The perfect marriage is fake. I am married for the 2nd time and neither one of us were still married.. It takes two people to end a marriage.. And two people to make a marriage. I love my husband very much, and know that if I keep him happy at home in all aspects why would he stray away. He would have no reason too.
I have heard other men talk about what sucks in there marriage,,, and its always a lack of interest in the bedroom. Lets face it no matter what anyone says if the bedroom is HOT your relationship will be HOT..
So my point is that for all the kids who are involved whether it happened in an affair or not the bio parents need to make it as civil as possible for the kids. They are who is most important.. The parent who got hurt needs to pick there life back up and move on.. Keep on living. Let go of the past and move on..
We go back too "LIFE IS TO SHORT"...

Nise's picture

Sorry happy but I don’t agree with you regarding sex…a hot bedroom does not always make for a great marriage…it HAS to be more than that! What really showed me this was when my friends stepdad got testicular cancer…her mom told her…your stepdad and I haven’t had sex in almost two years…but their relationship is still STRONG and they are learning to redefine “sex” in a way that may not be HOT per say but is about the emotional bond…don’t get me wrong…no one likes to be bored, but I want 60+ years with my husband and for any marriage to get to that benchmark…you have to stay committed to the commitment…regardless of what comes, be it gained weight, lack of sex drive, or terminal illness…

happy's picture

I agree with you.
I did not mean for that to come across that way. I was just stating a fact of most men go looking for that because they are not happy with there situation in that department.. I am not saying all, I am saying most.
Please do not take offense to my comment...
Commitment is huge and it takes all aspects of commitment.. Unconditional love.. I agree..
I hope I did not offend anyone..

Nise's picture

I rarely get offended at any ones comments…as a matter of fact…I’ve NEVER been offended by anything anyone has said and I PRAY that I never offend anyone…we are all just here to get perspectives different from our own…PLEASE don't walk on egg shells around me...I can come accross a big "brash" at times...not my intention..i'm just kinda blunt! So if I ever offend YOU or anyone else in the future...PLEASE ACCEPT MY APOLOGY NOW!!!!! *BIG SMILE*

Nise's picture

I’m also a Liberal Arts major…I’ve spent the last 8 years begin taught how to “formulate an opinion, make my point and defend my argument through sound debate” …I’m CONSTANTLY cleaning up “little messes” from that type of “formal reasoning” spilling over into other areas of my life…my family and friends know me and forgive me…my husband is also learning that it never comes from a bad place, I hope you ladies do to…

happy's picture

My one friend from childhood is very blunt and to the point and there have been times where she has hurt our other friends feelings but she was right and just did not beat around the bush..
I have since started to be that way.
So no offense and keep it up.. More people should be blunt and to the point I think..

loo's picture

Interesting thought. My partner & I had a 2.5 year affair and he has two teenage daughters, I have a 7 year old daughter and 5 year old son. One of the reason I fell for him was the way he admired my parenting skills, wished hiw own daughters could have been brought up like my children are, their mother was too mad and selfish etc etc. Now, three years later we are together and one stepdaughter has been living with us for three months. I am beginning to doubt it was all his ex-wife's fault. He just is incapable of disciplining his own children. The elder SD (20) who is with us is incredible lazy, selfish and greedy. I have a great relationship with her and he is very gretaful to me for encouraging her to get her degree, find summer work, etc. I work full-time and think she should do more than lie in bed all day (dreaded summer holidays) then moan that there is no food, she's bored etc. It drives me mad, I'm exhauster, am ratty with my own children and now dreading Xmas because his younger daughter, who is unbeleivable manipulative and creates terrible atmospeheres will be with us. Both of his daughters are bulimic, the younger also anorexic. I have tried my heart out to open his eyes to their need for boundaries, reassurance, firm home life etc. I have great relationships with them both; they talk to me very openly and I think that is amazing considering I effectively wrecked their lives (well, you know what I mean). I just feel that he is expecting too much of me. The only ambition I ever has was for us to get on - a wise person said that's the best expectation for steps. Now it feels as though I am the only one who can see how they are manipulating him (and me), how very much they need him to listen to them and hear what he says and how vital a solid set of expectations/rules etc are for anything approaching 'normal' family life. The thought of attempting a Christmas involving several different people insiting on making their own food, along with the expectation of explaining this odd behaviour to my young children (let alone the message it will send to my young daughter)is making me very fed up. He thinks their behaviour is hysterical nonsense and it doesn't matter. I do. Am I Mad?????

Nise's picture

It sounds to me like he needs a serious reality check! Anorexia and Bulimia are hardly nonsense….his daughters could DIE…if that is not a wake up call that something is wrong, I don’t know what it would take….is their a professional counselor involved who could get him to see that things need to change? If not, that is definitely a first step…

Make a GREAT Day!

sosmomof6's picture

I've always felt that if a relationship ends between BF and BM, then sad as it may be, it should be accepted on some level. If there's an affair involved, either during, after or before, it does add some dynamic. But I think ultimately it's not the issues of the affair that plays the BIGGEST problem, it's what happens between the adults involved afterwards. If a woman can be mature about things, then even if she was adulterous, I could look past that. Now, when she's NOT mature about things....well, that's a different story! Wink

Take care!

Nise's picture

When I read this post of sosmomof6 I had to go back to the original posting to see what she was referring to b/c this topic is from a while ago (I did that too…went back and read ALL the topics that were discussed before I joined the board *smile*) and when I saw that it was my thread, I wanted to re-read what I had written…now…when I did I saw a familiar line which was “I hate to even make any distinctions but I even seen a smidge of difference when the couple is living apart and going through a divorce (paper work just not complete yet but both know it is over) vs. when there is an affair….” And I said…I just read that somewhere and I had to think back, then I remembered that it was something you said to me and you said that when I said this you knew I was referring to you…so I scrolled down in this thread and saw a comment from you where you also said that this line must be referring to you…well I didn’t catch it then I suppose but…it was not referring to you….I was actually thinking about my husband’s cousin who was living in our basement at the time b/c he was going through a divorce (which STILL is not final and wont be until early next year, but he has gotten an apartment and is doing really well…he’s a great guy but N-E-WAYZ…) and was dating a lady…she is “technically” an “affair” and it is “adultery” but I was making that distinction b/c although he is not yet divorced (but plans to be soon) he and his wife haven’t lived together in over a year and a half and I was saying that this is different from when a husband is still under the same roof and tipping out on an unsuspecting wife….so….all that to say, I was not directing that comment toward you… :O}

Make a GREAT Day!

hopeful's picture

Thanks for clarifying that. I remember that comment well. It did kind of grate me at the time, especially when I signed on here it was a very vulnerable time for me. There actually have been a few references made to my living arrangement on here but that doesn't really bother me. Each person has to be happy where there are at in life...whatever works for them. But thanks for clarifying....I appreciate you taking the time to do that.