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Getting the skids back on OUR schedule and routine?

emma5678's picture

I don't know how to easily get my SO's two sons (8 and 10) back on our schedule and routine after returning from their grandparents house (SO's parents). They have been with the grandparents for 6 weeks now, and will be back in the middle of next week. The grandparents will probably be staying for at least a couple of days before they head back home, and their rules and structure is completely different than when the kids are with us.

I will be watching them while SO works until they go back to school after labor day. Some of the differences in rules that the grandparents follow (and what they had the kids do while they were down here 6-7 weeks ago are as follows):

Allowing older son to go to the mailbox on the street to get the mail/take the trash can out to the curb. we don't allow this because the end of the driveway is hard to see from the porch as it is a hill and tree branches hang in the way... don't want them doing this because the more they are allowed to do something, the more likely they are to do it when noone is outside watching + it isn't like it is just 10 feet away.

Allowing the kids to get snacks throughout the day, possibly without asking/limiting the amount they eat..... we don't allow this because the older son will eat and eat and make himself sick and then eat some more, and then won't eat dinner. The younger (autistic) son will eat snacks, and then not touch his dinner at all (kind of a picky eater and is slow to chew foods to begin with) We let them snack after dinner if they eat all their dinner/were good all day. If they are hungry again before dinner they can have another healthy lunch.

Letting the kids run in and out of the house and don't care if they slam the door... while here, they didn't make sure the front door actually closed and I came out the front door wide open letting flys in and the A/C out..... we want them to learn to close the door easily and make sure it is shut, if they slam it, they don't go outside for a while. No in and out every couple minutes either.

We informed the grandparents that the kids aren't to have disposable water bottles outside.... well the grandparents didn't care about this at all and starting giving the kids waterbottles every day..... when the kids have bottles outside, they lose the tops and leave the tops/bottles just laying around.

Having "special" drinks just because they earned enough "points." --- very unclear, they could earn a point from picking up a pile of branches or get a point just for checking for empty cans in the kitchen, even if their are none, or just being nice...... we only let them have special drinks with dinner/after dinner- just like the snacks.

Going to bed at 8:15-8:30 every night... I understand it is summer and they can stay up later, but they haven't been going to bed until after 9 every night. They need to get used to going to bed earlier again for school... they will be getting up at 6 every morning to get to before school daycare at 6:30 every morning... they are both terrors when they don't get enough sleep.

 

These are mostly things that they have been doing before I even entered the picture, my SO's rules. The only rules that are new are the house specific ones (lived in an apartment before).

another rule: they have to wait until i am awake to go outside, not asking before lunch .... don't want kids outside when no adults are here/awake

 

Some new rules that they don't know about because it wasn't an issue before they left for the summer: not to get near the pool/ SO needs to be home before they can get in because it is an inflatable pool and it is very easy to get the water to spill out if you put a little bit of pressure on the side.... grandparents probably don't know this/that it would be an issue (we didn't either until I layed a hose on the one part to drain a little bit of water and it just started spilling out, ruining the ground underneath and then we had to build it back up).

Not to use the new back steps off the dining room that we just built --- the door is a pain to close... even SO and I think we have it shut and then a couple minutes later it pops back open... we need to fix the door before they can use it, and even then it will be limited so that they don't drag mud/dirt into the dining room carpet (front door has a hard floor walkway, plus a small rug).

 

I know it may seem like a lot of rules, but they were following these rules pretty good before the grandparents showed up. Some they have had for many years. I just remember last year when they got back from the grandparents, they kept brining up "grandparents rules" like their rules were more important than their own father's rules. It took them 1-2 months to get back to our rules. 

Comments

StepMamaBear6's picture

Do you live in an unsafe neighborhood?  I let me 10 year old (now 11) ride her bike to her friends and play outside without an adult ALL the time.  Is there a reason why your non-special needs child can't do child appropriate activities like play outside alone or go to the mailbox (even out of sight) alone?

Slamming doors is annoying, but they are kids.  Not sure I would punish the kids if the door slammed too hard.  It happens.

If you don't have disposable water bottles in the house, they won't be using them and leaving them outside.  It shouldn't have to be a rule.  If you do have them, and they use them, and leave them outside, make them go pick them up.  Kids should be encouraged to drink water.

If you don't have a point system to award them special drinks, then they won't be earning them.  Not a big deal.

If they aren't in school, 9 pm seems totally reasonable for an 8 and 10 year old.  If they are in school, and have to get up at 6 am, 8:15 seems a perfect bedtime. 

They can't go outside before lunch?  Why?  Do you sleep until lunch time?

Everyone gets to parent how they want.  I choose the path of having a routine but not a lot of rules.  My kids get up at a certain time, eat at a certain time, go to school (if they are school aged) at a certain time, do homework at a certain time, and go to bed at a certain time, but the rest of the day is generally more relaxed.  Children like structure.  But structure is different than arbitrary, somewhat odd rules.

emma5678's picture

It is a safe area, but my SO lived in a very unsafe apartment prior to this, so he is still adjusting. Plus, if the 10 YO went outside alone, the 8 year old would be whining and angry the whole time because he couldn't go too, or he would just go out anyway. He is also legally blind. The older son also gets bored being outside alone.

Their BM is the issue. If you go back in my post history, she took them out of school and tried moving them to TN without even a word to their father. She also tried to kidnap her other older son after she lost custody of him. Don't want that happening on my watch.

The door slams almost everytime they come in or out. They aren't going to learn to not slam them if there isn't any consequences. I grew up with some people who still slam doors as adults because they never learned.

My SO buys water to take to work, he is also picky and won't even try the well water to see if he likes it. He won't drink anything but bottled at this point. I wish he would, a lot of wasted money on water every month. The kids drink the well water, and have reusable water bottles that they are to keep track of outside. Gparents didn't want to deal with that though? I don't know.

I said that during the summer, it is fine if they stay up later, but they need to start getting used to going to bed earlier again before the first day of school. When I was a kid, this started 1 - 1.5 weeks before school started. Hard to go from staying up til 10 to 8:15 in 1 night.

They can't go outside before lunch because I work from home. I get up earlier than noon, but I would like a couple hours to work without having to worry about looking out the window every once in a while to make sure they aren't hurt/aren't physically fighting/near or in the pool.

Livingoutloud's picture

Some of the rules and expectations are a bit strange. 9pm bedtime in the summer is no big deal. Not asking to go outside before lunch??? Why? If you don’t work and watch them all day why can’t you be up with them? I could see not going outside before having breakfast. But lunch? Do you sleep in every day? 

Grandparents tend to spoil. It’s not unusual. 

emma5678's picture

"Not asking to go outside before lunch??? Why?"

 

Um, maybe because I work from home and would like a couple hours to not have to worry about watching them to make sure they don't get into trouble outside. One day, when I was watching them, they were all the way over in the neighbor's driveway, playing on the retaining wall.

Who said I never worked? Theres a thing called working from home. Read my other comment about my other "strange" rules... which aren't only my rules, they are their father's rules too. Some of which, he had before meeting me.

fourbrats's picture

are not age appropriate for the 10 year old or healthy rules for the kids. For example, a 10 year old should be able to follow the rules and only go out to get the mail and things when asked to. The snacks and drinks only after dinner rule is teaching unhealthy habits. Especially when it is also based on behavior. You don't have to allow snacking all day but I would venture to guess that the restrictions on food is what leads to the bingeing. 

The bedtime thing is petty. 9 pm versus 8:15/8:30 isn't a huge change and the 10 year old is getting to the point where he will naturally start staying up later due to puberty. 

I would sit down with your SO and see if he can compromise on some of these for the kids and for the sanity of your home. 

emma5678's picture

Neither boys follow specific rules well. Still have to get on them about not taking food out of the kitchen. They also didn’t follow the rules of not leaving water bottles and lids lying around the yard. Other things are easier, like the no water bottles outside (until the grandparents got here). 

 

They were binging on the food before the rules changed to not snacking all day. They still gets snacks, just not all the time. And not a full bag of chips everyday like the grandparents allowed. For example, they get chips with lunch, they get snacks at after shook daycare, etc. they just don’t get snacks before dinner during the school year becasue we start cooking as soon as they get home from after school care. We are usually running around on weekends and don’t have time to snack for an hour every day. After they got back last year they were cranky about this for a month before finally getting used to the way things are at home. Snacks after dinner is usually 5 minutes after dinner, if they finish their food. But not an option if they were terrors during the day (which happens). 

notarelative's picture

If you are going to ask Grandparents to watch the kids for six weeks, you need to trust them and not try to micromanage. Trying to control bedtime and water bottles in their house is micromanaging. 

9pm in the summertime is not unreasonable for a 10 and 8 year old. Grandparents using disposable or non disposable water bottles is not your business. Their house = their choice.

SO and you shouldn't let BM's past bad behavior keep sons from developing age appropriate skills. Both boys, including the legally blind child, need to develop age appropriate skills. When you don't let an 8 and 10 year old out in the yard without an adult you infantize them. 

emma5678's picture

It wasn’t their house, they came to our house to pick them up and they stayed for a week. The water bottles they started the very next day (we gave them almost 2 weeks to get used to the not leaving them lay around and they still couldn’t manage that, so they lost that privilege). The bedtime during the summer was not an issue, but it will be once they get back.(1.5 weeks before school starts as they need to get used to going to bed earlier again).

 

I never said we don’t let them out alone. Just not when no one is up/ busy occupied by work. we let them out in the yard alone, watching from the windows. Where they lived up until 3 months ago, it was unsafe to let them outside, so they are not used to being left outside alone yet... small steps until they can be outside when no one is going to be checking on them at all. 

Survivingstephell's picture

I take two weeks to edge my BD9 back into a school schedule.  Cold turkey the first week of school does not work.  

This is on dad to make it clear to his parents about the rules in YOUR home.  They dont pay the bills, parent the rest of the school year, etc...  They don't get a say.  Period.  

I'm not going to pass judgement on your rules, I don't know where you live and you have a couple of boys, autism, a crazy BM, you work from home, enough things to need some sort of control.  I will say that any independence they did gain with G&G will be hard to give up for them and you will need to gage if that's a battle that needs a battle or embraced as a plus.

Slamming the door would drive me CRAZY!!!  Some of the other ones are house specific and go along with living in that particular house.  Oh well, each house has its quirks,  you didn't say they were unteachable, so they will learn how to live in this house with repitition and consistency.  

Maybe a chart on the fridge with the new rules at eye level.  A reminder that if its so difficult to adjust to being back home with dad, maybe next summer they won't go for as long or at all.   

Livingoutloud's picture

Perhaps kids need to be in some type of camp or day care or have a baby sitter. What you described doesn’t sound like the best or healthy or age appropriate arrangement for the kids. And please  do not use food as a reward for good behavior. It’s a sure way to develop eating disorder. 

emma5678's picture

I didn’t really word the food thing appropriately... 

They still gets snacks, just not all the time. And not a full bag of chips everyday like the grandparents allowed.(when we allowed this, they wouldn’t eat dinner and would eat all the snacks in a couple days) For example, they get chips with lunch, they get snacks at after shook daycare, etc. they just don’t get snacks before dinner during the school year becasue we start cooking as soon as they get home from after school care. We are usually running around on weekends and don’t have time to snack for an hour every day. After they got back last year they were cranky about this for a month before finally getting used to the way things are at home. Snacks after dinner is usually 5 minutes after dinner, if they finish their food. But not an option if they were terrors during the day (which happens). 

Livingoutloud's picture

Kids are terror because they are likely bored. They were at grandparents for 6 weeks which is a luxury. Yet you complain and about such minor things. But if you believe it messed up they’d routine and your rules, then don’t send them there for 6 weeks. But then you need to find someone to watch them, and not just watch them but find something educational and useful to do: camps and other arrangements.

And if bottles outside issue only happened for one week while grandparents visited then why make such big deal. 

When you were dating, I recall you complained that kids don’t get attention and no one is doing anything with them. They were left to their own devices and the legally blind child with autism wasn’t getting training/help he needs. Did that change? Why focus on something so minor and arbitrary like a week of bottles outside rather than looking at a bigger picture 

emma5678's picture

It is not my decision on if they go with their grandparents or not, that decision is 100% their fathers. I never said they were terrors all the time, and all kids get bored sometimes, even if they have plenty to do. We could take them to the park (which we have done numerous times) and played with them, and they would still be bored 20 minutes later.

 

The water bottle issue- (I was on mobile last night and hard to type out long responses on mobile without losing my thoughts). We moved in, I watched them alone for 2 weeks during the week. During this 2 week period, they would constantly take water bottles outside, leave the caps laying all over the yard and gravel driveway, come back in for another one before finishing the first one, dump out/waste a good portion of the water. I told them multiple times a day to pick up their trash, not to leave the bottles laying around next time, not to waste the water. They couldn't listen to that. So for the next couple days, they could only use their reusable water bottles filled with the well water. They were able to follow that rules and then there was no more wasted water bottles or wasted money (well water is free, and the electric for the well pump is bascially nothing to fill up 1 bottle).

That was when they lived in an apartment and there really was nothing else to do but watch tv most of the time. They had tv, tablets, books to read, toys to play with, etc. When it was nicer outside, we started taking them to the park to play. The autistic child has an ABA therapist who works with him 3-4 times a week. Other than that, his doctors never recommended any other type of training/etc. He has an IEP at school, and gets additional help there. The issue there was it seems like his eye doctors doesn't know or dont want to try to help him see better. 

ESMOD's picture

Perhaps with the supervised freedoms they got at their Gparents.. they are both ready to do a little more?  They are both getting older... and if the older one has no disability.. then he can certainly help to look out for his younger brother.  Baby steps yes.. but some of what you seem to try with them is stiffling their growth.  I understand you are trying to work while watching them.. but most of your issues are fairly minor. 

Shoot, even the bedtime.. no reason to not shift it earlier by a few minutes over the next couple of weeks... worst case the kids are a bit tired for a couple of days. They will survive.

You may also want to develop a "safe snack" bin that the kids can access during the day (not proximate to dinner) with fruit or other items designated as "if you are hungry.. these are ok".  I also used to have my SD's ask for snacks so we didn't end up at dinner with no eating and they would have binged on poptarts earlier (at least at grannies they would).  And... kids are smart enough to understand that grandparents are spoiling them the way their parents don't allow.. it's ok.

emma5678's picture

"and if the older one has no disability.. then he can certainly help to look out for his younger brother."

We are actually wanting to do the complete opposite.... their BM would constantly tell the older brother to look after the younger brother, that he is the one responsible for him (basically saying it is his responsibility, and not my SO's or the adult that is watching them). That has caused so many issues, and puts a lot of stress on him. It is so drilled into him, that he thinks he can tell his brother what to do/not to do and correct him when he is bad, even when both SO and I are sitting right there at the same table. SO needs to constantly tell him it is not his responsibility, and is only his responsibility when there are no adults around (like if they were playing outside alone together).

I really don't think any of the simple house rules are stiffling their growth. Their father does do things that do though, like not letting either of them walk around the grocery store without holding their hands (sometimes it is necessary with the younger son if it is a crowded store, or else he would walk into everyone), but I have told him to just let them do it on their own multiple different times. That is more stiffling then not letting them outside before I am ready to watch them from a window 2 months after finally being able to go outside alone.

The other things teaches them. Be responsible for your own drinks, instead of being lazy and leaving the water bottles laying around, and just coming to get a new one instead. Not slamming the door is also teaching them to be respectful. We are working on the other door to get is usable, but until it is, it really shouldn't be used. Neither kid knows how to swim, so they don't need to be around the pool (the pool was up for 2 days before they left for the summer, if a different spot. They were both told to stay away from it when noone was outside, and the older son when right over to it within 5 minutes and was leaning over the side of it).

As for the food, both are in the healthy weight range, but the older son is on the higher side, and the younger one is on the slightly skinny side. If we allowed the older son to snack all day the past couple years, he would probably be overweight right now. If we let the younger son snack all day, he would fill up on oreos and chips and not eat dinner, not getting any of the vitamins and nutrients that he needs (cause even vitamins aren't enough/absorbed differently than actual foods). That is why if they are actually hungry after lunch, but not close to dinner, they can have another lunch (younger one really loves peanut butter sandwiches, and the older one loves jelly sandwiches.. so they both get what they need, and it is basically a snack to them with how much they love them + another handful of chips to go with), not just a full bag of chips. and thats it... they do still get snacks and sweets, but just not all the time every single day. They both have ADHD, and having too much sugar at the wrong time makes them even more wild than they already are.

We were already thinking about getting a "snack bin" for them that they could eat at any time while it is out, but not when it is put up (to avoid eating too close to dinner), butwe haven't talked about the specifics with which foods, etc. So until then, they need to ask. They usually only asked less than an hour before dinner in the past, so we just started making dinner earlier when we could, because they were hungry earlier.

The grandmother also has this rule of it is their responsibility to come in for food by a time that she tells them, and if they don't come in then her kitchen is closed and they don't eat. They did this the week they were here, and didn't even give him a break the first time he didn't come out soon enough. The issue with that here, is there is not clocks in every room, they don't have watches, and he is autistic and gets distracted easily. I think a better way to teach them responsibility is to come ask for lunch when they are hungry... that way, they also only eat when they are hungry instead of being forced to eat when they may not be hungry (Which leads to unhealthy eating habits as adults). 

strugglingSM's picture

I'm of the opinion that kids can easily understand the concept of having different sets of rules with different people, but they will push their boundaries, so if you have different rules, you have to manage to those rules. 

As a child, I always understood that there were things I could do at my grandparents' houses that would not fly at home. Even as a young child, I understood this. 

Also, how many children can learn to behave differently at school than they do at home? 

It's a pain in the butt to get kids back on track after they've come back from an extended time in a place with different rules, but with some consistent reminders, they should adapt pretty quickly. 

emma5678's picture

Yes, they will adapt, but when they come back, we want them to start getting used to our household again, and not the grandparents.... When they got picked up, the grandparents started their rules the whole week they were here at OUR home, and I don't think it was just to get the kids used to their rules, I think it is because the grandmother has to have everything her way.... So i don't expect it to go over easily that while the grandparents are visiting this time(it might be a day, it might be a week again... if they stay a week, then the kids will only have 4-5 days to get back on schedule before school starts), that the kids will not be on their rules/schedule. They need to get used to our house again before school starts, and they will also be at a new school this year too.

Maxwell09's picture

My biggest advice to you is allow some grace for their transition. They are not perfect and will need an adjustment period just like any regular human restarting a shift or starting a new job or routine. It's going to take time. Hopefully school doesn't also start this week and you have a week to get them acclimated to the schedule before the added stress of school. 

Livingoutloud's picture

Snacks don’t need to be sweets and chips. It could be much healthier things such as fruits, veggies, nuts (if not allergic)

doctor can’t really help legally blind to see better. He is legally blind 

emma5678's picture

There was another person on here a while ago (at least I believe it was here at steptalk), who said that they are also legally blind (or can only see a few inches in front of their face) who has special glasses to make it more like 4-5 feet sight distance. We don't know exactly what all is going on, as he is also autistic and it is harder to tell if he really can't see, or is just distracted at his appointments. I understand the risks of surgery, but he also has cataracts in 1 eye still... they operated on the other one 1.5 years ago. He may be having more issues than necessary because 1 eye is clearer and can see a little further, while the other eye is blurry and is only able to see 1 inch in front of his face. All the doctors have been saying for the past 1.5 years is "we have to wait and see."

It may very well be that there is nothing else they can do for him, but there is also a slight chance that his vision could improve a little more if they were willing to entertain the idea of doing something else besides just waiting and seeing.

Livingoutloud's picture

I’d assume doctors know their stuff. You can also seek second opinion if you don’t trust this doctor.