emotional and conflicting mind
HI all!
So, for those who havent read my previous posts, I am a Marriage and family therapist... good and bad when it comes to being a stepparent.
I know I can't fix the situation and I can't fix the child. That's not my place. I just need to love him and my SO until SS can accept me into his life. It's not the typical, mom and dad were together and now they aren't and you're in the way of that. It's rather, mom took me away, I just met my real dad and real dad has a girlfriend that mom tells me bad things about so I don't know how I should feel about her.
I'm just starting out in this jourey with my SO and SS. And right now I am struggling with voicing my pain and frustration in a way that my SO can understand. Because I am a therapist I can see how the events of SS life has made him resistant and made him question people around him. But I told my SO that even though I am a therapist and can understand that transition that is being made, I can't keep rationalizing my feelings away. example: well he has been through a lot and is scared of his mom so it shouldn't hurt my feelings when he says blah blah blah...
Don't get me wrong, SS is not a horrible kid, he just had 1 bad weekend with us filled with rudeness and disrespect and since I'm going my cycle my emotions were just heightened, but again, does not justify how he treated both me and his BD. We met his school friends this weekend and he was concerned how people would treat me or what they would call me because his friends doesn't know his parents aren't together and he's embarassed about that. So the party went well and I talked to the moms that were there and they are nice and some of them too are separated from BD. After the party he kept saying, "maybe you can meet my mom next time instead", and then he became fixated on what me and the other parents were talking about because he wanted to make sure I made a good impression but he still wants them to meet his mom too. The way he said it made me feel like he wanted mom to be better than me so mom has to meet them so everyone knows he has a mom and that she is involved too. Honestly though, SO and I live 1 hour from BM and his friends, since he's been in school for awhile now shouldn't BM have already met his friends and parents if she really wanted too? We were willing to drive him all that way to spend time with his friends and wanting to meet their parents.
I think that's why I wanted to sign up for something like this, to find more support from other stepparents out there and know that there are others that know what I am talking about and feeling without having to over explain every little detail. I'm not leaving the relationship because of this. The time for my to run was 8 years ago when I first started dating my SO and found out that he has a kid. We talk about marriage and a family and that's going to happen, there's just a bump in the road right now and that's to be expected with any relationship. Nothing is ever smooth sailing.
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I am a therapist too, and you
I am a therapist too, and you can only go so far in applying therapy skills and understanding to your own situation. My SS18 had been alienated by his mother and we didn't see him for over 3 years - he's been back a few months. Intellectually, I know why he does what he does, but it makes me furious how he treats his father, and I'm entitled to that feeling (I think).
Anyway, research Parental Alienation. You may think you know about it, but a lot has changed in the field and you should really get an understanding of how a kid with alienation feels. He's in an incredible loyalty bind and that will likely continue until well into adulthood. He needs to protect his mother and make sure she knows he is loyal only to her.
I'm not sure why BM allowed him back into your SO's life, but he's still going to be her pawn. I would advise that you just step back and don't try to be a big part of his life. For now, you are Dad's girlfriend, who is nice to him and that's it. Don't play any big role in his life in any other way or feel like you have to be "stepmother" or anything significant. The relationship that is important is between him and his father.
family cycle
To start.. hello fellow therapist!!! and yes you are entitled to how you feel even though there's a rational behind the SK behavior. We are still humans with feelings too.
I can fully understand and see his needs to be loyal to his mother. My SO was the same way even until now when he's almost 32. His own parents were divorced. Mom never remarried but dad remarried so my SO has 3 stepsiblings and 1 younger half sibling from that. To this day he still protects his mom and sees his dad as the non-involved parent. HOWEVER, his insight has changed since SS came back into his life. He sees what his own mom did to him was wrong because she did say bad things about his dad to him and sisters and that lead him to not want to be around his dad and SM. Trust me, my SO's mother, my future MIL, has done some malicious things and he would still try to defend her. She withheld the fact that the BM made contact with her first requesting that SS meets the family. She met SS first and then proceeded to tell SO a week later that she met him, she saw nothing wrong in what she did. Unfortunately, we both see a lot of future MIL qualities in BM and it's so scary to think that this relationship is only going to get worse as time moves forwad.
So, if you read up on
So, if you read up on Parental Alienation, you will find that it's multi-generational, and most people who are alienated from their children were also alienated from their own parent, even if it was subtle and within an intact family. So he was conditioned to feel at home in a dynamic with a woman who was an alienator and didn't even recognize it until his own son was alienated.It was similar for my DH. He knew he disliked his mother, but he didn't recognize the alienation until he went through it with his own son.
BM is likely personality disordered if she alienated SS from your SO for years. He will need to establish boundaries with her but he's going to be afraid to do that, because of his experience with his mother, and because he fears losing SS again.
You are in for a rough ride. Again, I would protect your own feelings by being kind and pleasant to SS but not getting invested in having a good relationship with him. My SS and I get along great on a superficial level, but I know I can't trust him and it's not likely we will ever have a meaningful relationship.
ohhh the personality disorders
yes!!! majorly!!!!
Is there a specific book that you would recommend? I know he would tell his mom things so I do just try to keep it pleasant and just watch what I say.
I follow the blog of Karen
I follow the blog of Karen Woodall, who is in the UK. She is working hard to change the landscape in the UK regarding alienation. Craig Childress is another person who has a big online presence. They both have something to offer, in different ways.
I try to have compassion for my SS, and I used to, when he was young. But the older he gets, the more I think he's responsible for his own choices. But BM has done such a good job of making him completely dependent on her, and controlling his every thought, that it's like he's in a cult. Even if he does have moments of seeing the truth, he's so trapped.
leaders
I think she my BM are leaders of the same cult.
I'll look into them. Thank you!!
They all use the same script
They all use the same script - you will see the same story on this board, over and over.
It gets really old hearing
It gets really old hearing from anyone I try to vent to (which is necessary so I dont explode) that they feel sorry for SD and trying to explain the position she is in. I already know the position she is in. That doesnt mean that I dont get tired of hearing how much better her mom is and I dont get tired of the constant passive aggressive crap she does to make DH and I feel bad - to name just a couple issues.
I know exactly where you are coming from. Whether there is a valid reason or not dealing with this stuff over and over and over gets to a point where you are just over dealing with it.
nail on the head
That's exactly where I am coming from. I just spoke with my cousin this morning and he has 2 SKids as well and but he had a better experience with them when things first started and now he has adopted them legally. I kept having to explain I understand his perspective but I just need to vent without having to explain myself and have to hear "but you have to see it from his point of view" or "but he has been through a lot" and "but he loves you cuz you do so much for him". No! I dont' feel the love because I'm not his mother and he is never going to give that up.
No it's not the same
No it's not the same regardless of what you do for them. Not in most cases anyway. Its different with my ODS and DH because my sons dad is completely absent. But I still dont think it's exactly the same as father and son but it is probably closer to what it is like for your cousin. Not having to deal with the involvement of the other parent.
I think people generally just feel sorry for the kids and expect us to suck it up because we are adults. They don't understand that having a stepchild is different than being around your friends kids or nieces and nephews occasionally. It's easy to just put up with kids or feel sorry for them when they dont live in your house or directly impact nearly all areas of your life constantly.
They also don't understand
They also don't understand that the child often does NOT love you for what you do for them. Often they dislike you more intensely the more you do for them and the more of a stable presence you are in their life. You are a living breathing example of everything their mother SHOULD be doing for them and quite often is not. Every time you pack them lunch, buy them sneakers, remember their teacher's name, or smile when they walk into a room, you are doing something that they wish their mother would do. And it hurts. Rather than accept that their mother is just not a nice person and will always let them down, something that even adults never manage to do as long as they live, they turn their anger to you because you are a constant reminder of the mother they wish she was.
This is what happened with me
This is what happened with me. For example I tried taking the kids on a picnic and when we were at the store getting stuff for it it turned into well this isn't what my mommy would buy so she refused to have anything. Including the treats she had wanted before that. Also any clothing we buy her she refuses to wear. She will bring it to her moms and come back wearing her moms hat or whatever instead. Once I backed off though and stopped doing stuff for her and buying her things she started trying to manipulate material things out of me. So its really a damned if you do damned if you dont.
I don't talk to my friends or
I don't talk to my friends or family much about it because they feel sorry for SS. Whatever, feel sorry for ME! lol. They just don't understand.
Right? I want to ask are you
Right? I want to ask are you my friend or her friend? My mom understands some because her longtime BF had a SS who played a part in ruining his previous marriage and shes heard his perspective on it, but she still goes over the top sucking up to SD when shes around because that's just her personality so it's still annoying to talk to her about it.
I get that SS has been the
I get that SS has been the victim of abuse in the form of parental alienation by his mother, but "awwww, he doesn't have any choice" doesn't go over well with me anymore.
with you on that
Yeah, I told my SO that it's no longer valid to use it. Right now SS is making inappropriate comments mainly about gender roles because we run on an equal household we do things equally SS would always make comments like "well why, you're the man" "women don't do that" then when I correct him (because that is something I will not tolerate and my SO agrees with me when I correct him) SS always goes into "I didn't know", "I wasn't taught that". We both (me and SO) would tell him, that excuse is just an excuse, you know better to think about what you say before you say it.
See I'm not even sure theres
See I'm not even sure theres been any abuse or parental alienation in SDs case. Theres never been anything said by either SD or BM to indicate that to me. BM is actually glad she gets to abdicate her role half of the time to DH and me. Theres still definitely the same loyalty issue though so I'm not really sure why it is in her case.
In the mind
I'm fairly new to this so loyalty on the child's end is probably natural even without the parents having to say anything. But most definitely there are some evil things being said about us to SS and he gets exposed to that 5 days out of the week and we have 2 days to correct that. Then when the first weekend of the month comes around he spends it with her, even though she's at work and her new boyfriend is taking care of him, we have to combat 2 weeks worth of negative talk in 2 days.
Yeah I can relate to the
Yeah I can relate to the trying to combat things on your time. With us it's the fact that she doesnt get to run the household or get to be the center of attention at all times at our house. So especially the first day shes back is different antics for control and attention. By the time it starts to taper down she goes back again.
therapist friends
I think the best part of being a therapist is that I have social worker and therapist friends that are there for me, even though they understand what SS is going through they are aware of what I need and they are there for me. Honestly, sometimes I am caught off guard when they start asking me how I felt about it, and how I am holding up with it.
I have friends in the field,
I have friends in the field, too, of course, but they still feel sorry for SS or try to explain why he does it. I just want someone to say, what a jerk! instead of, "Well, she's very good at manipulating", or whatever. Ugh.
I understand your frustration
I sometimes just have to stop talking to my SO about it. I was pretty mentally checked out yesterday debating on whether to bring up the subject or not but I know I'm going to hear the same excuses. Nothing on him. He finally gets to be with his son after 9 years of no engagement so I dont' fault him for wanting to love and spoil and protect him. I just get tired of having to prove my point.
Your are getting tied up in head games
You are overthinking this. He will hold BM as number one to him, He havd a good time, and was sad that his BM missed out on this fun event. He want to share his happiness with his BM, and sad that She missed it. You are upagainst that he will always want BM involved in your family events. He will want BM at dinners, family holidays and vacations so she will not miss out. Nothing like a trip to Disney, with you SO,BD, SS and his BM, He feels it’s you, DH,BD are a family unit and it’s plus him. His family unit is him, BM plus all of you. You are in for a long road
embarassment
He's expressed before the party the embarassment that he would feel having me there because he doesn't want his friends to know his parents are separated. Even though I know where he's coming from I still went with them because we are a family unit. It's something that he has to understand that he can't parent split when he is with us because we are trying to show him what a whole family unit looks like.
I get where you are coming
I get where you are coming from, but honestly - I don't think that "showing him what a whole family unit" is the right place to start. Let him build a better relationship with his father. You know you are the target of BM's hostility, don't put yourself in the firing line.
This is a fragile relationship he has with his son. I think it would have been OK for you to stay home and let him go to the party with his dad. For now.
I don't get why
I don't get why he is so embarassed that his paarents are split up. Where on earth does he live that it is at all unusual?
"personal"
He stated that his friends and he doesn't talk about personal things so they don't know his situation. When I was at the party I spoke with other parents there are there were at least 2 other of his friends there that had separated parents. But ultimately, it comes down to the BM. She tells him not to talk about certain things around us and around his friends. And he would tell us, Mom said I can't tell you about that or I can talk about this and that. Since SS11is scared of his mom he would do what she says because he's afraid of her getting mad. He would say "well I have to live with her so I have to listen to her or she'll punish me". So the embarassment is mainly because the mom wants to keep it a secret or have him suppress his emotions and his feelings.
The whole "mom" thing
The youngest, Munchkin sd12, when I came into her life and we would do stuff together, like go to a local famous park, and play on slides and all that (she was around 8 at the time). She openly admitted that she couldnt tell her mother all the nice things I did for her because "mommy would get sad". Now, its "we cannot tell your mother that I bought you bras that you desperately needed because she will get mad and lash out at me or your father..."
Its hard to talk to someoen who is NOT a step parent. People try to excuse the kids actions. Today I had a conversation with a previous co worker. This woman is a teacher, and single, without children. When I brought up Toxic Feral's lies and manipulations, her sympathy went straight to her. "Her entire world exploded, you have to understand, she doesnt KNOW". Im like, hush! you dont KNOW. This girl yelled and screamed at me and called me names then turned around and told Toxic Troll her mother that I was the one that did all that. This kid is now 19 and STILL lying - this time its abuse allegations against me and DH. Ive never laid a hand on her, yelled back once, then disengaged. DH never laid a hand on her. He never spanked his children, but now Toxic Feral is alleging he hit her all the time. And most people would say "you have to believe the kids! No matter what!" Before seeing Toxic Feral's narcissistic personality disorder, I would never have believed it, myself.
Well, with your SS, its going to be a while. You could try the "kill him with kindness", but that sounds like he might just turn around and tell BM, so then she will lash out. I am polite and friendly with Munchkin SD12, she tells her family that she "thinks of me as a second mom" (one who doesnt lie, beat her kids, trash talk her father, serial date a bunch of dudes...) but she happens to be emotionally intelligent and very sweet and appreciative of my efforts. In your situation, its best to keep a distance, for now.
I dont get the way people
I dont get the way people just excuse their behavior. Well the thing is if she doesnt know then someone needs to tell her. I realize it's too late now for that with yours in particular but in general it makes no sense to me when people think that bad behavior should just be dismissed because theres a reason for it. Yes her whole world exploded, so should she be taught better coping skills for when it inevitably happens again in life or should we reinforce that you handle being in pain by acting like a jerk and just ignore the behavior? I've seen SDs teachers feel sorry for her to the point that they were passing her in subjects that she was way behind in. And then the next year she was even further behind because of it. It just seems counterproductive and I dont get it.
doing no justice
I agree. People aren't doing the child/children justice excusing their behavior especially in a school setting. That is when teachers need to refer parents to counselors because that is essentially what the child needs at this point. I know, biased opinion/statement from a therapist. But for my SS world to get torn from him, reintroduced to a father he never knew existed, a court battle, BM new boyfriend, and BM shit talking, he needs therapy because he's not going to feel comfortable saying things to either parents because he is scared and afraid of punishment. He would always want reassurance if we were mad at him or not and would say "mom would be mad at me" and we have to keep reminding him that we are not his mother and we would talk to him like a big kid instead of punishing him and being mad. Everytime he speaks negatively or politically incorrect I make sure to correct it. I am not gonna have him walking around saying women can't do this or that, and special needs are this and that. That is something I will not tolerate and my SO knows that I will verbally correct him and educate him even when SS says "well I didnt know"
PAS
Parental Alienation Syndrome. Dr. Craig Childress has a ton of videos about it on youtube and is a big advocate for getting the Mental health community and the court systems in the U.S. to recognize it as a form of emotional abuse. It is extremely damaging and follows kids their entire lives and destroys family relationships. you may be able to find a therapist for him that deals with it but I would specifically ask them if they have dealt or know about it.
a must but BM wont
Oh trust me, I have been advocating for him to be in therapy, for the whole family to be in therapy, and my SO is on board and would want to go to therapy with BM to learn how to cope with each othe while they raise their son together but separately, but BM is resistant about it. Since she has full legal and physical we can't take him a therapist during our time. But I know once he's 12 he can consent to his own therapy, but again, mom said therapy is bad and that I am a bad person so of course he already has in his head that therapy is only for the crazy and nothing is wrong with him and he has nothing to talk about. The kicker is that BM ALSO WANTS TO BECOME A THERAPIST TO HELP BROKEN FAMILIES.... don't quit your day job honey.