imaSmom's picture

How long does it take for someone to claim abuse after a break-up?

Must be the year of the epic break-ups on my end. My BIL first whose issue turned out pretty well considering what he was up against. Almost 50/50 and fair support order but he definitely dealt with the "he emotionally abused me by being condescending, I didn't like his tone etc".

And now another friend is going through a break-up. I went to HS with both of them. She managed to get a restraining order against him--frustrated my friend took to FB to vent his situation. Apparently he is not allowed anywhere near her and that means he can't see his kids because she is claiming no one is available drop off or pick up the kids besides her.

It just seems like for some the deck is very stacked against them. Of course I don't know for sure if either of them actually abused their spouses but the convenience with which you can make these allegations and with little to no proof and you can STILL have a impact on that persons life because now they have a record.

For the people that actually are abusive relationships I swear they don't get the help they need until it's too late.

Dontfeedthetrolls's picture

Abuse is a hard thing to deal

Abuse is a hard thing to deal with and there is no one answer. Some victims may never admit to it. Some it will take years. Now the way this is playing out it does feel like a possible case of cry wolf which is very upsetting. Some women will cry abuse to get their way and people believe them without a second guess. I'd say your friend needs to go to the court about seeing his kids. She can't just keep them from him even if she has a restraining order. This is where DHS and stuff steps in to help out.

My partners ex is trying to claim he has anger management problems and was hostile towards her making her life UNBEARABLE. I've talked to enough people to know he's telling me the truth. She was physically abusive towards him. She cheated on him multiple times, once with his Drill Sargent. She left him pretty much homeless out of no where. Of course getting the court to believe it is near impossible cause after all "men are never victims".

—

Some days are hard but you just fight through them to get to the good ones.

CLove's picture

My SO's ex tried to claim

My SO's ex tried to claim that he was abusive to her, when it was HER that would get blind drunk and attack HIM. Many times, she would get angry and then scratch and claw and dug her nails into his neck, threw things at him, etc. But would tell everyone who would listen how he is always angry, and mean and that's why she cheated on him.

This from a woman who just the other day choked and slapped her 18-year old daughter.

—

Hope is a 4 letter word.

not2sureimsaneanymore's picture

I think it's easy for a lot

I think it's easy for a lot of people to warp their perception of their relationship after a break up because it's harder to face our own part in causing the toxicity than it is to just wholly blame the other party. We often hear about how "she was crazy" from the guy but he conveniently forgets to mention how he gaslit her until her insecurities overtook her, and we often hear the "he was abusive" line from women but when pressed for the details of such "abuse", it turns out they take an unkind phrase taken out of context in the heat of the moment as "abusive."

It's a form of self preservation, really, and it's dangerous because for every 10 that uses that phrase flippantly, another 1 gets not taken seriously until they're in the ER with a black eye or worse.

BM told MIL she won't visit our state because someone advised her not to and implied she expected DH to track her down and kill her and take the kid or something the moment she stepped foot in our state. He is going to do that... how? It's all because he told her he can take custody of ss if she feels like she can't handle it when she blew up the phone telling him how he ruined her life and that he doesn't have to do any of the hard work and that it's all on her and she connected it with all the times he told her he doesn't care about her and told her to f*ck off when she would say he has to marry her because she's pregnant with his child (before the DNA test since there was her SO who she was still living with and having sex with).

That may very well be her "truth" as she perceives it, due to a mixture of what I said above and her own mental illness (diagnosed BPD) which involves her alternating between absolute villification and worship, which is the root of why BPD's have maladaptive relationships.

MIL filed a restraining order against FIL when the kids were young because he tried to pick them up at an agreed upon time during their separation where no visitation CO was in place yet but apparently they got into an argument and MIL called the police and petitioned for an RO. She didn't get it because it was baseless and done out of malice, but her petition I actually found in the public records 30 years down the line, so you are absolutely right that the records stay and they can ruin someone's life.

HeavenLike's picture

If she got an RO, there's

If she got an RO, there's probably something that's gone on, RO's don't get handed out like candy on Halloween.

He should be able to see his kids, exchanges can be done at the police station and under third party supervision.

I do agree that too often a woman can cry rape or abuse, and a man be unfairly hung with that tag. I am more concerned that if women are prosecuted for it, then women who are actually abused or raped will not come forward unless they have an extremely airtight case and how often does that happen?

I'm not saying it's right or okay for a woman to make false accusations but I've been overpowered by a man and raped and so I know, men still have a physical advantage over women. Yes, women rape and abuse too, but men have an inherent physical advantage.

It's not fair but I'm so much more concerned with protecting women who do suffer at the hands of men. It's not that I don't care what happens to an innocent man, because it's not right or fair, I just don't want a whole lot more women to suffer because they won't name their attacker or abuser.

Maybe someone has a better idea of how to handle these things, because I really just don't know a good answer.

HeavenLike's picture

dupe

dupe

sueu2's picture

Really and truly, it isn't up

Really and truly, it isn't up to anyone to dispute or even question allegations of abuse, so I think you're really wrong with this blog and the way you're thinking. These guys may be your friends or family members; they could even be your own brother but no matter how well you think you know them, you have no idea how they are in relationships or how they treat their partner.

You have to remember that for one thing, abuse is subtle and it's extremely rare that outsiders know anything about it.

Another thing is the narcissistic and borderline personality disorders. These types of people's, ESPECIALLY the narcissist's, method of operation is to charm and fool everyone they know into thinking they are wonderfully good and kind people, but they are incredibly the worst offenders of emotional and mental abuse. If they never lifted a hand to their wife or girlfriend, it really doesn't matter because they've verbally and mentally battered her to a pulp.

And, even if it's not pertaining to ongoing abuse, the first thing people - neighbors down the street, family members, friends, even the corner gas station attendant - will say is "he's such a nice guy" in response to learning the guy had murdered his family or robbed a bank or was killed by the girlfriend who is NOW claiming years of abuse. It hardly and in no way means she was not abused just because you didn't know about it or just because the guy has convinced you that it's not true.

You don't know a person no matter how well you think you know them. And when it comes to relationships and marriage, you don't know that guy AT ALL if you were never his girlfriend or wife.

You probably won't, but I wish you'd delete this blog. Sorry, but you might like/love these guys and want to support them, but you really have no business.

nobodysbabynow's picture

Sue, I was writing my

Sue, I was writing my response while you were writing yours, but what you described is exactly what I experienced, why I didn't tell for so long, and why I was disbelieved when I did tell. Thanks.

sueu2's picture

You are so very welcome,

You are so very welcome, girl! I'm so glad you got out, and I'm sorry people didn't believe you. I'm also sorry anybody posted a thread like this as a sad and sickening reminder.

wickedcool stepmum's picture

And thank you from me, too

And thank you from me, too Sueu2.

I left my husband in June last year and I still get that Sh*t from people about him being such a nice guy and not believing me.
It's invisible to people outside the house more often than not.

You gave me good strong and supportive advice when I left 10 months ago and I appreciate it, still.

sanecatlady's picture

I'm so glad you got out. You

I'm so glad you got out. You are brave and strong!

You make a very good point. I used to say if something like that ever happened to me, I would tell everyone especially my dad, and "he would take care of it". I couldn't understand why people stayed for years tolerating such terrible treatment. But what I have gleaned from experiences posted here is that it is so subtle you believe you deserve it. That is why it is emotional abuse as well as physical abuse. It breaks you down. Now, I'm not so high and mighty and I don't judge.

Stillstruggling's picture

Thank you, thank you, thank

Thank you, thank you, thank you for writing that!

I had a very similar experience. I had the fractured eye socket and black eye, numerous text messages and threatening voicemails, and I even had the one person who I had confided in and still people said that "he's such a nice guy" and said that I must have done something to provoke him. Or maybe I had hit myself.

z3girl's picture

Yes, thank you, this is very

Yes, thank you, this is very well put.

I went to counseling at a local women's shelter for a couple years, and the horror stories some of my now friends have gone through just astound me. I always felt I wasn't worthy of being part of the group because I never dealt with physical abuse, but they never once discounted anything I went through. When I finally left the program (they ended our group to make room for new people...it's so sad that there's an overwhelming need for services, and I live in a fairly affluent area.) Anyway, when I left, I felt like a whole new person. It has completely changed my life, and I will forever be grateful for the help I received.

RO's are not given on a whim, and I have met so many women who have gotten such raw deals with the courts that it's frightening.

Sue really put it best...

nobodysbabynow's picture

This is a sore subject for me

This is a sore subject for me because I lived in an abusive relationship with my ex for over five years before telling anyone what was going on. I came from another state, he grew up here and had become sort of a local celebrity, and had been running my life on threats. Physical abuse, mental abuse, very detailed threats to my life, but I was too afraid to tell or document any of it because he would become more violent and threatening at any hint that I might tell anyone or be trying to save evidence.
I finally sought therapy at a domestic violence shelter when I found out that he had been fabricating "evidence" by gas lighting and then recording my reactions for five years and telling people that I was mentally ill and had been abusing him. When I called police because he threatened me with boiling water over my head, people disbelieved me and said I was a dangerous person for him to be around because he would never do such a thing, I had to be lying.
I think it sometimes comes out at the end of a relationship because an abuser leaves the victim when they are no longer controllable and more trouble than they are worth, or because the victim is leaving and worried about leaving children alone with an abuser. No matter how well we may think we know someone, we don't know what was going on in their home. it may happen more often on step talk because we are here to talk about these situations, but most people who say they are experiencing abuse are truthful. Parents don't normally alienate children from loving safe coparents just to be spiteful and without good reason. I think people should stay neutral if they don't know what to believe.

sueu2's picture

This blog is so extremely

This blog is so extremely disturbing that I wanted to post again to add that just because you never heard her say it before doesn't mean she had never shared with her friends or family that he was mistreating her. So just because you now know about her making this claim in a court case doesn't mean it warrants the question of "how long does it take for someone to claim abuse after a break-up?" to a bunch of strangers.

But as I came to read over your post again, I re-read you saying he dealt with "he emotionally abused me by being condescending, I didn't like his tone etc".

Do you not know THAT is abuse? Do you accept people treating you that way? Would you accept your husband/boyfriend being condescending to you? Are you trying to claim she up and lied on him? This is the type of thing people in everyday life do to each other. Who would like it or want to live with it coming from their husband whenever he feels like it? It's nasty and done for the purpose of being mean and nasty. Why are you suggesting she lied??? You cannot POSSIBLY know that.

imaSmom's picture

I wouldn't dispute her claims

I wouldn't dispute her claims at all--um this is one of those, "you have to see them interact" to know who really has the power in that relationship. For my BIL I actually dislike the way he talks to people in general. His alpha personality is not my cup of tea and I wouldn't jump into bed with him either. But this is what I know of my BIL and what everyone else that knows him thinks of him as well. You either like him or you don't. Which is why I found what my exSIL said suspect.

She is accusing him of emotional and verbal abuse but in the same breath telling him when he is to interact with his kid, how and what steps to take in the event she is unavailable. The way she is going about it is not in a rational and understandable sort of way. She will set up a time, he will show up and no one will be there. He will call and she will put him to voicemail. He will call again and she will put it to voicemail. He will call once again and then she'll pick up and accuses him of harassment. He will say where is kid, we agreed at this place and this time and she will reply, sorry I don't like your tone. I told you if I was unavailable you are to text and ask may I see kid and if it's not possible another time will be provided to you. At this point he will be pissed off and in a not so nice tone tell her where she can stuff her visitation logic and then she will hang up on him and text him saying she does not have to listen to verbal abuse.

So then a week or two will go by before she answers again. Its very manipulative and subtle. I've mentioned before BIL is not innocent and but it must really suck to be up against this kind of situation where no matter how you react you are being accused of abuse, even if that reaction is normal for the circumstance. In the meantime he's not getting access to his kid at all. A judge finally put a stop to it by adjusting the visitation schedule for the kid to be picked up at daycare instead.

Maybe I should reword my blog because I'm not trying to attack women who are victims of domestic violence, rather the people who use the social stigma for personal gain. I don't think that part of the situation should go undressed because there are real and legitimate victims.

—

The freedom, the strength, the will to do as I damn well please.

sanecatlady's picture

Yikes. Honestly, they both

Yikes. Honestly, they both don't sound very like able.

nobodysbabynow's picture

Idk, I'm capable of being a

Idk, I'm capable of being a total b8tch to my ex, and there were times I was a b*tch during the relationship. There were times I found my strength to stand up to him, and times I got sick of it and blew my top (an he always took advantage of those times, to make me look "crazy" and abusive to others). But he was the one dealing out the death threats, doing the hitting, the biting, and raping. And he was the one with all the friends and family on his side. Last comment from me also.

sanecatlady's picture

Oh no... I'm sorry you went

Oh no... I'm sorry you went through that. Terribly sorry. Sad

Please believe that wasn't a slight at anyone. I know people are capable of standing up for themselves in the heat of the moment... I can just see that it was best for them to part ways, no matter the situation. If she was abused, I'm glad she's out.

nobodysbabynow's picture

Thanks, I know you didn't

Thanks, I know you didn't mean that sanecatlady- I meant OP, seems like she was saying that since the mother is acting sort of stand uppy toward her ex now, that she must be too tough to have been abused. OR that's how I took it.

And it looks to me like she's avoiding him because he's high conflict also.

sanecatlady's picture

Yes. My friend can talk a big

Yes. My friend can talk a big game and can egg it on even. But her STBEX-DH (divorce is final tomorrow, thank goodness) can sure choke her until she passes out in front of her kids too.

I also never understood those kind of people that "you either like or you don't". Those types of people are usually just a holes.

sueu2's picture

um this is one of those, "you

um this is one of those, "you have to see them interact" to know who really has the power in that relationship. For my BIL I actually dislike the way he talks to people in general. His alpha personality is not my cup of tea and I wouldn't jump into bed with him either. But this is what I know of my BIL and what everyone else that knows him thinks of him as well. You either like him or you don't. Which is why I found what my exSIL said suspect.

I couldn't read past this because I soooo very much rebuke myself for failing so dismally to get my point across....or you didn't understand it....or you ignored it. At any rate, it fell on deaf ears, and I'm really and truly sorry about that for myself, for nobodysbabynow, and for all the other women you are shitting on with this thread. So......as you wish.

sanecatlady's picture

That stuck out to me too,

That stuck out to me too, Sue. Granted, there are times people can say things they don't mean or argue. However, since we don't know the situation, I don't think we can judge. If someone was condescending to me 24/7 and a bully I would want out too. Being on this site though, it doesn't cease to amaze me the crazy some BM's will turn up. Regardless, abuse claims need to be investigated and always taken seriously in my opinion.

Op, Isn't this the BIL who works all the time and you said they both had big egos and you will be keeping his kid on some weekends that he works?

Also, what grown man feels the need to defend himself on Facebook? Talk about a huge turn off.

anotherstep2's picture

Sorry but I have to weigh in

Sorry but I have to weigh in here. People of both genders abuse each other. The definition of "abuse" has expanded to pretty much include anything that someone wants it to be. And people lie like rugs to get what they want.

I can't tell you how many times I have seen women in the hallways of the courthouse with their entourage as if they don't have a care in the world - only to turn on the waterworks once they get on the stand and claim to be in fear of their life - and in desperate need of sole possession of the home they share, of course. I also see women sitting in the corner with their hands shaking and not meeting anyone's eyes who can barely speak above a whisper during their testimony. You can draw your own conclusions.

The sad thing is that the system is irretrievably broken. Women who need protection are afraid to get it. And often they are smart NOT to seek PFAs as that can be the final insult to a man on the edge. Plenty of women have been killed with a PFA/RO tucked in their purse. And lots of men have been falsely accused of violence to gain an advantage in a custody fight or to get exclusive use and possession of the home - with him having to keep paying the mortgage if he wants to keep his credit. Especially with unmarried couples when the woman has no right to spousal support - this is her only shot at cash.

Bottom line is that no one knows exactly what happens behind closed doors but the way they behave during the break-up can give a pretty decent indication. Just because no one said anything about abuse before the break-up does not mean an allegation is false. But the behavior that goes along with it is telling in a lot of ways. Making every effort to avoid contact is very different than making snarky provocative remarks on Facebook!

FieryEscape's picture

Sadly many women uses the

Sadly many women uses the victim card to try and get the upper hand on an ex during divorce or custody proceedings . I know of many cases where the allegations were proven to be bold face lies .

Abuse is a serious and terrible thing to ever experience . Restraining orders have to have some sort of proof . You might be able to ge the temporary emergency one that is typically for a few weeks , but there is a burden of proof for the long term ROs. I've unfortualy been through the process.

As far as the father not being able to see his kids due to the RO, usually there are terms regarding visitation and how to implement it.

Acratopotes's picture

I hate it when friends breaks

I hate it when friends breaks up and tries to put you in the middle of it.... why can't they simply split, end it and keep their dirty laundry out of the public?

—

Blended family life turned me into a pirate....
All I want to do is drink Rum and stab people

Livingoutloud's picture

To op: unless you are third

To op: unless you are third person in that marriage such as sleep with them in bed and spend every day in their marriage (not just observing it) you have no ways of knowing if he abused her or not. It's also not your place to judge if her allegations are false or not. That's what justice system is for

Also just because condescending jerky attitude is not a big deal for you, it is obviously a big deal for other women.

If he had issues with visitations he can go through courts and attorneys and perhaps see kids on a neutral territory. It's up to courts to decide.

Overall your tone of "managed" and "claimed" is offensive to women (and men) who are abused. There obviously was a reason for RO no matter how much you like these guys and how awesome you think they are.

Sending hugs to all abuse victims (men and women)

LadyFace's picture

If the allegations are

If the allegations are unsubstantiated, the RO will be dropped after they go to court. Judges don't like it when people ask them for orders enforced by police just because they are mad at their ex.

I was with my abusive asshole ex for six years. I never told anyone until after I left. I never even had an RO. Does that mean he never strangled me? He never punched me in the back of the head as I was stepping into the shower? He never pissed all over my opened suitcase on vacation?

You may think you know this couple, but I assure you that you don't know shit. Eye-wink

If he's an arrogant asshole to others, he's probably verbally abused his wife. That's not a huge leap.

Eta: do ROs really affect one's record? I would think not, but I could be wrong. I've known plenty of guys with actual DV convictions and life went on for them.

—

Keep on keepin' on!

z3girl's picture

It depends on the job, but

It depends on the job, but yes, a simple DV conviction such as harassment without an RO involved can cause problems with employment. I've questioned my own decision in the past to get the police involved for this very reason.

As for the OP saying how nasty the woman can be and questioning the abuse...maybe the woman is finally finding her strength and just reacting to their toxic relationship. After years of abuse, she might not be able to take it anymore, and would act reasonably with anybody else. We can't know for sure whether or not there was abuse, but if the guy is potentially unlike-able as described, chances are he really is abusive.