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Trip with the Ex?

Venus75's picture

Ok, I have a tricky one...
I've been dating my BF for about a year now. He has 3 children, 13, 18 and 20, I have none.
He has an incredibly difficult time standing up to the ex, his children or his own family as he is a people pleaser by nature and I think culturally, he struggles. I have been working with him on this, trying to empower him.
He gives in to his "children" and gives them whatever they want, whenever they want. I'm not yet allowed to meet them because "the ex isn't ready". Furthermore, the decision has been left up to the children who are of course protecting their mother and have denied wanting to meet me. Fine.
But we've dealt with a barrage of incidences where the ex shows up to family dinners with his family (when I'm not there of course) and my BF says he had no choice as the kids wanted her there or his sister invited her.
I do not feel threatened by her at all and I can say unquestionably that the relationship is over. I think however, it is more a matter of he cannot stand up to anyone. She bulldozes him as do his kids and his family. He's just running around trying to please everyone.

Now here is the kick in the throat. They made a promise to their children that when they turn 18, they get to go on a trip of their choosing. They took the oldest to hawaii. Well, now the middle child has reached 18 and the entire family (His parents, sisters, etc as well as the EX) will be going. I will not as I'm not yet allowed to meet them. This will be over Christmas, NYE and what was to be their 20th wedding anniversary.

Furious is of course, an understatement. He fears that if he doesn't go, it will reflect negatively on me with his kids and his family, but he understands that going will be hard on us. He will be rooming with his son and she will room with the girls.

I think it is 50 shades of inappropriate. I understand he is between a rock and a hard place but I really feel the ex wife should kindly bow out.

I am repeatedly told "it's for the children" when it comes to any of this stuff. Frankly, they aren't children anymore and should understand the concept of divorce.
He tells me this is fresh for them and to "be patient" but I can't always take back burner if he wants to be serious with me (he's talking marriage and another baby and all that with me).

We started seeing a counselor because I said "I love you but this trip may be the end of us. I'm not sure my little soul can take it".

And I assure you I'm not hating on the ex. His life is a circus because he allows it. He sets zero boundaries and thus, the squeakiest wheel gets the grease. I have the option of being another squeaky wheel, or just getting no grease.

Does anyone have advice on empowering their man to to stand up? Say no? Set boundaries? I want to do it in a way that doesn't emasculate him as she's done that for long enough.

Thank you. I'm open to all ideas. I love him and we have a great relationship otherwise, but this is huge and I fear will be our demise.

Venus75's picture

Thanks Threestrikes, I really like this idea!

I decided to turn lemons into lemonade and I'm booking a trip to LA to see my single girlfriends and have an amazing time.

I know my worth and I know I have a lot to offer and he isn't the only fish in the sea. I just wish I didn't love him so much Sad

givemesugar's picture

I think you have three options :

1.treat the kids with kindness. For example you haven't meet them yet but buy them each gift a write a card saying how much you want to meet them. Doesn't have to be something extravagant but something that shows you want to be a part of their relationship with their dad.

2. Option walk away entirely.

3. Option make yourself so irresistible to him, lots of sex, extra pleasures and get yourself looking extra sexy. Get your hair coloured, makeup, lingerie, new wardrobe pieces. Then when he wants to go spend time with kids and ex say you are spending time with a coworker or any man you are friends with that he doesn't know. This is very tactical and crafty but jealousy makes a heart grow immensely quick. Don't be childish about but always put the ball back in his court. ' well I'm not going to spend Christmas alone... So ' mark and I are going to his families house or we are going on a cruise together in separate rooms don't worry. ' if he says anything back just turn the tables around, well you are going away and haven't invited me, don't even mention that it's only fair considering he does the same. But even if you have to make someone up entirely start going 'out' to meet 'mark' from work and 'judy' from work for drinks etc start making a relationship now so by the end of November you say mark has invited you on a cruise or you are going to spend it with Mark and his kid lol. Just always always maintain the line he is just a friend and he shouldn't worry. Now this option is more risky and of course you can make it whatever you like but it has to be a taste of his own medicine.

jam's picture

Oh sweetie....just run.

You are not married to this guy and have already gotten a taste of where you stand. The skids and bm run the show and you will hear one excuse after another. He gives in to his kids now and has already shown a history of doing so. This history will repeat itself time & time again.

Cooooookies's picture

What everyone says above. You are the other woman in your own relationship. He puts his ex and children first and you're there to warm his belly and bed. I'd run so fast he'd wonder if I ever existed.

Venus75's picture

Thank you,

I agree and that is my fear.

I've ended things so many times with him for this reason, and when I do, he finally will set a boundary. The problem is, I don't want to keep giving him threats and ultimatums to get him to take action. I'm actually just exhausted. When he talks about anyone in his family (ex, kids, sister, etc.), i immediately change the subject or just walk away. I don't care anymore and apathy is a bad place to be. I've dealt with the woman stalking me like crazy, getting her friends to stalk me, I've endured uncomfortable dinners with his sister while she explained what I would need to do to be "accepted" in the family (WTH?). The ex has accused me of being a manipulator and "flaunting our relationship" because we happen to both follow the same site on instagram. She's googled my license plate number (I didn't even know you could do that). She takes every opportunity to text him constantly when he's with me or ask him to come do dumb stuff for her like get her windshield fixed and what not. When he does it he says "I can't have my children riding around in a car with a broken windshield" and then I feel bad.

He and I are taking a trip of a lifetime in a few weeks, but I'm thinking after that telling him that I'd like to see other people. I cannot be committed to a man who isn't completely committed to me. I'm hoping the intimate 2 weeks together will allow for a lot of discussion.

I think where I struggle is that since I don't have children of my own, I don't know what is "normal" in regards to taking care of them. I'm not jealous of the time he spends with him, but with this whole family debacle, I never know where the line is of me just being selfish vs. speaking up for myself.

It is all very sad because he's such a wonderful guy and I know he loves me, but I need him to start putting me first. Ugh

hereiam's picture

All of this is ridiculous and if you have ended it many times already, well, you see where that has gotten you.

None of it is "normal" except in dysfunctional relationships and divorces where the participants refuse to move on. Your boyfriend is choosing to participate in the dysfunction and so are you.

Your ultimatums mean nothing, you keep taking him back. Let them all have their madness, you can do better. He will never put you first. Never. Because if that was his intention, he's already be doing it.

uofarkchick's picture

Why wait until after the trip? Why go waste anymore time with someone you're going dump? Is this why you stick around?

Venus75's picture

Well, because we leave in 5 days and everything is booked. :/ And honestly, I'm excited about everything we are going to see and don't really want to cancel.

I agree with what everyone is saying and even though it is hard to hear I know it is right Sad
Someone once told me a quote that is so true "The bull looks different when you're in the ring with it". It is very easy for me to see the problems and pitfalls in my friends relationships but when it is my own, I see all the little glimmers of hope, etc and my own problems don't look the same.

When I boiled down all of our issues to the common denominator, it really is him worrying about not looking like a "nice guy". And I said "in your quest to please everyone you're actually doing quite the opposite".

When I think about it, I just don't have the energy anymore to keep fighting for my space in his life. I've fully brought him into the fold of my entire life (meeting my family, friends, etc) but yet he has a life outside of me where I am not allowed and there isn't really a timeline or a plan to change that.

He agreed to go to counseling and the counselor said "do you feel like you're being managed in a way?" and I said "absolutely. I feel like an accessory in his life". My BF assured me this isn't true [insert 3 hour conversation here] but his actions speak otherwise.

Thank you for everyones comments and I appreciate everyone's input. I'm sad about the whole thing but I don't fear being alone.

hereiam's picture

I love him and we have a great relationship otherwise

Otherwise? You mean, other than him having a separate life with his ex and his kids?

Demand some respect, woman, or get out.

Honestly, you shouldn't have to demand respect, you should already have it. I don't know why any woman would want a man, if she had to force that man to treat her properly.

Disneyfan's picture

The man doesn't need to be empowered, you do.

Someone needs to help you find the strength to say NO and walk away from this. There is nothing wrong with your BF. He has made it crystal clear that he wants a woman that will allow him to date and hang out with his ex wife whenever he feels like it.

Why don't you love yourself more than you love this man? Where is your self-esteem and self respect? Fully possessing those 3 things would make it impossible for you put up with this guy.

Instead of worrying about "fixing" your BF, focus on fixing yourself.

AWWKNSWTD's picture

How long have they been divorced?

If the boundary you get him to set is not going on the trip for the 18th birthday -- he is right, the kids will hate/resent you. And that has really long term implications for your relationship with him in the future.

Move on-- don't go on the trip of a lifetime with him -- simply move on.

hereiam's picture

"in your quest to please everyone you're actually doing quite the opposite"

Oh, I'm pretty sure his kids and the ex are pleased, as he is still operating as if they are his whole life, while you sit on the back burner.

He is not going to change. Not now, not when all the kids are grown, not when they have kids of their own, not if you have kids with him. This is it, this is who he is.

Punchice's picture

I'm sorry but you are absolutely crazy if you stay. The steps and ex, family they can do or feel how they want. He should put his foot down and decline. That is insanity. They aren't kids anymore and even if they were that trip is inappropriate. If she wants it he can stay home. But obviously he doesn't want to. You should plan a week long trip to Las Vegas with others and we he says why do you have to go tell him could I don't know what my friends are going to do if I don't and I don't want to make them made. Let that sink in and he'll see who he is putting in front of you. And if he does t change leave.

sunshinex's picture

If I were in this situation, I would feel like he already has a family with his ex wife and kids. I hope this isn't harsh but I would walk away seeing as there's currently no room for anything else. I would of course tell him this first, and give him the option, but kids have to learn that once divorce happens, that's it... There's no more mom and dad together. It's nice if they stay civil but hanging out and going on trips together gives the wrong impression to the kids in my opinion. My husband and his ex spend no time whatsoever together. His daughter (my SD), myself and my husband are a family and his ex, whatever current boyfriend she's with, and SD are a family. There are two families now... Not one and you're the odd one out.

sunshinex's picture

Also his kids are older... They're BEYOND old enough to learn that divorce is final and means no more mom and dad together! If your SO didn't want his kids to be without mommy and daddy together, he should've thought that through and not divorced. But he did. And he found a new girlfriend. So what the hell is going on? I'm angry for you! I don't know how you're dealing with this situation!

Rags's picture

"50 shades of inappropriate" is exactly right. If anything I would insist on going, you and your SO stay together, and you and DH drive the trip agenda. BM can join or not. It makes no difference. The kids can either participate in what you and DH stipulate or they can do what they want... on their own dime.

Pretty simple I think.

Have fun!!!!

smomofone's picture

I wonder what ended up happening here. The trip with the ex and kids was for the holidays.

Disillusioned's picture

I think you should go on the trip. Why not, everyone else is there?! His ex, and his children, can learn to deal with it!

If the trip is so important fine, but, you are now part of his life whether they like it or not and so if you can go as well great but if not, well then I would have the time of my life while he was on that trip with them.

His kids sound like brats, or seriously alienated from you thanks to the BM - not a great situation at all

Sorry you're being treated this way!

Solidshadow7's picture

The trip and the pain its causing you are not the actual issue. It is a symptom of a larger problem. With circumstances being as they are the most appropriate thing is for your boyfriend to go on that trip without you and for you to take it in stride and not wage a war over it.

The real problem, is that you've been together for a year and you haven't met his children. You are clearly not family to him. You are just this side person to his "real family" and as a side person you have no place attending his family vacation. This vacation might be what is bringing your feelings to a head, buts its really just the straw that broke the camels back.

Forget about the vacation. Its completely and totally unimportant.

Its not your problem that his ex "isn't ready" and its not his problem either. The ex is an ex and nobody should really care what she thinks about the fact that he has moved on. He may not like hurting her, but if he has to hurt one of you it should be her before you.
You need to meet his kids. He needs to start acting like a parent and simply explain to his children how this is going to be. They are going to meet you, they are going to be nice to you, and you are going to be part of the family and they don't get a say in it. They are not allowed to disrespect you and they are not allowed to give you a hard time. If they have issues about you they are more than welcome to work them out in therapy, no reason why you need to hear about them.
Seriously. That's your line in the sand. This is your life too.

Your boyfriend can accommodate your needs and show you he wants you as his family, or your boyfriend can march out the door so you can find someone who does want you.
Non negotiable. Forget about the vacation. Just let them go, who cares? But the real problems in your relationship need to be dealt with RIGHT NOW or else.