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Did I Over Step??

mama4u3's picture

So my SO and SD moved in 2 years ago, SD (now 8 yrs old) lived with us the first year full-time, and last year the courts decided SD could spend summers with her mom. So, SO and I had full custody for a year, then we had full custody during the school year with SD visiting her mom on some holidays and some weekends. A few months ago SD wanted to get her hair cut really short, I talked her into having it chin length because I didn't want it to be too short. SO, SD and I discussed the choice for about 30 minutes the night before. BM was a hair stylist for about 2 years of her entire 40+ year life and rarely even trims SD hair. Our hairstylist has 25+ years experience, loves children, and would do just about anything for anyone. So, anyway, I didn't see it as a huge deal, especially since I'm the one rushing SD and my teens out the door everyday and I don't have time to do her hair for her. A few weeks later during another family salon trip (this time for my teenagers) SD begged for highlights, instead of the green and gold like she wanted, I let her get two small blond highlights, again thinking I made an OK choice. Everyone was thrilled until BM called SD that night and chewed her little butt for cutting her hair short because "mommy wants it to stay long and brown" and then proceeded to tell SD that I had no right to make her get her hair cut (sooo not my choice to cut it short) and I certainly should not have made her dye it (again, my fault for letting the kid make a choice by herself). I went in to get my hair done recently and I announced that anyone that wanted their hair trimmed better let me know. SD announced in a very snotty tone, "my mommy doesn't want me to get my hair cut, and you aren't allowed to take me there." To which SO and I always respond that her hair is up to SD, it's on her head, and if she wants it cut then she can speak up. Her normal response is "I'll ask my mom if i can." My response is now "Whatever" because frankly, I just don't feel like putting the energy into caring any more. The next as we were doing our hair together all SD can talk about is how our stylist is horrible at cutting hair, BM is much better, and that I shouldn't have taken her to a chop shop to have her hair cut. My response was, then don't ask me to get your hair or nails done again because I'm over hearing this crap about my friend. SO was scheduled for a hair cut after work the other day and SD told her mom on the phone that I scheduled the haircut but daddy didn't take her. I was so pissed when I found out that she was lying to her mom about that. And when he did go in and SD tagged along she kept telling him that she'd better not tell her mom she was in there because her mom would be pissed.

So, after all that babbling, am I wrong for allowing an 8 year old to make decisions about her hair? I know that BMs would prefer to make those choices for their daughters, but when we have full custody for 9 months out of the year I feel like it's my place to allow it, especially when I have her father's approval on what she wants done.

Ninji's picture

I don't know why people get so upset about hair. It will grow back.

Whether or not you over steps your bounds is between your DH and you.

I think that BM is way out of line. No way should she be saying any of that stuff to a child. If she had a problem with the way SD's hair was cut, she should talk to DH. Not involve the child.

mama4u3's picture

My thoughts exactly! Poor girl was so proud, until she told her mom. I'd never want my children to think I was disappointed in them for their choice in haircuts, or for them to be afraid to tell me they did something like that. (This is also coming from the mom who's son just graduated with bright blue hair.) I guess some people value looking perfect, and their daughters looking like dolls, more than I will ever understand.

mama4u3's picture

when my bio boys were about 8ish I dyed their hair crazy colors, did mohawks, all sorts of stuff. After this battle (and my ex hearing part of the 90 minute fight between BM and BD) I smiled and thanked him for never getting mad at me for what I did with the boys hair. He laughed and said "that was not even worth a fight, it's hair and grows back" Thank God my ex and I are friends and laugh together more than most exs do!

Stepped in what momma's picture

I don't know why,I don't have any bio's of my own but I think I would be upset if someone else got my kids haircut without my approval---even if it is the way the kid said they wanted it, especially an 8 YO.

Let BM deal with her hair on one of the weekends/Holiday she has her, she can pay for the cost to cut it and you can be done with it especially since you're now dealing with a smart mouth skid. BM is out of line telling kid what she told her, that conversation should have been with BD.

mama4u3's picture

If I had a daughter I'm pretty sure I would want to be the one in charge of haircuts also, but we told her mom for weeks that it was scheduled, and if she wanted to take her in before that she was welcome (SD was with her for 7 days the week before). BM asked us to wait 2 more weeks, but I couldn't take the arguing and screaming every time daddy did her hair in the morning. She was set up just for a trim (super long curly hair gets super tangled easily), but SD begged us to let her get it short. Had BM set up a trim, or anything else, I would not have taken her.

momandmore's picture

I cut SD8's hair into a pretty short style about 6 months ago. BM still has no clue. YSD has purple and brown lowlights in her hair.. BM has no clue. (I made her think about it for about 3 months before I cut it)

4ever's picture

I thought i was the only one dealing with haircut issues with my stepdaughter. Her mom has forbidden her dad from ever having her hair cut and the result is long natty broken hair. I would braid it for her and she loved it and then she'd come back from a visit with her mom with her hair unbraided. Okay, fine. But now that she's 12, she wanted to get it cut to her shoulders. I think peer pressure finally sunk in and she's tired of looking raggedy in middle school. ANyway she said to her dad 'would you take me to get my hair cut Mommy said I can't' and he said 'I think you're old enough to decide how you want your hair unless you decide to shave your head or something crazy." so I found a great salon (back when I was Uberstepmom) and we all went she loved the whole experience and came out of the salon smiling the biggest happy smile. Her mom called right then as we were getting in the car and I don't know why but my stepdaughter told her she got a haircut and then I guess her mom asked her to text her a picture so she did and then my husband's phone blew up and he's driving with his ex yelling in his ear and I look in the backseat and my stepdaughter is bawling. When minutes before she'd been so happy and felt so pretty and loved. I'm so tired of that shit.

To answer your question if your stepdaughter wanted the haircut and your husband was okay with it I don't understand the drama, I really don't. As someone said its hair and it grows back and I'm sure she looked really cute!

Edited to add: yes to what CheifGrownup said, that the dad has just as much say as the mom (or more in your situation). Why do some moms think they somehow own their children's bodies and lives? Dads are parents too!

ChiefGrownup's picture

No wonder your sd gets mixed up. What a trash act that was of BM. I know you're disengaging now but I would have asked to dh to put in a no-drama rule. Meaning when we know the situation is ripe for drama, calls from bm do not get answered.

My dh tells me ss's hair was as long as a girl's for many years. BM didn't want it cut. One day at the park a man complimented dh on his "two pretty daughters." DH stopped caring about BM's rules and went straight to the barber. SS has had a proper hairstyle ever since. Funny, when these guys stand up to bm they CAN get some good results.

ChiefGrownup's picture

The girl's father made the decision. He has not only as much right as bm but more since he has dramatically more custody.

I would have told sd, "That's a shame your mommy doesn't like your pretty hair. Rememer, YOU asked your daddy to do it and he said YES. When you are in this home, DADDY is in charge of you not BM and I help Daddy and it's my home so I am in charge, too. But your mommy is never in charge in this house."

As for dissing the hairdresser I would have come out like an avenging angel on that: Hairdresser was kind enough to cut a little girl's hair when it's more profitable for her to do adults. You meant to tell me how grateful you are, right? Also -- let's take a look at her qualifications. She has a license. She has to know chemistry. Bla bla bla. When you have those achievements maybe you can have an opinion, but in this house we respect friends and professionals. Period.

Having said all that, I'm not a big fan of an 8 year old getting any kind of hair color that can't be rinsed out a la mermaid pink or something. Don't have strong feelings about it, though. DO have strong feelings about allowing 8 yr old to infect my house with BM's snottiness and disrespect.

4ever's picture

"I would have told sd, "That's a shame your mommy doesn't like your pretty hair. Rememer, YOU asked your daddy to do it and he said YES. When you are in this home, DADDY is in charge of you not BM and I help Daddy and it's my home so I am in charge, too. But your mommy is never in charge in this house." I will remember this!

mama4u3's picture

That's pretty close to what was said. BM and daddy fought for about 90 minutes on the phone over the whole issue. She threatened to take him to court because a hair cut is a "major" decision and those should be made by both parents. He couldn't stop laughing!

AllySkoo's picture

I think I see something very slightly different from what others have said. I think you've got TWO issues here.

The first is the hair. Nah, if you guys are custodial, you didn't overstep. Maybe just make sure that DAD is the one who (vocally, in front of SD) gives permission for whatever haircut she wants. But honestly, you did that. Which brings us to issue two.

The lying. You already caught her lying to BM. Why on earth do you think she didn't ALREADY lie? And that she's not lying to you guys? It really REALLY sounds to me like she's trying to play her parents against each other. You would be amazed how common that is, and you don't even need "bad" kids or a high conflict BM for it to happen. So what if it went down like this?

BM sees SD's haircut and says something innocuous like, "Oh, you got your hair cut!"
SD: "Daddy MADE me cut my hair, I didn't want to! And I HATE these stupid streaks! Mommy, Daddy and SM are so mean, it's my hair and I wanted YOU to cut it!"
BM, obviously, flips out. Because that's her kid and, lousy mother she may be, but she still gets pissed if anyone (you in particular) is mean to her kid.

SD spends the weekend being coddled and "comforted" by BM. Well, that worked so well, why not try it again?
"Daddy, Mommy is so mean! Just listen to all the crazy mean things she says about you! And she says she's my only REAL parent and only SHE can make decisions!" It is entirely possible that SD is lying, or at least wildly exaggerating, what BM said.

I dunno. You're there, I'm not, so I don't know how much of what "BM said" is what you heard from SD versus what you heard from BM. But I wouldn't discount the idea that BM's reaction might be based at least in part on lies SD has told in the past, or even about this. Unfortunately, the only way to stop the lying and trying to play one house against the other is to have a Come To Jesus meeting with Dad, Mom, and SD in the same room at teh same time. If she's high conflict anyway, that might not be possible.,

ChiefGrownup's picture

This could very well be true but op says the "chewing out" occurred over the phone while sd was at op's house so less likely than if she'd been at bm's for the weekend.

I don't think bm has any custody over the school year, does she? Just sporadic events or visits?

In any case, shutting down sd's behavior and making it clear that crap doesn't fly in this house still seems like the solution to me. If she doesn't get the payoff, she'll stop the lying/playing off bit anyway.

mama4u3's picture

You are correct about the lying!!! I've caught her a million times in other areas, and it's been made very clear that lying to me is one of the worst things to do. BM is high drama, high conflict, and has the "pity me always" attitude, and a compulsive liar. SD is horribly attention seeking to the point that when she returns she doesn't care if it's positive or negative attention, as long as it's attention. SD is also very conflicted between the two houses and the guilt she feels when she and I go do anything fun, she never tells her mom what we do because her mom goes into "you weren't with me, so I need your pity." SD doesn't say much about what BM says, but it comes through in her actions and emotions, and we can hear BMs phone convos with SD, it's really a sad situation.

It's a constant battle for me to keep my mouth shut about all of it with SD, but she's 8 and shouldn't be involved in the "adult problems." It's really sad to watch her get pulled and torn as her moms guilts SD for being with us, makes her cry about it, and then goes to BMs house for a couple days and is basically ignored. Dad has tried a million times to tell mom what the little girl needs and wants, and all mom does is say that she does all of that and so much more. The funniest was listening to an 8 yo yell at her mom for lying to her and dad about things. I asked her to be honest on the phone with her mom one night, and she was in tears and very honest, BM still blew it off and convinced SD she was just confused and didn't remember correctly.

I've almost come to terms with the fact that after BM lied to me over and over, we will never be able to sit down and talk, and listening to the crap she talks (sometimes Facebook can be a real curse) kills me. I try to do what is best for the little girl, but some days its really hard!

triplea2006's picture

I personally think that this is up to the cp, unless otherwise discussed. Since sd lives with y'all it is dh's call. With that being said, in most situations the bm should be consulted. Dh wanted me to take sd9 to get her haircut and I told him only if he asked bm if I could take her. Bm said yes (dh conveniently forgot to tell her that I was the one physically taking sd). Bm freaked out and told sd her haircut was uneven and whoever cut it did not do a good job (so not true, it was expensive and it was more feminine to overcompensate for sd more masculine features). The next thing I knew bm took her to get her hair recut and this time it was back to the choppy style that makes sd look like a boy :(.

mama4u3's picture

I agree that the parents should talk on most things, and I will definitely never venture into the haircut world again with her. Heck, I won't do much of anything with SD anymore because of how BM makes her feel if she does anything fun with me. It's even worse when BMs try to change what you did, make it worse, and seem to only do it to show control. Poor kids!!

IamexhaustedSM's picture

This is just another way BMs PAS and assert themselves as "THE MOM".

Listen, if you have the skid for more than 50% and BM does not take skid to get a hair cut then I see NOTHING wrong with the CP doing it or the CP's spouse. I took YSD and DD to get their hair cuts. I would have dared BM to say something to me. I pay for YSD. I buy her food, clothes and pay to put a roof over her head, phone, electric, water and fun. Tell BM to kiss your ass and to stop fucking with SD head or have DH tell the bitch that. Your SD is only repeating what her BM told her and I bet BM ranted and bitched till SD cried. That is what those crazy bitches always do. Probably told SD her hair looked bad and you did it to her on purpose.

Just think you still have to get to the puberty stage and who is going to talk to SD about boys, periods and babies? I had the real talk with YSD about all this and the truth about boys. The only thing BM knows about boys is to screw them, use them, and leave them.

misSTEP's picture

Control. It is all about control. I never took my skids for haircuts. We weren't primary either so it normally didn't affect us.

One thing that did bother me was that SD was always so proud of her long beautiful hair. So that Xmas, I bought one of those things for girls that had a bunch of hair clips and ties etc. She loved it!

Next time she came back, her hair was cropped short. I asked her if she went to get her hair cut. She said yes but seemed sad about it and didn't want to talk.

Another time was when my DH bought her a beautiful necklace with her birthstone in it for her birthday. BM called and must have asked what she got for presents. SD told her about the necklace her dad bought for her. I don't know what BM said but then SD said, "No...no...NO! It's really NICE! I like it!" After the conversation, she took the necklace off and put it in the jewelry box we also got her...and never wore it again.

Nobody will EVER convince me that BM was not PASing the hell out of those skids.

I.hate.cats's picture

Had the same issue with short hair on SD6, though ours was a bit different. SD cut a chunk out of the front of her hair. We waited for BM to have her brother's wife fix it because God forbid she actually takes her to get it cut and :gasp: pays for it! After weeks of it looking worse than normal, since BM never brushes or styles SD's hair, which she claimed was because SD fights her on it, Dh and I finally took her. She picked out an angled bob after we looked through pics on Pinterest for days and DH even sent BM a pic ahead of time, so there was no freak out. After the fact SD LOVED it and on our time, I still braid the front or do piggies, twists or whatever and BM still does nothing with the exception of the week after DH asked her to give him placement for the summer. She made an attempt at being a mother and braided it, when DH told BM that it looked nice and she should do it more often, she claimed that she ALWAYS did that and that was why she didn't want us to get it cut short. I love when they contradict themselves via text.

We're always doing things with the other kids hair and SD6 wants to be able to have blonde or pink in hers as well, but the most I'll do is use washout spray. BM never does anything with SD6's hair which is just sad, in her school pics, she was the only girl not in a dress with pretty hair. When I was young I wanted to chop off my long locks and get a bob, my parents let me and I hated it; lesson learned, think before you act. With the drastic shit that kids are doing to their hair these days, it's pathetic that you get broads like this complaining about something reasonable.

bradybunch2013's picture

I have to say I'm a BM that got upset about a hair issue a couple years ago but in my defense I have primary custody and her dad NEVER involved himself in decisions of any kind concerning the kids, let alone my DD7s hair. She came back from her weekend at dad's and her bangs had been chopped off...by his girlfriend! Uneven and all. My DD and I had decided a while back to try and grow her bangs out and it was a long process so when she came back with them hacked off I cried. She said they didn't even ask her if she wanted them cut and her being young she didn't think she got to have a say in it. I did ream her BDs ass for it too! That has ALWAYS been my department and he never even bothered to ask me if I minded. Then again, he's all about his little power trips to spite me :/