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Ex missing visits- wants to give away to grandparents

YoungMommyof4's picture

So my ex was supposed to make his visit a few weeks ago. He didn’t message me at all to let me know he was planning to miss. I had to get ahold of him to make sure he was going to come. He told me he couldn’t due to financial troubles (he’s out of state, so I tried to be understanding) I’m not sure when he was planning to tell me . Then he asked if he could make up his visit a few weeks later and I agreed . I message him to make sure he was coming and got a similar reply about financial troubles and he couldn’t make it but now he’s asking if his mother (whom he lives with) can have his weekend with DD. Idk how to approach this . What should I do?

zerostepdrama's picture

If his mother lives with him, where is he going to be if he is giving his visitation to his mom? I'm confused.

hereiam's picture

So, his mother would come and get your DD and take her back to her house? Where your ex lives, also? Or what?

YoungMommyof4's picture

No, they come to my state to visit her for a weekend. He’s asking if his mom can have his whole weekend visit with my DD since he can’t come due to financial troubles

hereiam's picture

But, not stay with you, correct?

How do feel about his mom? If she is trustworthy and you want your DD to visit with her (and she wants to), I think it would be okay.

YoungMommyof4's picture

I moved during pregnancy. We agreed on our first agreement then it was changed after going back to court so my DD now goes out of state for some weeklong visits .

Rags's picture

If he facilitates the kid's travel to his location it really doesn't matter who the kid spends the time with. We fought this battle with the SpermGrandHag/SpermClan in court and the Judge was clear. BioDad's time was his time to do with as he pleased and if he didn't choose to see the kid and dumped the kid with SpermGrandHag so be it.

I wouldn't even reply were I you. If daddy can pawn the costs of his visitation time off on his mommy...and his mommy wants to see her grandkid, at least someone in that half of the kid's gene pool gives a crap enough to spend time with them.

My Skid's SpermIdiot rarely saw the Skin during SpermLand visitation. SS spend the overwhelming majority of his SpermLand visitation time with SpermGrandHag who was raising the three younger SpermIdiot spawned half sibs by two other baby mamas in her and SpermGrandPa's home of residence without aid of her idiot son.

My heart breaks for your child(ren). Just as my heart broke for my own SS for the 16+ years we lived under the CO.

Thumper's picture

He isn't missing visits. A non custodial parent never ever has to take visitation. Didn't your lawyer tell you that? So please don't be one of those moms and say "DAD is missing visits"...he is not.

BUT when he does want to exercise his visitation you must have the child ready to go. Making plans to interfere and block visitation is wrong if you do it by accident.. That is For your future reference.

Here are my two cents...if my ex (and I have one from a zillion years ago), IF my ex told me he wanted to see our kids but could not because he was broke. I would say, ok do you need gas money and hotel?

Ma'am I bet he pays you child support, maybe arrears. Give the guy enough money to come see his kid and hook him up with a hotel for 2nights too. USE his cs money to do this and let him know...EX, YOU matter in our babies life and the last thing I want to do is prevent you from seeing him/her. Monday morning I am going to modify this child support order so YOU have extra money so YOU can travel.

IF your broke too Ma'am, be creative and find a wayTo make this work.

TRUST me in 10 years from now your kid will thank you....mine did. ex and I split physical custody and there was zero child support exchanged.


Do the right thing.

YoungMommyof4's picture

Sorry but I’ve never had a lawyer tell me that and therefore what would be the purpose of a court order. I’m pretty sure I clarified that I try to be understanding in my post because he does live out of state. I would rather he spend his weekend with dd. I did not have a child with grandmother. He’s the parent and she needs that time with him. There is more to the story but that isn’t the point. Thank you for your reply as you do have good points.

YoungMommyof4's picture

She is 5

Rags's picture

While I agree that BioDad should be the one with the kid during visitation our experience with the family law legal system is that dad's (NCP) time is dad's time. He can do with it as he chooses including dumping the kid on someone else and not seeing the kid at all to foregoing one or more scheduled visitations all together and anywhere in between. The NCP can only do this during their CO'd visitation time though.

On rescheduling refused or missed visitation our CO is clear. Any visitations the SpermIdiot refused or missed were gone and could not be rescheduled unless my DW specifically agreed.... which she/we never did.

Just J's picture

I'm sorry but this is terrible advice. Maybe you enjoy being a martyr, I don't know, but this is a grown man and his financial troubles are not his ex's to take care of. Why can't he ask his mom to help pay for a trip to see his kid? Why should the OP use her money or money meant for their child for him to see his kid? If he's a grown up living with his mom, he obviously can't manage money for sh!t and it's not his ex's responsibility to get him out of the financial mess that he created himself.

hereiam's picture

The guy will be working. She cannot force him to come for his visitation instead of going to his job. She is also not obligated to pay for him to visit his child.

If he is not taking his visitation, he's missing visits. No, he's not legally obligated to visit, but he is not exercising his visitation rights just the same, which means he is missing visits, as in, not there to visit her.

Rags's picture

I concur than an NCP is not obligated to actually take their court ordered visitation. One of the only advantages that an NCP has is that they do not have to take CO'd visitation. When they refuse visitation the CP still has to care for the child. Though disagree that a "He isn't missing visits". He is absolutely missing visitations though to people of character this makes no sense as people of character would see their kid come hell or high water.

My SS's BioDad rarely saw the kid though the broader SpermClan cared for him when he was in SpermLand on CO'd visitation. Our visitation schedule was a long distance one as we never lived within 1200 miles of SpermLand. The SpermIdiot had 7wks+/- of visitation per year (5wks summer, 1wk+/- winter, 1wk spring).

Though I never had any use for any of those wastes of flesh I did feel that it was important that SS have a relationship with that part of his family. A kid should never feel that part of their family doesn't give a crap about them. Over the course of our 16+ years under the CO there were several periods where they went for more than a year without exercising visitation supposedly due to financial issues. Though it burned my butt to give them benefit of 1 penny of my resources, I/we would offer to pay for their half of visitation travel expenses in order for the Skid to be able to maintain a relationship with them.

It was the right thing to do though as I said it singed my butt.

In the end my SS-25 fully understood the entire situation and also knew who really cared and had his best interests at heart.

A few months before he turned 23 he asked me to adopt him. We contacted out attorney and 4 days later the adoption order was signed by a judge. Thou I had always been the only REAL dad he has ever had hat was one of the proudest days of my life. My son now wears the family name on his uniform. Smile

Disneyfan's picture

He is missing visits. While he isn't obligated to take his time, he is making the CHOICE to miss the time that has scheduled for him.

Using CS money to cover dad's travel and lodging expenses is pretty messed up. I can't imagine any self respecting man going along with that.

queensway's picture

I would say no to this. The child can visit grandparents when your ex has his time with her.

Thumper's picture

Thanks for your reply. I have strong opinions about what it is your doing. It happens far to often.

YoungMommyof4's picture

Ok that is fine but I don’t understand what is it you “think” I am doing and maybe you misinterpreted it with me not wanting him to see his child or my child see her father. That is not the case.

Thumper's picture

OMG Queensway it is DADS TIME,,,he can do with it what he wants too. It is not up to this MOMMYOF4

Just like BM's who pawn their kids off on Granny (bm's parents) during Bm's time...shouting "they need to bond with my parents' ...blahh blahhh blahhhh barf.

Just J's picture

Goodluck, I don't understand what you mean by "it is DADS TIME, he can do with it what he wants too. It is not up to this MOMMYOF4.."

If the kid was going to dad's, then yes, I'd agree with you. But the arrangement is dad is supposed to come to mom's state for the visit, so mom is not obligated to let grandma do the visit instead. The kid can visit grandma on dad's time in dad's state.

I'm not sure why you have such disdain for the OP. She's not trying to keep dad away from the kid and you're implying she's a sh!t mom if she doesn't pay for dad to visit his kid. I think dad is a sh!t dad for not figuring out a way to visit himself. Not sure why he's getting such a pass.

twoviewpoints's picture

How far is the trip from Dad's town to your town? Are you talking one way two hours? One way five hours or even more such as one way twelve hours? Out of state really doesn't say much.

I am going to assume you receive a nice little sum of monthly child support for your daughter? I imagine it is expensive for Dad to pay CS, miss work if he is scheduled that weekend, travel to your town and pay hotel, meals and entertainment for both he and his child. I'm sure you remember it was you who chose to move and make the traveling and extra cost also.

Are you really going to deny letting Grandma spend a bit of time with her granddaughter, just because Grandma isn't Dad? I did notice you clearly say "my daughter, my daughter, my daughter" each time you mention the child, never 'our child', not even when speaking of the father or the child's paternal grandmother.

Just my opinion, but I think you need to rethink your stance, this other side of the family are just as important to the child as you and your maternal side of her family.

I am going to finally assumed this grandmother is not a flight with the child risk nor a physical risk to the child or you would have immediately stated so when writing here about the grandmother asking for the visit over the father who cant make the trip due to work and money concerns.

Rags's picture

While I agree with the premise of your comments I take more of a value and character based approach to judge the importance of a relationship. No kid should be forced to be exposed to family relationships where those parties repeatedly demonstrate that the kid is of little importance.

While some people certainly can be overcome by events beyond their control, past performance is the best predictor of future behavior and if this guy has a history of this crap then the OP does not necessary have any obligation to mitigate his idiocy.

beebeel's picture

OP moved while pregnant, making it difficult from the get-go. I don't know too many young people still living at home who can afford hotels and out of state travel on a regular basis.

Rags's picture

Important additional information for me to consider. Thanks.

An interesting parallel to my own wife. She had SS at 16 (SpermIdiot was 22). She went on to graduate with her HS class with honors and left the state for college taking SS with her. She had sole physical and legal custody and the paternity order did not include any visitation element so it wasn't a take the kid and run thing.

The DipShitIot made no effort to see the kid though he would promise to visit including giving her his arrival times at the airport. Several times she rode half a dozen busses to the airport to meet him and .... no SpermIdiot.

Only when the small town grapevine was talking about my DW meeting and dating someone did he whine to SpermGrandHag about missing his kid. She was the one who put the first shot across DW's bow starting the 16+ year legal battle by filing for custody on behalf of her toothless moron waste of skin POS son.

He never paid a penny of the CO'd CS. SpermGrandHag and SpermGrandPa paid it for him. They also paid his CS obligation on his three younger also out of wedlock spawn by to other baby mamas and raised those three in their home. Yes, they had to pay the baby mamas in order to keep the kids.

The entire gene pool is so shallow and polluted that it makes me cringe. Except for my Skid and my bride of course.

twoviewpoints's picture

"I take more of a value and character based approach to judge the importance of a relationship. No kid should be forced to be exposed to family relationships where those parties repeatedly demonstrate that the kid is of little importance."

And what opportunities has the father had? OP picked herself up and moved, while pregnant. Is he to quit his job (you know, that annoyance adults are expected to do so they can child support)?

To a small degree, I will say I agree every effort should be made. However I believe in a fair playing ground. Picking up and moving 'out of state' (distance still to be determined) while pregnant does not quite equate to a fair beginning. And not everyone can just hand their employer the schedule they'd wish to work and expect to receive said schedule. Simply saying find another job so this father has Friday through Monday off and still makes good money to support child and traveling expenses plus other bills , yeah... I am sure those jobs are a dime a dozen :O

My SS did indeed make the long trip every weekend to see his son. Did so for many years. But it was he who moved (to better himself to support his son financially). SS lived a good nine to ten hours one way and he took a job that scheduled him 3days a week at 12-14hr day shifts (full salary). Then he would jump on his cycle and make the long trip to his son. Then back home just in time to start his next shift. But my SGS was not a baby or toddler during these years. SGS was between nine-ish and finally 14 during the time. Then father got full custody and son moved to SS's town.

Rags's picture

Opportunities are earned not granted. That is where personal accountability comes to play. My mother is fond of saying that we all inherit baggage from our parents but at some point those issues become our own issues to solve. The BioDad's opportunities or lack of opportunities are not relevant in my opinion. His actions are.

In our case the CO was clear that each party was responsible for the costs of transporting the child to their location. My DW did not allow for a lack of relevant structure in the CO to stand for long. Neither did the BioDad's clan though he had next to nothing to do with it. It was SpermGrandHag that drive it from that side.

If the CO does not address long distance visitation then it should be modified. The NCP can drive that just as well as the CP can.

I applaud your SS for making the effort to be a participating father in his child's life.

He sets a good example.

steppingback's picture

I don't see why grandma can't come to visit, unless there is something untoward about grandma. I also don't see how mom has to foot the bill for dad's visitation, unless it is in the court order.

Rags's picture

Certainly GranMa should be able to come visit. However, if it is a long distance visitation situation there can tend to be a tendency for the courts to not disrupt the kid's normal routine in their usual place of residence.

Our CO allowed for NCP to have a 10 day visitation in our area of residence each October. The stipulation for that was that the NCP had to make sure the kid didn't miss his usual school and extracurricular obligations. No one in the SpermClan ever took that visitation though we would have been fine with it if they had. Though there was not a snowballs chance in hell we would would allowed them to stay with us if they had chosen to take that part of their CO'd visitation.

YoungMommyof4's picture

Ok you all make good points which is why I came to the forum. I did not start this to start trouble or bring in the judgementals. Yes I said “my daughter” is she not? Im sorry I didn’t realize that’s against the rules to use because I was talking about her dad. That has nothing to do with anything I asked. Like I SAID BEFORE.....I UNDERSTAND HE HAS TO WORK . We all have bills to pay. I was just unsure of the situation and if I should send her with grandma for the weekend or (and I have had more time to think) give him more time in summer so he can spend with her without him having to make extra trips or spend extra money. So thank you all.

Acratopotes's picture

I am totally different on this....

If he can't come down to visit his daughter due to financial issues, but his parents wants to keep in contact with their grand child, I will allow it. This means his parents is not enabling him, yes he lives with them and they easily could've paid for him to visit, but they feel he's an adult and should deal with his life.

I have no problem with Grans keeping in touch, I would simply say, yes by all means, this is the best option for accommodation, close to my house and fair pricing. You are welcome to come over to my house and visit DD, but unfortunately DD will not be able to leave my house without me.

Then simply observe the "play date" DD does not know these people, but they can get to know each other, I will make sure there's a nice finger lunch for every one, or some cake and coffee....

Your relationship with this guy did not work out, there's no reason why there should be any hostility between you and his parents and DD has the right to know her whole family, you keep on having visits at your home till you are comfortable and till the Grand parents understand that this is a huge step forward and you have to trust every one involved, completely, DD can never blame you, you kept her from her family.....
instead of screaming at you in 10 years time, it's your fault I don't know these people, she will scream at her dad, you never bothered visiting me stop giving me excuses, Gran came to visit me, you could've made plans as well..

Think long term Hon, think long term

Iamwoman's picture

He can do with his time as he wants, unless you have right of first refusal. If you have right if first refusal, then whenever he is too busy to watch your child, you have first rights to watch her for him.

That being said, any judge would see that you are being very generous and flexible with your time. Legally, you are only required offer a makeup visit if you are the one responsible for him missing his visit. Since he is the one choosing to miss his visit, he is not legally entitled to makeup time. Claiming financial hardship is still considered a choice in his part, as it is not your fault at all.

I hope this info helps. I’ve been in the family court system long enough as both a bio and step mom to know the info I just gave you is 100% correct.

YoungMommyof4's picture

Thank you. None of the stuff you mentioned was laid out in our CO so I had no idea. I’m working with him to see if he would like to have her for more time in the summer.