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Need advice re: My partner and daughter.

ValleysDad's picture

Hi all,

I am the BF of a six-year old girl. I separated from her mother when she was 3. I've had a great relationship with her since then. The ex has historically been difficult, rude and downright bitchy at times, but has recently mellowed due to being in a new relationship, which is fine by me. I have been in a relationship for over a year with someone I love very much.

There are two problems I have:

1. My daughter does not speak to my partner beyond a 'hello' and 'goodnight' when she comes to stay.
2. My partner believes that my daughter is being manipulative, and that the solution to this is strong discipline, rather than trying to establish a bond with her. She refuses to engage in any sort of activity with my daughter until she 'shows respect'

I do not think my daughter is a little angel, and am in favour of strong boundaries for children. However, my daughter is well-liked at school by both her teachers and friends, and is popular. My partner is a lovely, principled person, but is very 'old-school' when it comes to children, and their discipline.

My ex thinks that it is my partner who is the problem, and that my daughter is merely shy.

I have asked my partner to try an activity with my daughter, such as making a cake, but she flatly refuses....

Any ideas? I'm worried that this issue will have serious consequences for my relationships here. I currently don't have a solution, and would appreciate advice

Thanks in advance...

overworkedmom's picture

Honestly if she wont try any suggestions you have for bonding, she just might not be interested. If full custody is not something that you are looking for and you only have your daughter on the weekends I would suggest offering your GF to go do things by herself on the weekends and you and your daughter have time alone.

I would personally love if I didn't have to deal with my SS all the time (he lives with me and DH full time) and if my hubby ever offers me a break, I jump on it!

KimD's picture

I am speaking from the point of view of the partner of the man that has the daughter. Don't take away from your weekend time together. Work keeps us from seeing a lot of each other during the week. Weekends should be spent together. And Op - Stop trying to force the relationship between your daughter and your partner. They will either get along or they wont.

Aeron's picture

If your SO has tried to speak to your DD and DD ignores her and refuses to answer, I can totally see why she would want something done Before she tries to bond or do activities. I wouldn't be thrilled about trying to do an activity with someone that refuses to speak to me either.

There isn't a whole lot of detail here about their interaction so I'm not sure what else to tell you at this point.

I am also curious as to why you're talking to your ex about this... This should be handled between you and your Partner. Not your ex partner. Unless your DD is going back to mom and complaining about your SO, what happens in your household should be dealt with in your household only.

TASHA1983's picture

Well, I think that if your GF wants a relationship or to do things with your child it should be HER choice and on her terms for the most part. You will build and receive alot of resentment from your GF if you try to FORCE your child and creating/having a relationship with her on your GF.

Blended family relationships are very hard for most people involved, but the worst mistake you can make is to force it before either of them is ready and willing to have a relationship in the first place.

Cadence's picture

I highly recommend that you pick up the book "Stepmonster" by Wednesday Martin to really understand the dynamics here.

First of all, it's great that your daughter greets your GF and says goodnight to her. But what does she do the rest of the time? Does she treat her like she's invisible? Does she avoid her? Neither of those are okay. You can't make your daughter like your girlfriend, but she also can't be allowed to ignore her or treat her as if she is subhuman. Think of how your daughter would be expected to treat a teacher, and use those as guidelines for acceptable behavior around your girlfriend.

How well-liked your daughter is by others isn't really relevant. Even the sweetest of kids can turn around and be a monster to a stepparent. All those other kids and teachers at school aren't going to be blamed by a kid who thinks that if she can just get rid of that mean lady daddy is dating, things will be all right in the world. That's just the way kids think, and it is unique to the step-parenting dynamic. You'll understand more when you read the book.

As others have said, you really need to get a handle on your daughter, starting today. It's okay if she's hurt or feeling bad that her parents aren't together. Those are normal feelings for her to have. The problems begin when she is allowed to act out on those feelings. Your girlfriend will be the scapegoat for your daughter's angst and anger, no matter what. As the girlfriend, that's a hard thing to deal with. It can be tough to be disliked just because you're there and in love with someone who happens to be a father. You feel like your life is at the mercy of the past; a past you had no part in creating.

As for that girlfriend, when she's ready, she does need to try. This won't work for long if she just wants to live side by side with a young child. Have her read the book too, then talk to eachother. What sort of action steps can the two of you come up with in order to make your GF feel like she's ready to try to get to know your daughter? You need to have a plan. If your girlfriend doesn't want to do that, then you as a parent have to start understanding that this may not be a good choice of a person to have in your daughter's life. You do want someone who is willing to try. Maybe her efforts with your kid will go nowhere, and then it's okay to default back into being "daddy's girlfriend/wife". But she does have to see if she can develop some sort of relationship with your daughter first.

In the meantime, can you make sure that the three of you go out and do things together that don't necessarily require interaction? Going to a fair or something like that comes to mind - all three of you can be there together and going on rides, but there's no pressure to interact with one another. Something low pressure where you're all together like this can encourage bonds to form. So I'd hold off on the high-pressure things like cake-baking because it doesn't sound like either of them are ready for that.

And you need to stop thinking about this like "Well, her mom and my daughter like baking together, surely girlfriend just needs to do it with her and things will be swell!" It's not the same thing. At all. Your daughter is wired to love her mother and want her attention; your daughter is wired to feel that the girlfriend is an intruder and try her hardest to reject her until you as a Dad step up and change that. Trying too hard at this stage to make your daughter and girlfriend bond when your daughter isn't open to it is probably going to fail spectacularly.

P.S. You are absolutely awesome for coming here to ask for advice, by the way. Mostly we see dads who just want to bury their heads in the sand and ignore all of the problems. By their inaction, they create more problems and set up their new family to fail.

P.P.S. Don't let your guard down about your ex. If she's had a history of being difficult, expect her to start causing hell once she finds out about any new milestones in your relationships. Many ex-wives stir up trouble once they start to feel like they're being replaced, even if they themselves have moved on with someone new. If yours has a history of causing trouble, she is at high risk. It can't hurt to be prepared.

ValleysDad's picture

Thanks very much for all this everyone, some wise words of experience. I will come back and write more when I've had more time to digest the above. Daughter is with us later this afternoon, and I plan to continue being firm with her that she should treat my partner as she would any other person....speak soon all....

confusedmomof3's picture

I simply can not agree with this enough..

I have lived it for almost 4 years and if the dad doesn't set the ground work early, you and your relationship are screwed.

luchay's picture

Absolutely!

Trust dtzy on this, and your daughter is young enough that if you do the groundwork NOW you will have a chance at building a great relationship - but you have to do it NOW.

Trust ME on that! I am the SM of a just turned 13 yo SD and she to put it frankly is a right little bitch to me. But what do I hear from her dear dad (yes, my lover, my life partner)??? I get comments like "But everyone else LOVES my daughter, her teachers, friends, family - everyone thinks she is an amazing person, beautiful and caring and wonderful" No offense but the kid is a manipulative lying bitch.

BECAUSE OH has never taught her that she is to RESPECT ME. Been in her life since she was 9. Last Saturday was the first time OH called her on her BS and told her it's NOT ok.

surfchica's picture

Luchay....I hear the same thing from my spouse about my SD10..."she is a perfect child...everybody says how well behaved she is...I don't know why you are so critical of her". It is because THEY DON"T LIVE WITH HER and have to trip over all the crap she leaves all over, see the toilet unflushed, see not wash her hands or brush her teeth, etc etc. I am hoping that my spouse doesn't take 3 years to call her on her shit. Can you tell us more of your story?

zurdibus's picture

I do think that your daughter needs to be guided to interact in more positive ways with your partner. However, without more information than you have given I have a feeling your partner is also over reacting and expecting something that won't possibly occur without her putting in effort as well.

I have a SD4 and a SD6 and her mother and I are expecting their 4th sister, my first and only daughter in a couple months. Things weren't much different between me and my SD4 when I first moved in, she did talk to me a bit more and we had known each other since about the time she turned 3.

However, she would repeatedly ask her mom if I could just go home, be upset that I was there again. She would however, like to stand on my and jump on me and then when I would make sure she didn't fall then go tell her mom I was mean to her.

Her mom's roll in this was to eventually tell her that if she wasn't going to tell me I was mean to her at the time and specify how I was being mean to her (she was still 3 at the time) that she could no longer play with me. She would also ask why she wanted me to go home, etc to get to the bottom of what her feelings were etc, but obviously never ask me to go home. She did however spend more alone time with her daughters, taking them to the mall herself, etc.

My roll in this was to be interact with them mostly when they wanted me to and given the 50/50 custody make sure they had more than enough alone time with their mother in the house but saw me making dinner, doing the laundry, that kind of stuff so they knew I was also responsible for their well being. We always did activities as an entire group, it took at least 4 months before SD6 even wanted to do something alone with me and her sister and a total of 6 before the two of us left the house and did something alone she wanted that her mom couldn't do at the time. SD4 took 8 months before anything like this happened.

After about 3 months things got a lot better and 6 months into it they were seeing me as a step father and interacting more normally before they even knew about their mom being pregnant.

It was clear to me with my SD, and if it isn't your daughter's major concern it is one of them that they were afraid I would take their mother away from them in some way. I had to pay attention and pull back a bit and allow them to see that I was an asset. In many ways their mom spends more time with them and is a better mother to them because she has more time than before I entered their life and she was an excellent mother before. Depending on your custody arrangement getting through that process is going to take longer but should still work.

You do need to make sure that your daughter is treating your partner with respect if nothing else as another adult in the house. Things that are easy first steps to get your daughter to interact more with your partner outside of group activities are if your daughter asks for juice ask her to ask your partner to get it for her etc.

I have rarely had to reprimand my SDs in anyway, if I have they know that if they went to their mom they would get the same or worse from her. Otherwise their mother handles all of this for the time being. This type of interaction fosters more positive feelings and reinforces that I am safe to be around.

ValleysDad's picture

All the above makes sense. Today's experience was my daughter coming into the house, saying 'hello' then flopping sullenly on the couch. This is behaviour I ignore as I deem it unnecessary attention-seeking. My partner and I cracked on with jobs around the house/garden, and my daughter was given the simple task of weeding the patio area. After a few weeds, she sat sullenly, again. With each misdemeanour, my partner is rolling her eyes, something which gets my goat, though I understand her frustration, as I feel it, but try not to let it show. Daughter eventually went to her room to do her own thing and eventually surfaced and then hung around us both, quietly, but in a more amiable mood. I took this as a positive, in that our approach seems to be working, slowly, but my partner focuses on every negative. Partner refuses to engage with ny daughter until she shows respect. I understand why she feels this, but I think a little 'give' on her part woukd help. She uses a very stern voice when speaking to my daughter. my daughter is with us twice a week, normally. Further observations welcome. Smile

Onefootout's picture

Well with my SS16, I don't even get a hello or goodnight. I am completely non-existent unless he needs something. You and my SO have some of the same concerns. Maybe your partner should come on here to vent a little and read Stepmonster. That may help the constant eye rolling. It's probably her way of coping, but I don't know, you have to decide if this is what you want. And you have to decide would it be any different with someone else? Does she have kids of her own that you have to adapt to or get use to? Would you rather date someone with kids? I ask my SO that all the time, and he definitely doesn't want to date someone with kids because he doesn't want to deal with them. Funny how that doesn't help him see my point of view. He still gets all worked up that his son and I barely tolerate each other.

The more you push a relationship between the two, the more your partner will dislike your daughter, I've been there. It's not really the kid, it's the fact that you are telling your partner that you want to determine her role in your family. If she's been on her own for a while and has an independent spirit, like me, that isn't going to fly.

For me, I wish my SO would just let both my SS and myself be. There's no rule that SS has to like me. I came on the scene when he was 15, I doubt there's any way I can develop a relationship with someone who resents the one person who comes between him and his daddy. He's very clingy and he relies on his dad for a lot of his social interaction. And here I come and start doing fun things with his dad that don't include him. Oh, and I also don't kiss his butt!

I hope you can at least see her point of view, and no, we're not all perfect, hence the eye rolling.

zurdibus's picture

I also agree that its a good idea that she read a book and message boards. It sounds like she doesn't have children of her own, and even if she has views on parenting. Step parenting is completely different.

If she is going to constantly talk to the daughter in a stern voice, and depending on what occurs when the daughter is at BMs house, she, the daughter, and ValleysDad are likely going to have a bad time...(although it doesn't sound great now)

20YearsAsAStep-Mom's picture

Yup, eye rolling - she is getting sick of the games. You as the dad need to lay off the GF and focus on your DD. GF does not need to kiss you DD's ass and "work" to form a relationship. GF is there and engaged, DD chooses to ignore and play games. This is the problem not the GF. Good luck.

amber3902's picture

Not trying to attack you, but I notice you are much more forgiving of your daughter's misdemeanours - i.e. flopping on the couch and pouting, than you are of your GF's - i.e. her eye rolls. Why is that?

Here is how I think your GF would have written what happened.

"My partner's daughter came into the house, said 'hello' then flopped sullenly on the couch. My partner said nothing to her about her bad attitude.

So we cracked on with jobs around the house/garden, and my partner's daughter was given the simple task of weeding the patio area. After pulling a few weeds, she stopped and just sat there, pouting. And instead of my partner telling her she needed to finish weeding, he let her quit and go to her room!

Later on she came back out of her room but again, my partner said nothing to her about her bad behavior earlier. I was so annoyed by her bad behavior! I told my partner I am not going to engage with her until she started showing some respect."

You think your "approach seems to be working", I ask what approach? Letting your daughter quit the job she was assigned to do? Letting her get away with pouting all the time? Ignoring bad behavior is not an approach. No wonder your GF is rolling her eyes all the time.

If I was her I'd be doing a lot more than just rolling my eyes at your lack of parenting. Really, I'm not trying to attack you, but what you described is just that. You told her to weed the patio area, and when she quits and pout, you let her go to her room. You let her get away with not doing what she was told to do.

Another thing - you say your ex thinks your GF is the one with the problem. I bet your ex is telling your daughter she doesn't have to listen to your GF and is probably saying all kinds of bad things about your GF to your daughter. Haven't you ever wondered why as soon as your daughter walks in the door she already has an attitude when no one has even done anything to her yet?

ValleysDad's picture

Thanks for the above. I can take any kind of criticism; I don't take it as an attack.

And yes, I absolutely take all the points above; no my GF and daughter are not obliged to have a relationship, I guess, and perhaps it is I who wants some semblance of 'normality' - i.e.: that they are least able to have a civil, 'friendly' relationship.

A recurring issue, for me, is that my GF constantly reminds me that she does not approve of how my daughter came to be (put it this way, she was hardly planned, and I was not married to my ex), and she has fixed, immovable opinions on issues of morality; most of which I agree with, but she applies everything in a ruthlessly black-and-white manner. This is nothing that anyone here can help me with, but it doesn't help things.

I'm in a vicious circle now, where I know my daughter is playing games, showing a blatant lack of respoect, and my GF pretty much shows open hostility in return. I don't know what my ex is telling my daughter, but when I mentioned that my daughter was behaving in this way, the reply I got was 'Poor [daughter]....'. My daughter is fine with me when it's just me and her, but changes when GF comes home. GF tells me that daughter 'does not love me' and 'doesn't give a shit about me'. I'm not sure one can be so sure of the intentions of a 6-year old. GF is 100% sure that she is right.

I've suggested that GF spends a few hours alone with daughter, just to see if they can find some common ground. GF sees this as 'pandering' and will not do so until daughter's attitude improves. Whilst my head supports this approach, my heart just wants them to get along. I don't think everything has been done to achieve this, and I believe GF, as an adult, has the power to at least try this.

I must mention that whilst it may seem that I'm laying a lot of this at my GF's door, I'm not, I am am simply venting my frustrations. If daughter were with me full-time, I'd be able to lay down one set of rules; unfortunately, she goes home to a different set of rules entirely.

I don't feel like there's a solution here. I feel like packing my things and going to live in a cave, frankly.