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Losing my mind!!!

joanna.ds1991's picture

I have a 10 year old step-daughter that spend holidays and the summer with us every year. She has chronic constipation that causes her to poop in her pants constantly. We treat her condition when she is with us per the doctor's recommendations. The problem is that her mother doesn't do anything about it so every time she is returned to our care, the problem is just as bad as it was before. 

I have learned to accept that she has a medical condition. We do our best to deal with it. The thing that I absolutely cannot tolerate anymore is that she lies about it to my face. She hides the disgusting, poop-covered underwear throughout my house for me to find. She went so far as to blame me for it. Sating that they must be my underwear. She doesn't clean herself. She leaves feces everywhere. When confronted with it, she does not care. We have tried everything imaginable to try to solve the issue but she doesn't put in any effort to be responsbile for her own hygeine. 

I have a 1 year old who is starting to get into everything. I feel like my entire house is covered in her bacteria. My son and I both recently came down with a horrible stomach bug that I feel fairly certain was caused by her spreading bacteria everywhere.

I feel uncomfortable being in my own house. I cringe everytime she touches my son or anything else for that matter. I understand medical conditions and would never be mad at her for that but I cannot take the blatant lying and the insolent look she gets on her face when she is confronted with it. I am at my wits end. It has gotten to the point where my husband and I argue about it constantly. I am threatening to move out with our son until he can get his daughter under control. I feel like a monster but I cannot prioritize his daughter over my own mental health and the health of my son. 

Someone please help!

ITB2012's picture

Other than "chronic constipation"? Is she diabetic or have a thyroid problem?

Before I came into the picture YSS had chronic constipation. It was just that he wouldn't/didn't like to poop so he'd hold it in. DH and BM had to do all sorts of things to fix the impaction. It worked itself out but long before he was 10.

This seems behavioral rather than physical. Has she been fully evaluated by someone with whom your DH has been able to communicate or is all the information through BM? Personally I'd take her in for a medical and psych eval.

tog redux's picture

She isn't used to being held accountable for this issue at her mother's, so she's trying to get out of trouble. As hard as it is, you and DH have to stay calm about this. 

I'd set up a reward system for her. Any time she goes in the toilet, she gets 3 stars.  Any time she goes in her pants but tells you about it, she gets 1 star.  If she goes and hides it, she gets none.  She can accumulate "stars" and trade them in for privileges/rewards (or something to this effect).  Doesn't have to break the bank - can be staying up late, playing more games, etc. 

When she does go in her pants (even if she hides it and you find it), she's responsible for cleaning them out and washing them (or throwing them away, whatever you do).  This all has to be done calmly, and with no anger or frustration from you or DH.  She has to know that you guys get she has an issue, but she is expected to be accountable for managing this issue.

Punishment, anger and frustration from you and/or DH will make it more likely she will hide her soiled underwear.  If you have truly accepted that it's a medical issue, then treat it like one. 

joanna.ds1991's picture

When I said we have tried everything, I meant it. We have tried the star chart/reward system. We have taken her to a medical doctor. We follow the doctor's recommednations. We have her on a special diet. We give her the medicine.

We NEVER punish her for pooping in her pants. I am not a monster that would punish someone for that.

LYING is not a medical condition. She lies to my face. Should I not punish her for that? That is just ridiculous. I'm not going to continue to coddle a ten year old and teach her that its okay to lie. 

tog redux's picture

Lying is part of how kids deal with medical conditions that are embarassing for them, and is ALWAYS part of encopresis and enuresis.  Of course she knows how angry you are about it, or she wouldn't be hiding her poop. That's why she does it, to avoid trouble.  Do you really imagine you are hiding your level of frustration from her?

And if you think your son will never lie to you, you are in for a surprise.  But at any rate, perhaps you should leave if you are this upset about it. 

joanna.ds1991's picture

Get the hell off your high horse. I have done HOURS AND HOURS of research on the subject so thank you for your "information". I have consulted with her doctor. I have consulted with a therapist. I didn't come here to be lectured by someone who knows very little about me or the situtaion. 

She doesn't just lie about this. She lies about everything. 

I am not an idiot. I realize that children lie but she lies with no remorse. I am sure my son will lie to me and I will address that issue when it arises.

I came here for some support or some actual advice from someone that maybe has been in a similiar situation, not to have you jump down my throat. 

joanna.ds1991's picture

And just to clarify something for you, I don't want to leave my husband. I love him very much and we are very much the happy family when his daughter is not here. SO HOW ABOUT YOU MOVE ALONG AND FIND SOMEONE ELSE TO BE A JERK TO FOR SEEKING OUT ADVICE ON HOW TO SAVE HER FAMILY.

ProbablyAlreadyInsane's picture

Deep breathes.  Tog is pointing out a good fact.

SD6 had a HUGE lying problem... We went to therapy, did a bit, but not too much, started to notice a pattern. Nearly everything she lied about was something she could (and likely would) get in trouble for.  Which obviously was frustrating for DH and I, because if she told us about things, we'd be WAY less likely to get angry, and more likely to help fix it.  But kids don't understand that. They understand "they're going to be angry."

I agree you should punish for lying, we did. BUT, you also have to give them positive reinforcement on WHY they should tell you what's going on.  For SD6, we discussed it TONS of times, and she's been MUCH better.  It took taking a deep breath when she told us she did something that was frustrating or upsetting, and staying calm.  Emphasizing, she was in trouble, but less trouble than if she had lied or hid it.  It took ages to break the habbit, and it still has tough days.

I don't think anyone is questioning whether you love your husband,  trust me, I've been through and put up with he!! because I love my DH.  But put away the claws.  Everything on this site is a grain of salt type of response.  You pick what you do and do not take, but being frankly a bit rude when someone was giving you a genuine response isn't going to get you very far.

joanna.ds1991's picture

I know I need to calm down. I sorry for being rude. Maybe just maybe I am taking a little pent up frustration out on her because I cannot say how I am feeling to anyone in real life so I apogize for that.  I believe she just took it a little too far when she insinuated that I was an idiot if I believed my son would never lie to me. This has literally taken over our entire lives because it is every single say. I am a person that has severe anxiety and this situation just exacerbates it to the extreme. 

The problem is that we have tried everything that has been suggested. This has been going on for 5 years. I have had those same conversations with her over and over and over again about how we never get angry with her for coming to us when she has had an accident or done something else. We have done the reward chart. We have made her clean the underwear. We have given her panty liners so it makes less of a mess. The problem is that nothing works with her. 

That is why I came here, because I don't know what to do and maybe needed to vent a little too. I do apologize for being rude. That is not who I am. But I am scared of what is happening to my family over this. My son gets less and less attention from his father because he is constantly dealing with his daughter. I get practically no attention when she is here. 

ProbablyAlreadyInsane's picture

I think the point of that was just pointing out that kids have a tendency to lie.  Even good kids will lie to get out of trouble sometimes. So no worries. We're here so you can vent. It's just harder to give advice if you feel everyone is going to attack.

I suggest an actual Psychiatrist. (different than a therapist) obviously mine was solved easier, but a psychiatrist could help give you more of a window into what's going on in her head.

It gets scary sometimes, I understand, everyone has a tendency to lash out sometimes. Just know, no one is really here to judge you, we're here to try and give whatever advice and suggestions we have to see if we can help.  Most of us really understand how complex and frustrating stephe!! can be.

JazzyJ22's picture

Hi! I know its very difficult to deal with and honestly your 10 year old (yes I say yours because you love her like she is yours!) is dealing with a condition that normal 10 year olds don't. On top of that your leaving her to kind of deal with it on her own. She is not capable of managing it on her own because she wouldn't be hiding them. Step up and ask the nessary questions and sit with her and talk to her about the condition what it is and what it does. the only thing she can control is that which she is given to control. Sit down with her father first and think of a game plan and schedule. Who will go to the bathroom... does she have clean underwear on... when did her underwear change? Where should she put them if she does soil them... how should she handle ones that are soil... all of this must be taught and that takes planning and time. Your seeing it as a behavior issue and all she sees is that you have neglected to help her manage and no 10 year old is capable of managing a condition on their own. Because its important to consider the hygiene and bacterial you have to be more in DOING WITH her and not so much as telling them... Girl modulate in the bathroom... take her with you when you do your makeup invest in one on one girl time... Purfume shopping and giving her a something she can decorate to put the soiled things in you will be amazed by how she grows to be more responsible... I started my cycle at 11 and it took years to understand how important my hygeine was because on top of that I was irregular and bleed for weeks at a time... I hated the fact that people thought I smelled and I remember hiding Accidents from my mother (Who I was adopted by and was very abusive as well) mia.london8815@gmail.com Anytime you want to talk feel free to email me and we can talk more and brainstorm ideas... One step mom to another!!!

tog redux's picture

Sheesh. I offered advice and YOU jumped down MY throat and threw it all back in my face. 

When you said you tried EVERYTHING, how am I to know what that means?

joanna.ds1991's picture

I tried apologizing to you. I even sent you a private message. I acknowledge that my reaction wasnt justified. Just a woman on the verge of a breakdown here and took it out on you. So again, I am sorry. 

TheBrightSide's picture

I'm picturing you and togs wearing a giant "get-along" shirt.

ITB2012's picture

I always gave DS separate consequences (didn't call them punishments) for the thing he did and the lying. Very separate, not just piling on more of the same. (1 lost hour of TV time for the deed and 1 more hour for the lying. Nope. 1 lost hour of TV for the deed, and no dessert for the lying.)

I know you've tried a ton of stuff but is there an opportunity to explain to her that you won't punish her if she gives you her poopy stuff, that if she hides it that that will have repercussions, and if she also lies about it that that will have an additional repercussion? It sounds like there are enough instances to try it if you haven't.

There are so many posts about this. I cannot understand how so many kids have this problem. And it's nasty. I get your concern for the rest of the family and your little.

Harry's picture

She has no respect for you.  SD should only be in your home when DH is home.  He is not parenting her now, so let him handle her. With SD is with DH, or he arranges care for her. Camp or BM.  You have to disengage what means not cleaning her poop.  

The other question is,  Is it really a medical condition? Or a mental condition. There are many people who have medical problems and don’t go pooping in there pants.  Think she should see a mental health person ASAP

If you read these boards pooping in there pants seems like a SK problem 

joanna.ds1991's picture

I have consistently made an affort to disengage this summer especially, but that all changed about 2 weeks ago when I returned from a week out of state with my son. I came home to find close to 20 pairs of completely soiled underwear in her bedroom, not just in her things, but in a bag of my expensive winter work clothes that were stored in the closet of that room. 

Trying to fix this has completely taken over my thoughts and it doesn't help that her mother has absolutely no interest in trying to solve the problem. We also live in a different state and have taken her to see a psychologist here once to evaluate her. The problem is that due to out of state insurance, it cost us over $300 for one appointment, not to mention the hundreds we had already spent a pediatrician's office and medications. We cannot afford to keep taking her. I wish we could but we have to put food on the table and pay our bills. Her mom always says she will follow-up with a doctor where she lives. I provided her information for mental health professionals in her area but she never follows through. She is too busy spending the large amount of child support my husband sends her every week to pay for her lexus and other "necessities". 

advice.only2's picture

I would get the biggest pull ups you can find and have her use those while she is with you. I would also talk to DH about investing in a cleaning lady, one who can come in and sanitize the house weekly especially SD's room.

Maybe talk to a counselor for yourself, to help you decompress in a safe environment without judgement and to talk to somebody who can help you deal with these feelings and emotions and help you with the coping techniques to deal with this.

ctnmom's picture

on here years ago, her very small baby got Bacterial Meningitis. Her SS would leave soiled underwear all over the house like this, and also smear it.  This poor kid has some serious problems, but YOUR first responsibility is to YOUR children. If her parents can't solve this, you have no choice but to remove your kids from the situation. And yes, as another poster said, pooping pants/smearing/.hiding ACTUAL POOP seems to be a sadly common step kid problem. My SS was an obese kid and often smelled like dudu, my DH denied it until he got into our car one night and it was rankly, strongly unmistakeable. He stopped the not wiping/pooping pants after that.  Funny how these kids can literally get away with ape-like behaviour that any outsider would think is purely outrageous.

ESMOD's picture

Unfortunately, with this situation, you are going to need to figure out a way that the girl can be supervised and her scope to create problems is limited.

1.  She needs to be watched.. I'm not saying YOU have to do it.. but someone needs to be keeping tabs on her.  She obviously cannot be trusted at this point to do the right thing.. so someone needs to make sure the right thing happens.

2.  Her room needs to be stripped of anything of importance and value.  No storing your clothes in her room.  Obviously, she will be unattended while she is sleeping.. so while your household can be vigalent.. she may still have opportunities in the privacy of her room at night.  You could also install some sort of monitoring device.. like a baby monitor device that will alert you at night if she is making moves.

I agree she needs more therapy to help her deal with this issue.  What on earth happens at her school when she is randomly pooping her pants?  Certainly her mom can't be ok with dealing with this either.. she won't want crap in her lexus.  Are you sure that this same behavior is happening there?

joanna.ds1991's picture

I am honestly almost crying because i have felt so alone in this situation for so long. I have felt like a monster for feeling the way i do. I am now seeing a therapist for myself. I just started 2 weeks ago and this is one of the issues we will be discussing. Its so hard because I love my husband to death and I honestly love my stepdaughter. I want the best for her but not at the expense of the health and happiness of myself and my child. Like I said, my son and i both just got over a terrible stomach bug and I fear its from her spreading germs around the house as he doesn't go to to daycare and no one else I know has been ill. 

I wish I could hire a housecleaner but we just cannot afford it. It is awful. I won't even give my son his nightly bath in the bathroom she uses because I cannot even trust her to wash her hands. 

I know she is 10. I know she is just a child, but she has also learned a lot of this manipulative behavior from her mother. When we punish her for anything, she lies. When we call her out on the lie, she throws a tantrum and says she hates herself and is a bad family member and everyone always yells at her. This is not the truth. My husband and I don't yell at her. We discipline her but never yell, never spank. She says it because she knows how to manipulate us. Two seconds later and she will be completely fine again. I know she needs some serious mental health help, its getting her mom to follow through that is the problem. 

ITB2012's picture

Does she do this at school? Has she been to friends houses and done this?

If the answer is NO to either or both, then this is a mental/attitude problem not a medical condition.

And she is 10 AND she has said she knows how to manipulate you. She is barely a child, many people start calling them a tween as soon as they hit double digits.

I agree with posters who say to strip her room down to the barest necessities. Frankly I'd give her a bed, a nightstand, and a lamp. One toy/stuffed animal. If she cannot keep things clean then she cannot keep things in her room. I'd even keep her clothing elsewhere.

I'd also suggest putting her in after school care until your DH can pick her up. If she can control it at school then she stays there until the last minute.

She needs therapy with someone who isn't going to sugar-coat it or let her be a victim. And can be the authority figure on control of herself and when she gets privileges back.

joanna.ds1991's picture

She does do this at school and at the summer camp we send her to during the day. This is a constant problem. She just carries panty liners or extra underwear with her everywhere she goes. She makes our entire house, cars, etc., smell like crap just by sitting on them in her dirty underwear.

So far the school and camp have never raised the issue even though we notified them of her condition when she was enrolled. We have thought about the pull-ups but honestly I don't want her to be bullied even more than she probably already is for being stinky.