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Requesting Boundaries

JYMCat's picture

This is a topic I keep bringing up in therapy. Our therapist and my S/O are dismissing it as pure jealousy and that communication with his ex is something I'll just have to live with.

I can't accept this because I feel most of their communication is unnecessary and is not at all for the benefit (or detriment) of their daughter. I feel that most of their communication is due to emotional attachment on my S/O's end. I don't think he views it this way but I really feel it is.

Here are my main concerns at this point:

S/O exchanges pictures of FSD back and forth with BM and her family. He's readily admitted that there's no benefit to his daughter through this exchange but he's not going to stop because he feels there's nothing wrong with wanting to know what's going on in his daughter's life at all times, including when he's not with her. I feel that this is S/O nurturing a bond of some kind with BM. He claims they hate each other so I don't understand it. Maybe it's because I don't have kids. I don't understand why a person would voluntarily make contact with a person they hate. I can understand if it was something about custody or an emergency but it's not. It's purely social. On FSD's weekends with her mom S/O comes to stay with my at my home. BM will text or call him periodically during this time and he sees no problem with it as long as it's FSD related so he won't stop it, even though he knows it bothers me. I've mentioned this in therapy and our therapist has said that my S/O and BM are doing the right thing with keeping a cordial relationship and that I just have to suck it up. I don't think they should have a bad relationship, I think they should have a business only relationship. Which in NO WAY means I think they should fight and be mean to each other. I think there is a HUGE difference between cordial and friendship. After all, S/O claims they hate each other, which means they aren't friends so they should either stop acting like friends or stop saying they hate each other and admit that they like each other and reevaluate if those feelings are residual marital feelings. But as I said, our therapist says otherwise and basically called me jealous.

BM is allowed to call or text S/O whenever she wants about what ever she wants. I know that my S/O's intent is for their communication to only be about (not just for) FSD but the fact remains that BM contacts him for things unrelated to their daughter all the time. Like clean my carpet, or give me a ride to work, or my building manager is harassing me (she has a fiancee mind you) She also contacts him about things relating to their daughter, but can figure out herself; like what will FSD eat from (Insert random restaurant here) or how should I give this medicine to sick FSD when S/O sent the medication over WITH the instructions. Instead of asking BM to stop contacting him for things not directly related to their daughter, he chooses to ignore her or just doesn't respond to her if I'm in the vicinity. I'vs said that if he doesn't want her doing these things anymore, he needs to tell her. Our therapist says this is a bad idea because it might upset BM and cause problems for S/O. She also says that S/O knows BM and know the best way to handle her so let him. So basically how I look at what our therapist is saying is that S/O needs to keep BM happy no matter what her request is. She won't ever ask him to come over and have sex with her because she didn't even have sex with him when they were married. But if she did, is he supposed to do it because saying no will piss her off? Extreme example but that basically what it seems our therapist is saying. I know she doesn't think he should sleep with her but she's basically given permission for my S/O to do anything for BM to make her happy. BM is someone who likes having people do things for her and gets upset if you don't. So is it fair that my S/O has to cater to this attitude even though they aren't married anymore. I don't friggin think so, but our therapist seem to.

S/O asks FSD(3) if BM's BF was with them during FSD's weekend visit with her mom. I asked my S/O why he cares if her BF was there and his response was because if her BF is there then "I should be able to pick up and drop off I was just curious" idk what the heck that means but I don't think it's any of his business if BM's bF is around. If he's available for dropping off (BM doesn't have car or license but her BF does) or picking up then that's up to BM to organize how she's going to retrieve or release their daughter on HER end.

I'm at my wits end. Our last therapy session was last Friday and I left feeling helpless and that if I had something to say about BM or FSD that I should keep it to myself. That I am to accept S/O's life as it IS and not how it COULD BE. Our therapist also told me that she doesn't want me going on the step forums anymore because she thinks my fears are being fueled rather than helped.

Drac0's picture

The family therapist I went to several years ago also doesn't have a long list of credentials either. She helped me, but she didn't have any formal training/ degree etc. Her experience comes from dealing with her own personal family life. The only thing she had going for her was that she's been doing it for about 30 years.

Drac0's picture

>When your gut tells you something is not right it's probably not right.<

I agree with you 100% there and it surprises me that the OP's therapist didn't even make an effort to even try and validate her feelings on this issue.

Drac0's picture

QUOTE: >Our therapist also told me that she doesn't want me going on the step forums anymore because she thinks my fears are being fueled rather than helped.<

Bahahahahahahahahahahaha....Oh my, that is RICH!

This therapist borrows tactics from my ex-wife's playbook. Isolate the target so that they are more susceptible to gaslighting.

Andyandme's picture

You explained my situation to the T... SO and BM exchange pictures of their child and she calls or texts my SO for the answers she should already know or are easy to find. He also admits he hates her, but sometimes I find that so hard when the first thing he does is send BM pictures of her everything he snaps away. Make me wonder how does she cross your mind, or what makes you remember to send to BM??

kathc's picture

Your therapist is an ass who needs to be fired immediately.

Your SO has an inappropriate relationship with his ex.

You should seriously consider just getting your own therapist to guide you through leaving his pathetic ass.

Cadence's picture

I'm going to step out on a limb and guess that your therapist is a BM. Divorced and remarried with a SM in her life OR still in her original relationship but knows that it's not stable and fears another woman in her childrens' life.

Time for a new therapist.

As others have said, your FDH is way too wrapped up in BM. The fact that they "hate each other" yet talk all the time means that there are some feelings still there. They don't have to be romantic feelings, but they are some sort of an attachment. And that attachment should make you question his true availability to you.

If he's taking this time out of his day to contact BM for nebulous reasons, or allowing BM to intrude on his time with you - his relationship! - for non-important reasons, you know something is up.

You've asked for boundaries, which you deserve. You've asked for respect for your relationship, which you deserve. He hasn't delivered on those, so it's clear he doesn't much value a future with you (or he's a dumbass who can't see the damage he's doing.) The next steps are up to you.

Are you deserving of some bizarro runner-up status in this man's life or do you deserve a full relationship without his allowing his ex to intrude? I think you know the answer to that.

JYMCat's picture

Our therapist is a married BM. I'm sure this plays a HUGE role in the advice she's giving. My own two sisters gave me the same advice the very next day. That I just have to live with it. Both have children. One is divorced with two boys and her ex is re-marrying. The other never married the bio dad but is still with him and has two girls. She is not happy in her relationship and is trying to get out of it but he basically just won't vacate the home they share. Normally I trust my sisters advice but not this time. My divorced sister has the relationship with her ex that I would like S/O to adopt with his. The rarely speak and it's only about my nephews. She said that sometimes she or he will shoot the other a picture but it's not a regular thing. Also, no one in my family contacts my ex brother in law for ANYTHING yet my S/O's ex in laws feel comfortable enough to contact him to the point where BM's mother called and yelled at him after I posted a picture of me and FSD on MY FB and tagged S/O. BM's mom doesn't have a FB and S/O isn't friends with BM. He's is however friends with BM's sister. So it had to be her who showed their mom. I blocked her and "magically" we haven't heard anything about me from BM's mom since. I asked S/O to tell BM's mom that she is to no longer contact him and if she wanted to speak to her grand daughter that she is to plan it when FSD is with her mom. I don't think she has the best relationship with BM but that's not my S/O's problem. I understand that these people are FSD's family but I feel that if they are going to try to cause problems in our relationship that he has no business being in contact with them. I strongly feel that FSD having a relationship with that side of her family is the sole responsibility of her mother. S/O argued with me when I asked him to stop talking to his ex mother in law but he claims he did so. Recent text activity says otherwise. He recently sent a group text message pic to BM, his ex sister in law and their mom. I don't understand why my sisters or my therapists gave me this advice but I can't ignore the fact that they are all BMs.

JYMCat's picture

It's nice to know that I'm not insane. I always ask my S/O to put himself in my shoes. I ask him how he would feel if I was in this much contact with one of my exes. One that I profess to hate. His response is, "you don't have kids". So I guess he thinks that just because he has a kid with this woman, that all of the things I mentioned above are okay for him, but it wouldn't be for me because I don't have any kids at all, let alone with one of my exes. Oh, and when I said that she didn't even have sex with him when they were married. I meant it. His daughter is a product of one of BM's many infidelities. She is not my S/O's biological daughter. When confronted with this information prior to the birth of FSD, he opted to stay. BM told him she was raped but didn't want to get an abortion. In an attempt to save his marriage (and be the hero even though this wasn't BM's first rape claim) he told her he'd help her raise the baby. It obviously didn't work. 9 months after FSD was born, S/O caught BM with the bio dad, the supposed rapist. That was his last opportunity to be free of this woman and STILL he continued the facade that was their marriage.

Now three years later here I am trying to be a supportive GF and make a life with him and his daughter, he refuses to entertain the idea that his lack of desire to set proper boundaries with his ex might be because of residual unresolved feelings. This denial is being fueled by our therapist making it MY issue. We might stand a chance if we had someone who could say that it MAY be possible. Not someone who calls me jealous. When he says there's nothing wrong with wanting to know what's going on in FDS's life even when she's with her mom, I always say that there's no way to be there 100% of the time unless you get back with her mom. Then and only then is that possible. FSD lives with HIM not her mom, isn't knowing what is going on in her life 99% of the time enough? It pisses him off that I say that every time and he starts ranting how he doesn't want to be with her and she doesn't want to be with him. I say that if keeping inappropriate contact with BM is SUPPOSED to be in FSD best interest, then wouldn't it be in her best interest if her parents were together? Same rant and he adds that it's not in her best interest for them to get back together because they hate each other. It's a vicious circle. Like I said, I'm not asking him to verbally or physically abuse this woman. ALL I'm asking is for him to stop being available to her 24/7 and to stop engaging in conversations that in no way shape or form affect their daughter. If he can admit that it doesn't benefit her then he should be able to admit that it wouldn't hurt her if they stopped. If I meant ANYTHING to him he should try to understand and if he can't he should try to do it anyway because it's obviously causing me stress. I could understand if I was asking him to stop talking to BM, don't let her see her daughter, pretend she doesn't exists but I'm not.

We're currently not on speaking terms because of what I've said and because of other things that have happened since our therapy session.

Idk how many of you know that Plan B is but I recently "had" to take one. I'll spare you the details but basically we had an accident and since S/O "isn't ready to be a father (even though he already is) and that we don't know each other that well and that he doesn't want another BM and that he's afraid I'll leave and take our kid". Now, this isn't the first time I've had to use Plan B but it's the first time in this relationship and it's the first time I was actually on the fence about it. On one hand I'm enjoying being child free but on the other hand, I'm in love with my S/O and we're SUPPOSED to be having a life together and he supposedly wants to have kids with me. Also, it wasn't 100% sure that it was even necessary for me to take it. But I didn't want to take the gamble and be wrong. He said that he thought it was a good idea but he would support me in whatever decision I made. I talked to a few close friends and decided that I'd do it. I know it was my decision but I was really hurt by the fact that my S/O was basically saying he wanted me to do it but he'd support me if I didn't. There was no, comforting and basically shoved the decision off on me. I feel like I'm not good enough to have his ACTAUL kid but BM was good enough for him to stick around and help her raise a kid that she went and made with someone else? WTH. I haven't voiced that last feeling to him but that's how I feel. The "incident" happened Sunday. I took the pill Monday. So It's still fresh for me. Come Tuesday and we get into an argument over something SO trivial but he refuses to admit to his role in the tiff. Which is what he always does. He never accepts that what he says or does has an effect on how the conversation goes. This stupid argument was because I was having a conversation with one of my co-workers while I was on the phone with S/O. S/O proceeded to interject and tell me how incorrect I and my co-worker was. He sent me a video that he felt would prove to us that he was right. I watched the stupid video and he was in fact right, IF and I say IF he had heard correctly what my co-worker and I were talking about. He "misheard" however. When I restated what I had originally said he was like, "oh yeah, you guys are right". >:( !!!!!!! He then proceeded to deny that his whole intent on making watch the video in the first place was to prove us wrong. He was trying to label it a miscommunication when it's actually a clear cut case of him being more concerned about being right then actually listening to what he's trying to be right about. He refuses to admit it so I got off the phone with him and haven't had any desire to talk to him since yesterday.

So our therapy session, the Plan B situation and his inability to ever take responsibility for himself is keeping me from talking to him at the moment.

Drac0's picture

JYMcat, your S/O is the epitome of the man afflicted with the "white knight syndrome". Look it up.

Based on what you have written I see at least 3 symptoms right off the bat.

1) Inability to set boundaries with a former partner.

2) Desire to be "in the right", even at the expense of someone's feelings.

3) Ready to jump in to lend aid/support even when it is not his place to do so.

White knights are VERY EASILY manipulated by the women in their lives. Even when there is no sex involved, just the mere thought of recieving a woman's praise, will make them move mountains for her.

JYMCat's picture

It sure seems that way. I guess since I don't need to be rescued, it's hard for him to figure out what he's supposed to do in our relationship.

JYMCat's picture

We had an in depth conversation last night and he finally agreed to setting boundaries for BM and to stop having superfluous conversations with her. Idk if he's done it yet. We'll see what happens.

JYMCat's picture

Well, S/O spoke to BM today. The reaction was very uneventful. She just huffed, said alright and hung up. I'm happy he did it and I hope that's the most of the reaction that we'll ever get from her over this. I'm never going back to our therapist and I'm looking for a new one. Thank all of you for your advice. Despite what that therapist thought, you guys help A LOT. Smile

Drac0's picture

Yay! Smile

Jjjessicuh's picture

I'm glad your SO stepped up and you worked it out. For what it's worth though, your therapist is an idiot. 

Rags's picture

Requesting?  Quit requesting boundaries and force them into effect. 

I have been in the organizational and asset performance optimization world for much of my career.  Every failed effort has one thing in common and that is that rather than directing that best practices are followed companies request that they are followed and roll out some major convincing effort to get their people to voluntarily participate.

The successful endeavors also have a universal success characteristics and those are that they engage their people in the development,  they give no choice but to comply and they implement accountability systems to measure compliance and apply escalating leverage to force continued compliance.  They also have a continuous improvement though that characteristic isn't relevent to the discussion on boundaries IMHO.

In blended family situations I just do what I have done professionally for much of my life. I establish reasonable standards of behavior, I demand and enforce compliance and I apply consequences when behaviors do not comply witht the standards.  

While in my professional life I do investigate the root cause when a person or organziation does not comply... I don't waste my time with that in my personal life as regards our blended and extended family.  Where best practice process compliance can  have many possible influences that result in a deviation from best practice .... in interpersonal relationships I have found that there is only one.  Someone chooses to not comply with the standard of reasonable behavior.

With extremely rare exception I don't care why the choice to deviate is made, I care only that the choice is made and I bring the pain of consequences into play as immediately as possible for that choice. 

Missingme's picture

Leave him and have a real life.  He doesn’t hate his ex - he’s lying.  Your therapist is an idiot. Nothing is right about your situation, trust us.

Booboobear's picture

Start texting pictures of your stepdaughter to your ex boyfriend all the time, and encourage your ex boyfriend to text your photos of his kids. tell your husband that you just want to know whats going on in each others lives and if he doesnt like it he is just being jelous. 

Kona_California's picture

I'm friends with three MFTs and have taken half the counseling classes you would for an MFT in my master's program and from my perspective, your therapist is not going about your feelings on this the right way at all. You've expresssed how this is making you feel for some time, and you aren't getting validation, or being facilitated to speak with your SO about compromising...? What are her credentials? Does she even have a MFT? How old is the kid?

I would honestly stop going to this therapist and tell your husband you would like a new therapist for the two of you. I'm experiencing similar issues and you're RIGHT to feel uncomfortable about their communication. He's saying they speak only about their kid, but that is very obviously not the case. This needs to be addressed. I would tell him look, I get that you need to talk about your kid with BM. It's reasonable. However, since you say how much you hate BM, and since there is communication that is not necessary, I cannot accept pushing this to the side any longer. Whatever the therapist says, I'm out of this relationship if you continue to refuse compromising with me on this. Either meet me in the middle, or go find another GF who has no opinion.