How to divorce a narcissist?
I am in the process of looking for that right attorney! It is far harder than I ever thought especially when I don't have a good support system to draw from. ( have not lived in this area a long time)
I am looking for a lawyer that can go up against him and hold their own. He will be NASTY and he is very clever despite how stupid he is with a SD34.
I have had it with the mini-wife syndrome. The lying. The sneaking. playing hide and seek with his phone. deleting texts. making decisions with her and about her behind my back. Sharing all of the details of our lives with her!
He has all the tricks, gaslighting, lying, sneaking, threats and playing the victim. He is a textbook Narc.
It will not be pretty. If anyone has any tips or advice they can offer it would be very appreciated. I am very scared right now! He does not know what I am doing or planning
I feel the best way to do it is to be stealth because we are in the process of selling our business and I want that completed before I lower the boom.
I want the house in the settlement so I am not sure how to go about it since, in order to file, I have to first move out. i am going to do it all in one day so he has no time to hide money or gift anything to his SD which I was warned he could try to do!
Again I appreciate any advice from those who have been there!
I haven't been through a divorce
But I would find and attorney first and follow their advice before moving out, etc.
Good luck and sorry it came to this but it will lead to a better future for you.
I know one attorney I visited
I know one attorney I visited with said that I could file and put a legal order to evict him at the same time, so he could come home and legally find his stuff on the lawn, so to speak. So I guess I don't know if you have to be the one to move out (but I didn't go that legal route with eviction, so I don't know). Futurobrilliante has amazing advice above. One thing I was told by those who'd gone through divorce when I was looking to file was to make sure you or the partner don't have to live together once the D bomb is dropped. It's horrible and painful. That part of the break has to be firm and clean.
If there's any form of manipulation, threats, or abuse, DOCUMENT DOCUMENT DOCUMENT!
And good luck! THere's so much better and happier life on the other side.
Build your plan, work the plan.
FIrst.... set up a consult with all of the top 10 attorneys in your area then pick the best fit for you. That takes all of them off of the table for your STBX. Their representing him becomes a conflict of interest since you have consulted with them.
Take every piece of documentation and move all of the money out of joint accounts and into diverse accounts at institutions he has no relationship with. Make it as difficult as possible for him to find anything. Make every bit of information a battle.
Be ready to bare his ass on the public record with anything and everything that he has done that demonstrates his manipulation and emotionally if not physically incestuous relationship with his adult daughter.
We used this model in battling the SpermClan over the years and they used to cringe and stroke out when the facts about the Spermidiot's career as a serial statutory rapist was rolled out in court, the SpermGrandParents financial support of their idiot son was presented in its entirety, and SpermGrandPa's mistress was listed as a witness for our side (we never called her). We listed her for two reasons. First... to humiliate SpermGrandHag, second... as a knowledge resource on SpermGrandHag's manipulative crap and blank checkbook in providing income to the Spermidiot so we could motion that the SpermGrandParents income be added to the Spermidiot's income for CS calculation purposes. They always motioned for my income to be included in CS calculation, so... we brought reems of information demonstrating that the Spermidiot had the benefit of and full access to all of his parent's income and resources.
For us, the goal was to cost them regardless of how much it cost us. This was an evolution of the progression that the divorce from my XW took. That started out as a reasonably amicable divorce. Until she started getting nasty, at which point I went to war and made sure that she clearly understood that every sordid little detail about her would become public record and her parents would be introduced to every element of her secrets. When she moved out of our home she left all of her university records and amazingly, her diary where she spilled her guts on her cheating. When she got nasty, all of that juicy information became all mine to leverage as necessary to keep her in line. I had multiple notarized copies so I could not be denied that info. And... I never gave any of it back to my XW until I let them review it at a conference. That was fun!
In a war with toxic idiots, there are no gloves and you go for their throats.
Or they go for yours.
Take care of you. Good luck with your departure from this nightmare.
Just remember that a
Just remember that a narcissist will try to reel you back in and do whatever they can to keep their attention supply up so even if he is ignoring you now, the second he finds out you are about to be free of him, he will say and do anything to get a rise out of you. Rock Method is a real thing, let your lawyer do all the communicating if you can. If you can't then keep everything minimal and through email.
Yep
I know what will happen. He will promise me anything to get me back because we already played this game! I fell for it once. He was good for a while too. A few years...then here comes the SD34 needing money and it starts with a little (behind my back of course) then a little more, then a little job, then more of a job, all without my consent or knowledge, then more secrets shared, more plotting...and here we are again. After he promised never again! But the problem with Narcissists is they never think they do anything wrong. Somehow they believe their own lies and that is what is SO frustrating and futile! I pray for strength this time!
Do everything you can in
Do everything you can in stealth mode. Get the best lawyer you can find. Get yourself a good counselor because you will need it.
Be prepared for DH to try and get you back. Then when he realizes you are really leaving. Be prepared for his narcissistic rage. Protect yourself from communication with him once you have left.
Document, document, document everything.
My lawyer loved me because I never would engage with exH but I kept very detailed records that would dispute any nonsense my ex would bring up in court.
I would watch and screenshot his social media and text messages. When ex would try to fight for something I would counter it and he would have to drop his request for me to concede.
An example I was willing to agree to liberal visitation. He kept fighting for sole custody, every Holiday etc. . ExH changed his interests and personality like I change my underwear. So this week he was a Jahovahs witness.
I showed how our child was already baptized Catholic something we had both decided. So since he was now a Jahovahs witness and they don't celebrate Holidays or bdays he shouldn't get those visitation days.
I wouldn't drop my claim until he dropped his and agreed to my original proposal.
The house was supposed to be sold and split 50/50. ExH was living there and made every Realtor quit. I got documentation from 3 Realtors, had him evicted from the house, and also had proof of my contribution upon purchase of the house which was money I had before the marriage. Add in child support arrears and I only had to pay him $6000 to buy him out of his half of the house.
I then sold the house and kept the profit. I also cashed out my prior retirement and filed for divorce before starting my new job so he had no rights to my retirement. He had no idea I had filed so he was also racking up credit card debt to try and punish me thinking I would be responsible for half. But nope we had no debt together.
When I left I waited to seperate phone and car insurance so he didn't suspect I was going to file for divorce. He just thought I was being dramatic and would come back.
Narcissists are not proactive they are reactive.
Even the day I left was pre planned. I waited until he started am argument, said he wanted a divorce, he go to threat. Then I agreed and left the next day. Because he thought it was his fault he was only focused on getting me back while I started divorce proceedings.
Applause.
Well played.
Thanks for sharing your experience and well managed divorce. Mine was not quit this well managed but was very similar in many ways to yours.
When my XW first expressed that she wanted a divorce I engaged a marriage counselor and we worked on the marriage for about 5mos. When she told me the second time she wanted a divorce, I was ready. When she dropped the D word I told her to go file. She burst into tears, accused me of not fighting for her, and tried to put the honus of the divorce on me. She then proceeded to tell me that all she wanted was the money she had contributed to the downpayment on the house, a few $thousand, so when teh sun came up I immediately drained out joint accounts, had the bank cut her a cashier's check for the downpayment money, and took all of the critical documentation and put it in storage.
A couple of weeks later she moved out of our home. She left some very important docs when she left. All of her college transcripts, every paper she had turned in for her entire undergrad degree, including the rough drafts in my handwritng and the graded typed versions. She also left her diary, with detailed entries of her daliances with any swinging Johnson she could get her hands on for the entire course of our relationship. I had no idea about the extent of her cavern crotched whore career except for the geriatric Fortune 500 executive sugar/baby daddy she was hosing for nearly the entire time we were in marriage counseling.
Those two collections of information gave me a full handful of her short and curlies and full control over the entire divorce process.
At the divorce hearing in front of the Judge made a very clear point when issuing the ruling that "all property divided as possessed." She had moved out of the home witha truck and trailer full of furniture and clothes.
She moved out of the home we had purchased 2mos before, moved into her grandpa sugar/baby daddy's place and by leaving handed me the house. She moved out, I possessed the house..... game, set, and match.
Between her telling me she wanted the divorce and the court hearing there were a number of interesting tit for tat exchanges. At first she wanted an uncontested single attorney divorce, fine by me. She wanted nothing except the downpayment contribution e she made for the houst. Done. Then her night shift nurse and Doctor coworkers, all divorced, got in her head that there is no such thing as a amicable divorce and she should get everthing. Then my XMIL (the one who 9 years after the divorce ended up in federal prison for embezzlment) had the business attorney that her employer retained meet with my wife. That is where the diary and college documentation came into play. That attorney contacted me and told me to bring my attorney for a discussion on a more reasonable settlement than what my STBXW had orignially offerred. I went pro se. I was shown to a conference room where I waited for a few minutes before my STBXW and her new attorney showed up. The attorney expressed frustration that I had not brought an attorney. I then slid a manilla folder across the table and told them both I did not need an attorney and if my XW insisted on revising her original settlement offer that the evidence of her accademic fraud would go to the university a notarized copy of her diary would be submitted in court and sent to her parents.
My STBXW just about stroked out. Her attorney reviewed the docs, informed her that he could no longer represent her. As an adjunct professor at the university she had just graduated from her accademic fraud put him in a position that no longer allowed him to represent her. Watching her attorney fire her as a client was classic.
So... we were back to the originally offered settlement and a single attorney divorce.
A few months later the Judge granted the divorce, awarded property as possessed, and granted her petitition to return to her maiden name and then chewed her ass for her toxic shit. She had gotten lippy about being rid of my family name when the Judge stated that her petition to revert to her maiden name was granted. He chewed her up one side and down the other.
Our attorney had requested that since she was divorcing me and it was uncontested that I should not attend the hearing. That struck me as odd. So... I was sitting in the gallery when the hearing began. The Judge asked who I was, I told him, he asked me to approach the bench and the hearing commenced. I wondered on and off for several years what the plan was if I had not attended the hearing.
The whole process could not have gone better if I had scripted it myself.
Congratulations on your brilliant escape.
You are right
To not let him know your plans.
Talk to an atty...how to find a shark? Maybe call domestic violence for advice on Attys and escape plan.
Make sure your atty does a discovery search to find ALL of his hidden assets.
Prepare yourself. Be grey rock at court, no emotion.
Prepare to ghost him. Accept communication via text only...print these for court ti show his character, harassment, etc
Start sneaking out important papers and belongings he wont notice missing
Steel against his "good guy" pleadings of love. Then the hatred. Do NOT respond just print, copy, give a copy to atty
Prep for the smear campaign.
Set your sights on life away from him.
I am waiting for the courts to respond to our divorce papers. I left n ghosted him. This has sped my healing process. Even if you know he is a monster, be careful as he may try to work your emotions. Know in your mind what an unchanging evil he is. Don't waver in your resolve. Your new life free of narc abuse is almost here!
Join narc abuse recovery groups n see what issues you might encounter.
You can do this! He can talk to your atty. He doesn't deserve one minute if your time.
You got this!!
Mayflowering
I lived in a hick town with my first husband. The women there leave when hubby is out of the house...pull up the Mayflower moving truck n clean out the house.
....my ex's mom did this
The wife of one of my
The wife of one of my employees did this in the early 00s. Left a single recliner in the middle of the LR and an note saying she had the kids and they were done. She took everything in the house except the recliner, one pan, one plate, and one knife, fork, and spoon.
It was cold. Sadly, he chased her until she came back. He was better off with the recliner.
Yes,
My ex mil is nasty. And the her husband was the kindest man. I don't mean to sound like I condone Mayflowering.....
I didn't take it as you were
I didn't take it as you were condoning Mayflowering. I was just recounting my coworkers experience as a victim of it.
Sadly, toxic people have victims. Your XMIL's husband is likely an example of that.
Fir$t things Fir$t!
Yes - it will cost you a bundle - but even if prudently - follow other posters advice by meeting with at least top 3-4 attorneys so you will have the upper hand on the biggest baddest mothers before your husband even has a clue. The best money you can invest in yourself even if you never use it!! Expect to spend at least $400-$500 per consultation. Just do it!!
lawyers
Yes, I have had a quite a few already and have at least 2 more scheduled! I can not believe that I am looking at under 30 days to lower the boom. April seemed so long ago, now it seems around the corner and Im getting nervous. I still have not found the lawyer I feel is agressive AND experienced. I have found one of each. If I could combine them!!
THank you to ALL for the great advice!!!
we got into an arguement
We got into an argument yesterday about SD34 because she is STILL working for us and I STILL have a problem with it. I have been ignoring it and biding my time but he insisted on pulling me into an arguement because he is desperate for my approval on what he is doing and I wont give it to him!
I went on to tell him how she is coveting my life and I am not comfortable with it! "she wants MY life" she wants to live in my house, go to the nice places I go to and all without having to work for any of it!" We then go into how many hours she is working. I said she turned in 30 hours last week, what is she doing for you that takes her 30 hours?? He said I only gave her about 10 hours of work. So He passes the buck to our operations officer. So we called our Operations officer and asked her, what is SD34 doing to garner 30 hours? and she said, "I don't have anything to do with her, she is YOUR assistant remember??. So SD blatantly cheated us but does he care or anger at all?? Nope...he just says.."well, I will look into it" yea...right!
So fast forward to tonight. We went to a nice restaurant and after he pays the bill he says to me
"You sure do have a good life! I hope you are grateful!"
I don't know how I can go another 4 weeks without a serious breakdown!
use a sweet drippy baby voice...
and say, 'yes, daddeeeee, you know I'm soooo grateful for you so I can have such a good life!' and walk away with a crazy grin or laugh and leave his sorry self confused! Try not to bust out laughing but it's fun when it happens.
Keep 'em confused...
Wow - can't believe he said that
["You sure do have a good life! I hope you are grateful!"]
My tongue would be bleeding from how hard I'd have to bite on it to not say anthing to that!
"Yes, sweetheart, I'll show you just how grateful I am in 4 weeks!"
OMG RIght???
I walked ahead of him grumpling the whole time!! And yes...biting my tongue in half!! I felt like he was dying to say something like that all night! He just wants to deflect from what he is doing with his kid! He wants to somehow rationalize paying her $75 an hour to basically text him all day! If he reduces me to a shivering puppy just happy for a pat on the head then he takes away my place as the co-owner/partner who actually has say in our decisions!
When my husband had to divorce his hcgubm narcissist
Personality disordered bat shit crazy ex, he told her they were separating and engaged a lawyer. She had a crap lawyer, she places an injunction on him to vacate the home he bought with his money as sole income earner while she was daily abusing people and maxing his credit cards etc.
ahe had her then father & brother who were police threaten to stab and shoot my husband to death if he didn't give her more money in the divorce.
she wanted everything, 1/2 of the home, half of his ongoing salary (even had her lawyer hade a fake doc drawn up to impersonate court approval that his workplace had to pay 50% of his earnings to her), hubby told his workplace head of hr that he would sue the company so between a snr vp and batshit crazy exwife, they decided not to piss my husband off. We also had her all over the place with her demands to the point you had no friggin clue what she wanted beyond just to inflict pain
she wanted half of the house that hubby fully paid for as sole income earner when she so called as a stay at home housewife refused to be a housewife, refused to care for the home or cook or clean. Hubby felt she deserved nothing, courts agreed and only approved she get 50% from profit made of selling the house which she was fuming about.
in the end, lawyer up and let your lawyer deal with the crazy. Stand your ground and don't cave in.
BPDHell
thank you for the great advice! I went ahead and blocked all just now. I watched the video! A big dose of reality for what lies ahead. I have already been detaching and I can see the effects. He is ATTACHING more and more to his daughter. She is taking my place in nearly every way. He is addicted to her texts. I should be grateful for that because it means he has a support when I leave him. He will still melt down but at least he has her. He will be vicious tho. My biggest issue of worry is I need him to be healthy because he still has to work! The new owners of the business expect performance from him! This may work in my favor tho because the weakness of the Narc is they must keep up the show! he wont want to look bad to them!
The more I think about that video...
The more I wrap my head around it. As an NPD he thrives on 2 things, control and admiration! he will do ANYTHING for that! What comes the easiest is to buy it because he has the money to do so! He hired his daughter and it did not matter that he promised his wife he never would hire family again. So he lies. The ends justify the means. He will face the consquences of lying later. Right now, he has his daughter working for him and "hooked" on the money. She cheats us and says she worked 30 hours when she only barely worked 10 and that is ok! he does not care one bit. We have the money and ME, the wife, should be "grateful" I have what I need, I have a good life, so shut up about it! His needs are the most important. The marriage does not matter... I just need to suck it up! The problem is, when is enough enough? She is a demanding B**** there is no end to what she wants! When does he tell her no? The answer is never! As long as she texts him and shows him attention, he sees that as loyalty when it is anything but! I am the one who has been loyal. All his other employees have been loyal but it means ZERO to him. He treats us like crap! Hes addicted to her and he will do ANYTHING to keep her in his life and that...is dangerous! He can do that with his own funds.
Start subtracting SD's wages
Start subtracting SD's wages from his half of company equity. Keep the docs on her actual work hours Vs. hours she is claiming and when it is appropriate in court... have your attornew shove that information up STBXH's ass.
Have fun!
I went through this a year ago...
and he indeed has NPD, didn't realize it after the short-lived sham of a 'marriage' that took longer to divorce than it lasted.
Follow the GREAT advice on the posts above.
Do NOT tell the Narc ANY of your plans.
Yesterday was one year since I reached out the folks here on StepTalk and their advice got me the support I needed, also living in city where I knew nobody and had no support, and they gave me the guidance to GTFO sooner than later and I did just that.
I'm going to post today or tomorrow and how my life is so much healthier now that I'm away from that Narc and his whore DaughterWife...
Stealth Mode...I gave that Narc an ugly taste of his medicine after all was said and done!
Stay strong!
Proud of you
Really nice to celebrate your 1 year. So proud of you & happy for you.
codependency
is what I am now focused on. I realize that I am codependent on him and he is forming a codependecy with her. We are now caught up in a triangle and there is no way I win! I have come to realize that I have been caught in a cycle just like with any other addict. They use and we try to stop it. When we have evidence of the addiction we get abused for being angry and upset. We are not allowed emotions, only the narcissist is allowed! I can not tell you how that look he gets when I am upset, is the most scary thing I have ever seen! Its like he hates me to a point of destruction! I need to find a way out where I will stay out.
It does not sound like you had a codependency issue with your ex. You got out before that could happen or maybe because you did not have the codependent personality, he was easier to split from. They don't want strong people...they want to control someone!
Codependency works both ways...
I was with that guy for 5 years, he and I lived 3 hour car drive apart. Well, 5 years except the times I would break up with him and he would beg me back in a month or so. Narcs have low self-esteem and need their 'supply' sources to keep them feeling important/needed. They have no sincere friendships with peers.
Look up Karpman Drama Triangle. Triangulating you with another female so he can tell you you're jealous, angry, unfair, irrational, making things up, nagging, etc and the more you mention the miniwife, the more his twisted mind will think you're 'fighting over him' when you are trying to get him to be the husband one would expect at his age.
Yes, I became codependent on him, no shame in that anymore. I learned not to get sucked back into the vortex of hell. I was fiercely independent for 15 years (single by choice while I raised my son), already had one masters degree, successful career, working on second masters degree for my 'semi-retirement career' when I met him. I had the expectations of this 50 yr guy to be a man. He fell short for me and will for any other woman who gets sucked into his life of lies and lying by omission. I pity the next fool. Not my monkeys, not my circus. Flying monkeys included too!
Not sure if codependency is a diagnosable personality but I can tell you that going NO CONTACT with him will be your saving grace. Once you leave, let the lawyers discuss anything and everything related to the divorce. No contact includes NO texting, emailing, social media contact, block block block. You will SAVE YOURSELF if you go complete no contact. Codependency is something that can be explored in counseling at some point...if you're in survival mode, like I was a year ago, thoughts get all jumbled and my brain was in a fog.
The betrayals were difficult to process as I was coming out of the fog from the trauma with him. It took months with a great therapist, during the pandemic, via weekly video sessions. I'm an introvert and ok with my solitude so the pandemic kept me focused on the healing. I worked quite a bit online as it was a healthy way to focus my energies and establish a sense of normalcy.
My PTSD from my combat deployments were triggered because he knew my triggers and laid them on me every day. I had a few remaining triggers and he went full throttle to scream at me, block me in the closet (my fear with the dark and claustrophobia), hold me down so I couldn't get up from sitting on the floor, and blocked me from leaving the bathroom when I was sobbing & having panic attacks from his abuse. I don't cry easily...this was insanity and pure NPD evil right after the nuptials a month prior. None of this happened until after I moved into the house almost two weeks after the faux nuptials.
The split will not be easy for several months, hence the team of support you will need to build when you're on your own.
NPD's do indeed want strong people & they derive pleasure of breaking them down. Also, they like kind hearted and empathic types and the NPD's will toughen up the nicest person after the NPD is done with them. Well, two options...make or break...he rode me HARD to break me and I'm a tough bitch. I had just not been involved with such a liar with zero empathy and someone with this dangerous personality disorder type.
Freedom is great! Living well is the best revenge.
What could be more spot on than this!
Triangulating you with another female so he can tell you you're jealous, angry, unfair, irrational, making things up, nagging, etc and the more you mention the miniwife, the more his twisted mind will think you're 'fighting over him' when you are trying to get him to be the husband one would expect at his age.
And when I said to him, "Why should she need a man when she has you?" He SMILED!!! That was the utmost sickest thing I ever saw in my life!!!!!!!!! I said, "I think you LIKE being the only man in her life" Then he snapped back to reality and denied it! YUCK!!!