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Summer visitation

livlaughlov's picture

I know it's the law that says we still have to send BM CS when the kids come and stay with us all summer, but what a crock! So we send her X amount, and then have to pay all the kids expenses again.

The worst part is, even though it is summer so we did more expensive things like camping, movies, etc. (more than they'd do when in school all day) it cost us hundreds of dollars LESS than the CS we send her every month - to feed and entertain them, (even buy clothes cause they didn't bring rain gear for camping). So, we know for sure, not only do we pay 100% of the child costs, she has lots left over! And we pay 80% for dental, medical, camps etc. so she can't even claim those expenses either!

They always say, "we'll the BM has to maintain a home, and needs the money while the kids aren't there". What the hell do they think the NCP does, makes them sleep outside while they visit?! Most NCP's also provide a HOME for their children.

It's just really frustrating to pay CS to a BM when the kids are here for over a month! And to top it off, we have to pay all the costs of their travel to get here.

When will the powers that be use some logic and stop fleecing NCP parents who just want to stay a part of their kids lives?! I am so sick of the whole system, and it's amazing how people who are on the recieving end of it can defend such a biased and illogical system.

Ahhhhh - needed to vent as step-kids left yesterday and I've held this in for 6 weeks!!!!

MadeMyBed's picture

wow, this could have been written by me! It IS frustrating to have the kids for a month in the summer and STILL have to pay CS! We have to also provide a home, and pay for more groceries when they're here as well as electricty. You should see how it spikes when they're her, Im not kidding! Like most SKs on here it seems, they are obsessed with electronics. Not to mention the $$ spent on doing things b/c if we dont, they tell BM ("Psycho") they didnt do anything at all while they were here and beleive me, this kind of crap always gets mentioned in court when Psycho throws in everythng bu the kitchen sink to try to make herself seem like Mother of the Year-yeah, right!!

livlaughlov's picture

Ya, Mother Load of the Year, is more like it.

I think the CP should PAY the NCP the same amount they get in CS in the summer if kids go and stay with dad. After all, they are always saying how expensive the kids are and how CS doesn't BEGIN to cover their costs.

Cause CS is all about the KIDS and surely they don't want them to go without, esp. in the summer....right???...*cough**cough*.....CS has NOTHING whatsoever to do with moms lifestyle...........

Whats good for the goose is good for the gander!

MadeMyBed's picture

Agreed! I forgot to mention we also have to pay for the travel expenses to even get them here! And God forbid they say they're not hungrry before they get on the plane and Psycho throws a fit and says we're not feeding them. Check this out: it is actually ORDERED we give them a snack or dinner or whatever before they fly. Even if they're not hungry I guess. We dont, but I would LOVE to say "I know you're not hungry, but you have to eat b/c your mom tells people we dont feed you, so down the hatch!" Yeah, cause force feeding kids is real productive....

livlaughlov's picture

HOLY CRAP! We have the exact same thing happen! BM sends them on flights accross the country with zero money to buy food on the plane and yet complained to DH that we didn't feed them enough protein while there were here LOL. The kids decided to become vegetarian and were only eating Tofu, so I introduced them to all sorts of beans and lentils so they would get their protein, their mom let them eat nothing but tofu for a year!

Rags's picture

The income averaging formula also considers % of parenting time. The NCP receives credit under the % parenting time for the time the Skids are at the NCP's.

But, yes ...... often CS is far, far more than is required to support all aspects of child related costs.

In many other cases CS is a pittance and does not cover much of anything. My Skid eats far more on a monthly basis than what my wife receives in CS from the SpermClan (The SpermGrandParents pay my SS's CS for the SpermIdiot).

When you consider the cost of our home, private school (or the taxes for top school districts), food, clothing, transportation, entertainment, extracurricular activities,and all of the other various and sundry Skid related expenditures we make ...... CS covers less than 10% of what we spend on the kid each year.

Though I would be thrilled if the judge would nail the SpermIdiots ass to the wall for more CS, it is my son's (SS) three also out-of-wedlock half sibs that I feel fore. Those kids are screwed. The CS we receive for my SS would have a huge impact on the half sib's quality of life. However, there is not a snowball's chance in hell that if we forgave CS that it would get spent on the three younger half sibs. The money would get pissed away on some stupid shit or other. So .... we keptthe SpermClan's asses nailed to the wall until the kid turned 18.

And ... once he starts college we will nail their asses to the wall for CS again.

Because ....... we can! }:)

As other's have indicated is the case when there skids are traveling, the SpermClan never has given the Skid money for food before putting him on a plane back home. When we have given the Skid cash before he travels it gets used for gas for the SpermClan, paying for restaurant bills for the SpermClan, etc during visitation....

So, we opened an account for him and got him a debit card. We transfer money in to his account before he gets on the plane so he can eat during layovers or on the plane. When he lands in SpermLand ..... we transfer all of the money out of his account so that the SpermClan can not guilt him in paying their bills. When he is with them, we make damned sure that we are not paying any of his or their expenses.

Best regards,

disneymom78's picture

Rags.. I have to comment on this... Though your screen name is "Rags" i doubt you know what they are... you say..

"When you consider the cost of our home, private school (or the taxes for top school districts), food, clothing, transportation, entertainment, extracurricular activities,and all of the other various and sundry Skid related expenditures we make ...... CS covers less than 10% of what we spend on the kid each year."

What kind of home you living in? do the kids have their OWN rooms? Where I came from (only 1 set of parents) I had to share a bedroom with my 2 sisters. My 3 brothers had to share 1 too. Private school? that is a luxury, entertainment? what kinds of things are you taking them to? extracurricular acticiaties? you can't do them all.

Basically, if you and the BM want to live extravegently that is up to you. No one is going to stop you from raising your social level (even though you seem to think its ok to stop someone else) but don't blame the bio dad if he can't support that lifestyle.

Just becuase you want to up YOUR lifestyle by fleecing someone else's in the name of the children doesn't make it right or fair.

But hey pity party yourself Im sure the private schooled children will be just fine. Wink

Rags's picture


Yes, I have busted my ass to be reasonably successful in life. We are not wealthy but we have been fairly successful. We can be picky about how we spend our money but we have to work. At least until we win the lottery. }:)

As for how I grew up. Mom and Dad brought me home from the hospital to a travel trailer. My dad made $83/mo and my mom made $95/mo in military family benefits. This was the mid 60's so it was not quite as bad as it sounds but things were tight. (I just got the review of my parents going through their "remember when" stories last weekend so the numbers are right).

They bought a single wide trailer when I was 1.5. They did not buy their first site built home until I was 12yo. They bought their first color TV when I was 19 (1983). After they finished college things got a whole lot more prosperous for my family, just like it did for me when I finished college. Because of the nature and location of their employment my brother and I had to go to boarding school for HS. Their employer paid for most of the boarding school costs. They helped my little bro and I with college though we both had to work and take out school loans for undergrad. We both paid for grad school on our own. They just retired in Jan after working for 48 years. They did well but they earned it. They provided for their family and prospered by working hard, educating themselves and making their careers in places that had less than 200 miles of paved road in a country the size of Texas. They sacrificed, invested prospered. Neither of my grandfathers’s had more than an 8th grade education so my parents truly started from scratch. Though both sets of my grandparents worked hard and did pretty well.

So, you are correct. I have never worn rags but I was not raised in designer clothing either. At least not in my younger childhood years. JC Penney and Sears was the nice stuff when I was in my single digit and early double digit ages. There was no Wal-Mart back then so our wardrobes had some K-Mart labels also.

I know I won the parent lottery but I did not pick my parents well enough to be independently wealthy at birth. Not that I would trade my parents for any amount of money. They are awesome.

As for extravagance.... never happens. We have both (wife and I) finished grad school and have done well professionally. We invest a large percentage of our income. We have purchased three homes since we married and each time the real-estate agents and mortgage agents tell us that they are shocked that we are buying the home we are (at that time) because we could afford a home 3X more expensive than the homes we have purchased. Each time I have been presented with that proposal I respond with "You pay the mortgage payment and I will buy the more expensive home". So far I have no takers on that deal. Wink

We drive nice but not extravagant cars, we live in nice but not extravagant homes, the nicest neighborhoods we can reasonably afford, live in the best school districts we can comfortably afford a home in so our son (my SS) can get the best education available where we lived, we wear nice but not extravagant clothes, and yes ... my son got the boarding school experience just like I did. He asked for it, we shopped and got a top 20 school for an extremely affordable cost. He failed to do the requisite work to stay so we brought him home half way through his second year (Sr year) and he graduated on time in our local HS ... the best public HS in the state that we lived in at the time.

I have no issue with anyone benefitting from their own efforts. However, in situations where CS is in play, I also have no problem obtaining equitable access to the NCPs income for my StepSon. Equitable being what ever the idiot family court judge will fleece the NCP for at the time. Yes the system is screwed but .... it is the system and those who can benefit from it have an obligation to their (S)kids to do so. Whether that income is from wages, gifts, tax returns, and lottery winnings, bank robbery proceeds, selling drugs, sexual services, prison wages or welfare benefits, the source of the NCPs money makes no difference to me.

Hell, if the NCP is on welfare I just consider CS as a tax return paid monthly since my taxes and those of every other participating tax payer provide that welfare money.

The NCP in our blended family has tried repeatedly to get his CS lowered due to the addition of another out of wedlock spawn, loss of employment, or just because he thinks my wife and I make too much money and he should not have to pay CS since "your mom and stepdad are rich" as he likes to tell our son (my SS). Each time he tries to lower it his CS goes up. Which is just fine with me. If he had won the lottery while my SS was still receiving CS, I would have nailed his ass to the wall for every possible penny my SS could get in CS.

And it would not have caused me one second of heart ache to do it.

But, since he is too f-in stupid to figure out how to support his own spawn he is also to stupid to realize that the lottery is nothing more than a tax for people who can't do math. Every penny he spends on a lottery ticket equates to one more rag his three younger out of wedlock spawn have to wear. That ..... breaks my heart. But ... his younger three are not my problem or my responsibility. Raising his oldest is my responsibility because I am his StepDad. If that means I fleece the SpermIdiot for more CS .... so be it. Besides .... if his CS went down his younger spawn would not have seen a dime of it. He would spend it on his low rider, snow boards, video games or an new goofy ass hair-do in an effort to try to convice the Crips or Bloods that he is black and should be allowed in to a gang. He is as just as black as Opie Cunningham (Think the Andy Griffith Show and Happy Days). Not that there is anything wrong with being black or of any other ethnic, religious or regional back ground. So, I have no problem giving at least one of his children the benefit of his meager income.

As for the lottery, when the jackpot gets really high I will buy a single ticket. The cost to potential benefit is too high to ignore. If I win, great. If I don't, we still have fun planning what we would have done had we won. Sure, some one wins every once in a while. And I would love for it to be me. But, I am much more interested in growing my investments the old fashioned way and the only guaranteed way to do it. Dollar Cost Averaging.

One final thought on the wearing of rags comment. I believe that the only people who wear rags in our country choose to wear rags. If they are truly needy (incapable of providing for themselves due to a physical or mental condition) they can get help from a variety of sources and have no need to wear rags. If they are capable of working and don't, their choice of wearing rags is their own. Of course there are exceptions. Vagrants who live under the over pass are most likely from the first category of people I mentioned.

One of my first cognizant experiences with welfare was when I was in my early teens. I was visiting my GPs for the summer. We went to check the mail at the PO which also had the welfare office in the same building. A woman pulled up in a Cadillac wearing a fur coat, went in side, and came out with a check. ???????? :? I have no problem with the needy getting help, I have a problem with the lazy getting anything….. ever ….. for any reason.

I am not sure what your issue is with my thoughts on the whole lottery/CS thing is. But, I do appreciate your perspective and participation. Truly ... I do.

All IMHO and in my experience of course.

Best regards,

disneymom78's picture

Rags, i do appreciate your response. I can identify with alot of your experiences and I didnt mean to attack you or your situation. I know its got to me frustrating that you go above and beyond for these children and probably without the recognition. I know I've also worked hard to be successful and I have also done alot for my SS only to be called names and put down my the BM. My stepsom even over heard the BM saying she wanted to kick my a$$. He was upset. Step life is hard but worth it for the ones we love.

Take care

Rags's picture


I did not take your response to my response as an attack. I felt that some of my personal and family history might give a bit of understanding on where I was coming from,

I have enjoyed our discourse and do share many of your frustrations on being a responsible Sparent with minimal recognition. My own SS has never called me names (that I have heard) but with the amount of under the breath mumbling he exudes I am sure I have picked up some choice names following the completion of my world class lectures.

I am sure that the put downs you have experienced from BM come from the same place that the less than eloquent toothless moron SpermClan get some of their opinions of me. Though I detest them beyond all others on the planet, I can see where a BioParent (the SpermClan included) might take exception to what you and I (and many other responsible Sparents) bring to the blended family table. We intimidate them. They could not hold on to their Spouse/SO or maintain an intact initial family for their children. When their X finds a responsible, successful second spouse of new partner to grow a quality life, quality family with and who can make a quality contribution to the children they share with our spouses, the former spouse or partner who has been found wanting as far a character or quality is bound to have a severe bout of iferioritis.

IMHO of course.

Best regards,

livlaughlov's picture

Unfortunately we live in a place where CS is not based on the income shares model, only on the gross income of the NCP. The only time there is any modification in CS for the time NCP spends with kids, and his costs, is when he has the kids 40% or more of the time.

Considering that she moved away with the kids, this is impossible for him to do. NCP's have costs at ANY access level (do people really think we don't also make sure we have a room, beds, dressers for them and cars big enough for all to fit?!).

So, I guess it just sucks to be us, we pay for them at her place and we pay for them at our place. :?

livlaughlov's picture

Oh, and we pay 80% of all extra-curricular costs (camps, orthodontics, music etc.) and 100% of medical/dental insurance too. Including CS we spend more on 2 kids that don't live here, BY FAR, than our 2 who do live here. Hell, CP just bought a house and has only worked 11 months in the last 8 years. Go figure!!!

poisonivy's picture

Sounds all too familiar to me, too.

BM would send skids whenever she wanted a break, every holiday--all holiday (yep, she didn't even want them at Christmas), all summer, EOWE and whenever they had breaks from school. But, DH paid CS without missing a beat.

BM pretty much screwed herself out of a perpetual babysitter by moving too far away. So, now we're down to all summer and we'll see what else works.

Tx mommy of 3's picture

Well I think when they calculate cs they automatically divide it by 12. You can get it changed where you don't pay tha month the skid is away however in cases that I've heard like that they end up dividing the cs by 11 so the monthly payments actually go up.

disneymom78's picture

HOLY SMOKES!!! I am so glad someone else is going through this too. The BM complains ohh how horrible it is blah blah blah... yeah well guess what, if the kids came and lived with us the whole year we wouldnt need A DIME FROM THE BM! WE COULD DO IT ALL ON OUR OWN!

We had the SS all summer long, fed them, clothed them, took them to disneyland, had a wedding, and still celebrated BOTH their birthdays! The BM just thinks she's intitaled and doesn't have to work.............................or maybe she can't work!!! cuase no smart business out there would hire a selfish unhappy unqualified lazy BEE---AUCH!!!