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What is included in normal co parenting

ajp1999's picture

I'm writing because I don't know what is normal for co parenting and what is going past boundaries. I'm a new partner to a man that was previously married

Here are some things that happen

A few days a week ex comes into house to drop off kids

The exes parent are going to stay with him several times a year for a weeks span each time

The ex occasionally asks to borrow things

The ex does his taxes. They have some deal worked out where they split all money from taxes

She still has some items in his house that she has to get. And they have been divorced two years

Phone calls daily 90 percent about kids other ten may be other stuff. My internet is not working etc

If she needs small amounts of money she texts him.

Last but not least there is some weird thing where I feel like he walks on egg shells to make her not upset or she will try to get more money from him. So my feeling do come after hers in my mind. He says no that he is just trying to keep the peace.

Thoughts please. Should any of these things bother me? I do want everyone to be peaceful but I'm having a hard time feeling like I'm a third wheel. I don't see that there is room for me after he keeps up with keeping her and her family happy.

ajp1999's picture

Thanks for the advice. He says he has moved on from his ex and that everything he does is to keep the peace and it's for the kids and so he can also keep his money. I feel like they are too intertwined and he says it's not true. He says I'm the one with the problem and I don't know what good co parenting is like. I'm feeling like the relationship he has with his ex and her family are way more important to him than his relationship with me.

Is all this something I need to just get over ?

Orange County Ca's picture

I'm not so sure this is all so bad. I'd have paid a lot to have a co-operative ex-wife when it came to the kids, money etc. Especially now that your boyfriend has a live-in girl friend as that often sets off WWIII with ex-wives. You see they often think he's going to pine for her forever and when it proves untrue all hell breaks loose.

I would ask him to clear out her stuff. It's not hard. He just says "I was cleaning out the closet/garage/attic and ran across this stuff after backing a car-load of it up her driveway. She'll have no choice but to accept it at that point or rent a storage locker.

Tell him the parent should be told that its "Not a good time" to be staying over. If the parent hasn't taken the hint after being told twice then they will have to be told bluntly that what with a new girlfriend in the house visitation rights for parent is over.

I assume the ex is invited in doesn't just walk in. Keep the door locked if she does so she has to knock. It sets a boundary without being in-your-face about it.

You don't want to light off unnecessary animosity between the two of them. In my humble opinion unless he starts going to bars or staying overnight with her I'd leave the rest of it alone.

I'm not pointing fingers at anyone who has or will comment here but some of the ladies here will tell you to start WWIII over the drop of a hat when it comes to ex-wives. I suspect its more over anxiety than anything else because its often over petty crimes. "She didn't talk to me when we dropped off the kids". Beware of over-reactive advise.

Bojangles's picture

That kind of amicable relationship is great for the children and their parents and a lot lower in stress for all concerned, including you, than constant friction, hostility or a Berlin Wall approach. But, there needs to be a balance, a new relationship needs some space and privacy and priority and so naturally some things need to give in the arrangements that have worked up to now with his ex. When you meet someone new there has to be some change and compromise. Otherwise you are sending a clear message that your new partners needs and feelings are not sufficiently important to you for you to make some adjustments. It may be that that is actually the case, and that keeping the status quo with his ex and focussing on parenting is this man's real priority. If that's his choice and he can acknowledge that then fair enough, but then he's effectively making a choice not to invest sufficiently in a new relationship to make it work.

Try picking your battles and assessing how he reacts. If it's a defensive shutdown it's a bad sign, because that reaction based on fear of change would permeate every future issue affecting your lives together. If my husbands ex had not been so unpleasant I would not have had a problem with her popping into the house during some collections or stop offs, or the borrowing stuff or phone calls a couple of times a week. But daily phone calls are just too intrusive and really not necessary, and so is the detailed insight into his financial affairs that comes with doing his taxes. I would talk to him about those specific issues and see if he's willing and able to listen. And if not make some of the points I talk about above.

Frustr8d1's picture

I wouldn't put up with him supporting 2 households. I think all those things should bother you. When I first moved in with DH, he was still doing all those things for BM too. He made her mortgage, her car payments & insurance. He paid her bills, and filled her car with gas on a regular basis. BM would call or text every hour with a different need. One time she texted to tell DH that she cut her finger and needed him to call her ASAP. DH and I were on vacation in another state.

That was my last straw! I told DH I won't tolerate her petty needy tricks and false alarms just so she can try and keep him in her life as a slave to her. WTF could DH do about her papercut finger from another state? Oh, and by the way DH, I will not marry you until you are supporting ONE household (ours) and not two. I added up all BM's bills he was paying and it was over $3,600 a month, not including child support! And he only had 1 child. And shortly after that, DH and I took full custody of SD anyway and have been paying up the ass for her shit for over 6 years while BM found 3 other men to use. She convinced them all to pay her phone bill and other incidentals even before ever being in a relationship with them. How do these BMs manage to lead such easy work-free lives?

ajp1999's picture

Thanks everyone for the advice. He is willing to not have the exes parents stay with him after this next visit so he's willing to make some changes but very reluctantly. He loves her family and has known them for twenty years. The other stuff there are tons if excuses I hear as to why things need to be the way they r. I fear my feeling will always come second.

locke's picture

I am the guy the OP is talking about and I would like to clarify some things.

1) OP didn't mention I told my ex's parents they could NOT stay with me this time. A few days later, OP told me to tell them they COULD. Also, OP forgot to mention they aren't even coming to see me, they are coming to see their son graduate college and to help with my sons because I am out of town for the entire time they are here and my ex wife can't get both of my kids from daycare all week.

2) My EX and I cooperate on our taxes because she makes less money than me and we go against what is in the divorce decree because if she claims all the kids, etc, there is a bigger return for her. By doing this, it allows her to give me all my child support $ back throughout the year. Also, this tax thing is a temporary thing.

3) The ex does not "occasionally" ask to borrow things. Her BF asked one time to borrow a ladder I had for his job. I wasn't even home (I was at work) and didn't think it was a big deal. He lives with my ex wife and they split bills so I thought if it was for his job, that is a good thing. Again, this happened one time over a year ago and I actually told them "no" IIRC because it bothered OP.

4) The ex saw me at Christmas getting my Christmas stuff out when she dropped the kids off one day which reminded her she never got any of the kid's handmade Christmas ornaments (we got divorced in the summer so Christmas ornaments isn't exactly something you think about when you split stuff up in August). Is this really a big deal?

5) She does come in my house for 10 seconds to drop my 4 year old off. At this time I am usually getting ready for work and my ex's arrival time varies greatly. I can't wait by the front door for 30 minutes for her to show up. Also, if I'm in the shower I don't want to jump out and come to the door either. My 4 year old is usually grumpy and tired that early in the morning and is very "huggy" and "hold me" oriented. She simply walks in (I leave the door open) puts him on the sofa and leaves. We are talking like 10 seconds and I don't even see her.

6) about the money - "if she needs small amounts of money, she texts him" - this isn't exactly true. If the ex buys the boys something that I need to split the cost on, she texts me how much she needs. If I didn't feed the boys lunch yet and the ex comes and gets them, I pay for their lunch (like $7). $7 isn't a big deal to me and I wouldn't ask my ex for $7 but $7 to my ex is a lot of money (she doesn't make a lot of money).

7) the ex called me like one time because her Internet wasn't working and my kids were flipping out they couldn't watch their shows, play their games, etc. I had sold her a WIFI AP a long time ago and she simply asked me if that could be the problem. I am also in IT. I told her I didn't know and that she should probably call Time Warner if it doesn't come back online soon.

I am trying to simply keep the peace as best as I can with my ex. I don't kiss her a&* or anything but I am civil toward her and we cooperate on things. She did not rake me over the coals for $ in the divorce (thankfully) and she currently doesn't ask for child support (though she could ask for about $2,000/month). My ex and I get along. I see her for literally 3 minutes a week (during kid exchanges). I don't relish the idea of paying my ex a dime because I don't think it would be used for my kids but rather her and her BF. I have zero feelings for her (she cheated on me) and I don't really care what she does with her life.

I have known her parents for over 20 years and I don't see why I should turn my back on people that have done me no wrong and have been very nice to me over the years. I don't consider them my family or anything but more like friends. I'm not sure that is a bad thing.

Now, I'm not saying everything I do is perfect but I think OP is being a little unfair with the facts and my motivations. My motivation is to get along with my ex for the next 14 years (until my youngest is 18) and then never deal with her again.

My ex wife and I don't have fights, don't really argue, our kids our happy, and we have both moved on with our lives. I don't make big deals out of small crap (like the Christmas ornaments) because it isn't worth fighting about really. What should I have told my ex when she asked for a couple of the kid's Christmas ornaments? No? Go away? I mean it was simply an overlooked item (who thinks about Christmas ornaments in August?).

locke's picture

Thank you for your reply. I am not saying I am 100% right about all things but I am doing my best as a single dad and I am willing to compromise on some things, yes.

locke's picture

I guess that is a finer point about single dad vs divorced dad.

Perhaps you misunderstood. I said I am willing to compromise with OP (not the ex wife).

I have no idea what you are talking about in your last sentence.

locke's picture

Is telling my kid's grandparents they can't stay with me not a compromise? Is telling my ex wife to only text me about kid related stuff?

QueenBeau's picture

I think that it's compromise but for the wrong reason. You feel like "Ugh I'm doing this because my gf is stupid" instsead of "I'm doing this because these things make my gf uncomfortable & I care about her feelings."

At least that's how it comes off over the internet - how do I know.

Why can't "your kids grandparents" (aka your ex wife's parents) stay with your ex wife?

locke's picture

Actually, in all honesty I wouldn't mind if OP's kid's grandparents (on her dad's side) stayed at her house.

QueenBeau's picture

That's the difference. You don't mind. She does. It's all about feelings. & if you, as HRNYC is suggesting, have strong feelings that you need to do the things that OP has strong feelings you should not, then cut ties now & save yourself the years of arguing.

That's what 'dating' is for. To figure out if a marriage will work. HRNYC always says "well what about his feelings" & everyone on here always assumes that the other party is willing to give up things for their SO. If not, then they need to end it. Why start a marriage when you'll both be miserable? Why continue a relationship where you both will?

Either way, I don't see you saying htat. I see you saying you're going to give up these things, even though it seems grugingly. HRNYC is suggesting that if you feel that you NEED to do these things, OP should shut up. That is not the truth. If you feel you have to/want to do these things, & OP hates it & it hurts her feelings, you need to cut ties & try again.

locke's picture

This is not true. I have tried for the last month to work out things with OP. I have told her I am willing to make adjustments to make her feel better and actually already. have made a few. I set boundaries with my ex about what is appropriate conversation. I told me ex her parents could not stay at my house. I have asked OP repeatedly what is she wants me to do. I am not critizing anybody. I'm simply looking for a good balance. Does getting along with my ex mean I am not able to have a relationship with somebody? Are these things mutually exclusive?

locke's picture

I wasn't trying to make anybody look like a fool. I was simply making sure you guys had all the facts. That is all. I told OP I would tell the ex no more dropping my 4 year old off. I will wait by the door.

locke's picture

I am not sure what you are talking about. My ex is not the #1 in my life. I actually told her her parents could NOT stay at my house (OP said to tell them they could).

I have no idea what this "toss shade" means. Are you really unreasonable enough to not understand how somebody could forget to split Christmas ornaments in August during a divorce? It was simply something overlooked. You are blowing things out of proportion. My has me by the balls because she wanted a couple of our kid's Christmas ornaments that I had?

I have set boundaries with my ex-should I have told her to go jump in a lake when she asked if she could have a couple of our kid's ornaments? I don't understand why that is a big deal.

I have told you the truth. My intent by posting here was to simply clarify things OP stated so you people can perhaps understand where I am coming from. I mean Christmas ornaments? Really? That is a major thing here?

locke's picture

What other line item are you interested in going over? Why would I tell the mother of my kids who asked me for a couple of our kid's handmade ornaments to go "choke on them"? What kind of attitude is that to have?

locke's picture

1) I think I clarified this in another post. What specifically do you want to know besides the fact we have an arrangement that she bascially gets the kids and HoH and the tax return from that and in return I don't have to pay her child support.

2) Since my ex lives with her bf (they are not married) these grandparents are very very religious and do not condone 'living in sin'. They don't want to stay with the ex and her bf because they think that would mean they condone it. I actually told them they could NOT stay with me but OP told me to tell them they could.

3) 95% of my ex and I texts are about kid exchange times/locations and scheduling. 5% of the time is about money (she bought them shoes and I need to give her half of the cost).

She is not "constantly" around me. I literally see her for a maximum of 3 minutes PER WEEK. This is during the kid exchanges.

locke's picture

1) willing to stay married to her? We aren't married anymore. Where do you get this stuff? Child Support is a financial arrangement agreed upon by both parties in our scenario. My ex and I both agreed to handle Child Support in a mutually beneficial way. That is called cooperation.

2) OP and I are not married and do not live together. I told them they could not stay with me because I knew it bothered OP. OP later said to tell them they could. They don't want to stay with their daughter because she lives with her BF (in sin I suppose). They are very against people not married living together. I know this is not my problem but they are coming here to help with my kids because I am going to be gone for a while and won't be able to pick them up etc. like I normally do. My ex probably thought the boys would be more comfortable with their grandparents at their own house with all of their toys and stuff vs. some hotel. Also, it would save money and I am not going to even be home. I don't have any problem with these grandparents and have known them for 20 years and still like them. To me it wasn't a big thing, but to OP it was, thus I told them NO.

3) We text usually like once a day, usually to coordinate who is going to pick up my youngest from day-care because it varies from day to day. We also may text about changing our weekly schedule sometimes.

Drac0's picture

>My has me by the balls because she wanted a couple of our kid's Christmas ornaments that I had?<

locke, I'm a divorced man as well. When I split with my ex, we had a signed notarized statement of who gets what, what was to be split, etc. Once it was done, it was done. There were some things overlooked but guess what? As part of the written agreement it was stipluated that neither of us can chase after the other for something that was "overlooked". Part of the healing process of a divorce is to move on and NOT have to go back to the ex for some trinket or momento that was left behind. So while no one is suggesting that your ex has you by the balls, it appears to me (and please correct me if I am wrong) is that there will ALWAYS be something to bring her back to lay claim to. This suggests to me, (and others here) that your divorce with your ex was NEVER finalized, at least not on an emotional level. There will always be something to bring your ex back to you. There's an old saying, when a monkey jumps from branch to branch, it never lets go of the previous branch for fear of falling. Only when the monkey can actually let go can it move forward more quickly and more freely. Same analogy is used for breakups. Breakups where the couple still "Hold onto" the previous branch will never be free and move on.

Drac0's picture

Darn Dtzy, you made me sad right now... Sad

And here I was thinking you and I would be raking in the millions with our new show Step-kid Swap!

Drac0's picture

locke. Thank you for coming on here and clarifying. A lot of what you wrote does make sense from a day-to-day standpoint

BUT....

and it has been said on here before, your first priority should be to the OP and your first responsibility should be to your children. You don't sound at all like you are emotionally attached to your ex, but it is obvious that there are certain things about your arrangement with your ex that makes the OP uncomfortable. If I allowed my ex to walk into my house unattended, believe me my wife would have a few choice words for me. It's great to be civil and cooperative with your ex. Kudos to you, BUT...(again) should things go south, your ex is going to walk into your house one day, see an empty bottle of beer you left on the coffee table from the night before and next thing you know, CPS is being called. I don't want to sound alarmist but I have seen this sh*t happen way too many times before and ALWAYS with divorced couples who were trying to be civil and cooperative with each other. Ex's need to be kept at arm's length in order to protect yourself and the new family that you are trying to establish.

askYOURdad's picture

Absolutely. Boundaries are necessary for any successful co-parenting. It protects the parents and helps the children. I can't think of one negative thing that can be said about boundaries.

locke's picture

I appreciate your constructive comments. It seems some on this thread are very bitter and antagonistic or something. I am being attacked for just trying to clarify things about OP's post.

I already told OP I would tell my ex to not come into my house if that makes her feel better.

locke's picture

If she was going to clarify the facts, she would have done so in the original post. I was just making sure all the facts were out there as best as I can remember.

Drac0's picture

Awesome! But don't do this just for her benefit. Do it for yours as well....Boundaries with ex's is a good thing. A VERY good thing.

locke's picture

I'm not sure what you are talking about. Nothing illegal is going on with the taxes she simply claims both kids and head of household.

QueenBeau's picture

I also find it odd he says earlier he doesn't pay her CS because she doesn't ask for it. Then he says he gets his CS back by doing taxes this way. I'm confused. lol

locke's picture

The reason I don't have to pay child support is the tax return is large enough for her to pay her rent for the year.

QueenBeau's picture

Yeah, totally illegal because she lives with her bf right? & he works I'd assume? so she's not head of household. & claiming both kids to give you half of her refund fo rhtem or w/e so you can both pocket more money, also illegal.

I mean idc, I think our tax system is crap & I say if you can get over a little bit go ahead. But it's still illegal.

locke's picture

Yes, she lives with her bf. They both work. HoH actually is determined by where the kids spend > 50% of their time. We have 50/50 custody. Nothing illegal. She can claim both kids if I agree (I don't claim them at all).

locke's picture

She is legally entitled to child support even though we have 50/50 custody. She has told me if she can claim both kids and HoH, then I can have my child support back.

QueenBeau's picture

That's false. that's how who 'legally' can claim kids is determind. CO can trump this, & if it does your ex signs what is essentially a permission slip so that you could claim them that year.

HoH means they are unmarried, have a dependant living with them over 50% of the year, & pay over 1/2 of the expenses for their home. If ex's bf is contributing less than half, then it's not illegal... But I'd imagine any self respecting man would be helping with the bills.

locke's picture

He contributes less than half. He makes hardly anything and has two child support payments to make to two different women.

askYOURdad's picture

This is a line I have only had to use on DH one time and have received feedback from posters here that have used it as well and thanked me for it.

"Congratulations (DH's name)! By avoiding a conflict with BM you have been successful in creating one with me."

locke's picture

Defended her? I simply posted to clarify the facts OP stated. You are blowing things out of proportion. I don't check her AC or lawnmower or any of that crap. How did you even get to that? I never said OP was being completely unreasonable.

locke's picture

What questions have I not answered? My chest is not all puffy or whatever. I didn't attack OP. I am calm and trying my best to answer all your questions.

locke's picture

No. There were a few months when she first got on her own that she needed the monthly child support payments and I gave it to her.

locke's picture

It does seem to have some bitter, attack-happy people on it. I have answered everybody's questions and I'm a "whiner"?

QueenBeau's picture

With all do respect, Locke, I think any woman would repsond to this thread the way that all the women here have. The men here are wording things to save your feelings, but really it's like "Oh this poor guy, he doesn't even KNOW what he's doing" lol.

You came off as controlling like "Oh, my gf wants to complain about ME? Let me explain how STUPID she is."

Read her post, the undertones of it, the sadness. Then read yours. Of course, you can't tell somebodies mood by reading what they write - but if you want to go out on a limb & say people seem bitter - you seem like a jackass. Lol. & she seems boarderline depressed. So no wonder people are coming to say "hey, f off - YOU do this to her. Look how sad she is! YOU and your lack of boundaries did this!"

OP asked a question. The answer is, no this is not normal. No this is not how most blended families work. & if she's uncomfortable - she needs to work it out with you.

Have you guys considered counseling? Perhaps a third party could help.

Honestly, if you all haven't been together too long, I'd suggest she get out & find a man without an ex & kids because it seems to bother her so much & you seem to not understand. & that's ok. But why deal with the stress if you don't have to?

locke's picture

Thanks for the productive comments. You make a lot of good points. I will point out that my ex wife and I were somewhat estranged for several years before our actual divorce. We had grown apart for a long time so when we got divorced, it wasn't a huge change really. We weren't into each other for several years leading up to the divorce.

We split up in the summer of 2012. I can't remember if the Christmas ornament thing was this past Christmas or the year before. Also, I should note that I do tell OP about all of these encounters with the ex wife. I'm a very open and honest person.

MamaFox's picture

See, I won't date a freshly (eg less than two years) divorced man for the exact reasons stated above.

Not that I have to date again, but...my DFH (fiancee) was divorced for 7 years before I even met him. The kids and BM and in laws have no chance of saying I'm a homewrecker or anything of the like, and the boundaries are well rehearsed.

Get some boundaries put in the CO.

askYOURdad's picture

"I think you both are in growing/beginning stages of blended family...what you guys are experiencing is actually quite normal stuff. You both will have to compromise, be patient and realize life with exe's/skids is a very VERY tough road to go down."

^^^I think this is incredibly accurate! How many of us learned through trial and error? How many of us learned proper boundaries only after having them crossed? What the OP and her SO are dealing with are normal dynamics of trying to blend families (despite whatever Adam Sandler and Drew Barrymore plan to depict)

The issue isn't weather or not there are boundaries being crossed, but what the OP and her SO plan to do about it and how they plan to move forward. OP came here asking for help and validation in her feelings. Her SO came here to clarify his position. They both need to log off, hear each other out and compromise!!!

askYOURdad's picture

We are all members here because it isn't easy. Let me give you insight into the future... it never will be easy. Today's obstacles are the BM dropping off a four year old and where that should take place, tomorrow's are kindergarten and who gets to attend the conferences, later will be which baseball team should the kid play on, who is paying for braces, summer camp, car insurance, the kid snuck out of the house and so on and so forth along with a million more and all of the normal family/marriage issues.

This is why boundaries are so important. If everyone was always on the same page you would still be married. It's never going to happen. If you and your ex truly want to successfully co-parent there has to be limits and rules in place on what is acceptable, how to conflict resolve when the unpredictable/unexpected happens etc. Weather or not people here think the BM should get Christmas ornaments is the least of your worries... how you handle it, how you treat your GF to make her comfortable, where you draw the lines, those are what matters.

If you truly do want constructive advice I HIGHLY recommend that you and your GF download the book stepmonster on amazon.

askYOURdad's picture

My ex and I did not have a good relationship. There are no feelings left between us and we struggle to agree on a lot of things, but everyone would say that we co-parent well and that is because of boundaries.

Yesterday I sent him an email with a summer camp that is happening in our area that my bios would absolutely love! It's one week of the summer but I cannot afford it. All I said in the email was- here are the summer daycare arrangements for the bios (which I pay for) I received this email about this camp and think it would be a great opportunity. If it's something that you can swing I know they would have a great time, I would love to but it isn't in the budget. I could probably swing paying for half if I can pay you half now and half on xyz date. It's nothing necessary and completely an extra so if we can't afford it we can't afford it. My ex sent me back an email that said "send me the link to register them, I will pay for it they will really like it"

I wonder how that would be interpreted here. Would the SM come on and say I am "always" asking for money? Would she say I am "always" demanding my ex do what I say? A lot of it is perception, but a lot of it is just having rules for communication. I do not ask my ex for any money. I get CS and I work and have a budget and can afford the necessities and do the extras when I can.

QueenBeau's picture

I wouldn't interpret it that way. When I say BM demands money, I mean she DEMANDS MONEy. Like

"Hey! I had a 8 dollar copay for SD at the doctor, you OWE me"

When we pay for health insurance & per CO she pays the first $250 out of pocket then they split 60/40. It's just crazy & if you say "well per CO" she'll say "NO I DON'T CARE THAT'S NOT FAIR YOU OWE ME & YOU'RE A TERRIBLE DAD IF YOU DON'T PAY"

Lol

If BM ever composed a sane-sounding email like you just wrote, I'd come here to tell you guys bye bye because I don't need stalk anymore!

askYOURdad's picture

Haha... BM here would just tell the skids "I found a great camp you would love... too bad your dad is a deadbeat and refuses to "SUPPORT" you"

Never mind that he pays CS along with them living with him half of the time and DH does a lot of extras for the kids too. She would PAS without even giving him the opportunity and then if he actually did something like that she would tell them it was because he was trying to "buy" their love and it must be nice to have so much extra money while they can barely afford xyz

The fact is, my ex just isn't very involved in that kind of stuff so it was just something I saw and if they could do it I think they would get a very rewarding experience out of it... all of their needs are met, I never told ex he "should" do it or that he "owed" them. I will totally make my kids tell their dad thank you for sending them and let them know it was a treat that he didn't have to do.

askYOURdad's picture

It's all about the approach. When BM comes around demanding what she or the kids "deserve" or are "owed" it's ridiculous and my DH would never give in to that (thank God, I've read horror stories on here that make me eye twitch for the SM) but if BM was rational and actually printed/emailed something and said "hey, I think this would be cool what do you think? (as in, you have an opinion too) can we work something out?"... I would support my DH if he wanted to help. When BM takes three vacations a year, eats out every night, drives a brand new lease every two years etc. etc... yes.. you can afford school supplies and that is what CS is for.

ajp1999's picture

When I try to discuss these things with my boyfriend he tells me I'm not thinking clearly, I'm ridiculous, I don't understand what it takes to raise a child with someone. He says he will compromise on some things, however it seems to be a huge inconvience on him and everyone else involved. He will set up boundaries reluctantly.. he doesn't really want to or that is the feeling I get. I have been told I "can't handle" him having an ex. Which is not true. I've also been told I'm imature and jealous. I don't feel jealous actually at all. So what do i do?

QueenBeau's picture

How long have you been together? How invested are you in this relationship?

I better message you my advice, your bf may come on here & bash you again lol

New second wife-step-mom's picture

ajp, I was told all of those things too! At times I would feel terrible for not wanting "what was best for the child", or being jealous, ridiculous, etc.

Read my comment below...

locke's picture

Incorrect. I am not clarifying her feelings. I simply clarified some of the facts of some things she said.

Cadence's picture

Addressing OP's SO here -

I know you may not like the tone of some things that have been said to you, but the information is valuable.

I want to recognize you because you are trying to accommodate OP's wishes. But I think you are doing it for her, and you don't yet see the value of these changes for you and your future life. And that will cause resentment toward OP to build. Instead of making this a "me against her" thing, why don't you start to understand that with a new relationship, everyone has to adjust. You can't have "keeping ex-wife happy" as your priority, and silently resent OP for not letting you do that and expect things to turn out well. They won't. It's a new day where ex-wife is not the one who needs to be kept happy. Your relationship with OP is your priority, and raising happy and healthy kids without parenting out of guilt is your responsibility. Note that your ex-wife is nowhere in that sentence, because she is your ex-wife. Your family is OP and your kids, and you prioritize your family. Again, note the lack of your ex-wife in that sentence.

Right now, you have not yet transitioned to the present day, where a divorce is The End, where there are boundaries, and where you understand that even though you share a child with your ex, you should no longer be acting like she is your priority. In fact, by being passive with your ex, you will actually create more conflict in your life, it will just be with the woman that you love. You may sabotage a promising relationship by refusing to understand that things NEED to change after a divorce, with or without kids in the picture.

You need to be treating OP with the same respect as you treated your ex-wife when you were married to her. Do you think your ex would have been happy if another woman was allowed to walk into your house? I'm guessing she would not stand for that. Do you think that your ex would have been happy if you were informally giving money to another one of your exes? Do you think she would have been happy if another ex still had possessions at your house and you thought that it was a perfectly normal thing? Your ex-wife would have known that she was not your priority, she would have raised hell, and you would have deferred to her as the #1 woman in your life. So why is it that OP is not treated the same? Is she not the woman in your life?

Why is OP punished for wanting to be the #1 woman in her relationship? Why is that selfish of her?

Many men do not understand that co-parenting is a business relationship directly pertaining to the needs of the kids (schooling, extracurriculars, health and emotional health, and scheduling issues). Anything beyond that is not parenting, it is holding onto the strings of the past marital relationship.

I think you've caused yourself more problems by trying to do this divorce amicably if your ex-wife has control issues. Why? You haven't severed ties in a healthy way. And let me tell you how this is going to go if she has emotional instability. Someday (hopefully very soon!) you're going to finally complete your emotional divorce, start living in the present, and you're going to understand the value of healthy boundaries. If your ex-wife is a balanced person, she may be mildly upset when things start changing in order for you to make space in your life for a healthy new beginning/relationship, but she will adjust in order to respect you and your new relationship. If she is not a balanced person, all hell will break loose. That is your clue that a truly amicable divorce where no one is punished for moving on with their life was never going to be possible. And all of the loosey-goosey "no we don't need CS or custody order or formal division of property" can and will be used against you in order for her to regain the sense of control that she feels slipping away.

You will be a very lucky man if your amicable low-key divorce set-up continues after you seriously move on with your love life. I hope, for you, that it does. But the posters on this site have seen this set up dissolve into horror stories over and over. We have seen the kids suffer for it, and be used as pawns so one parent can punish the other. We have seen "amicable financial arrangements" like yours go into court, and ex-wifey sues for CS. If she does, then if you don't have rock-solid records of all the money that you have informally given to her, she can get arrears back to the date of your divorce. She will do these things to punish you for removing her from the place of #1 priority in your life. It happens all the time, even when two naive people think that an informal amicable divorce is possible. Sometimes it is only possible to maintain this post-marital limbo until someone makes the totally selfish Wink choice to fully move on with their love life. It can happen even if the ex-wife is seemingly happy in her new relationship. My SO's ex has been in a relationship since they split, but she is still creating chaos and misery at every happy milestone that he and I experience. She views him as her property and someone to be controlled, and his commitment and happiness with me directly conflict with how she views him, and so she rages and punishes.

The sooner you start living in the present day, the lesser the fall-out, and the better chance you have at not screwing up your new relationship. And, believe it or not, you will limit the amount of conflict that your kids are exposed to.

Very few divorced couples can keep up this friendship and harmony after both have devoted themselves to new partners. I hope that can happen for you. You'll find out once you live in the present. You're going to need to do that if you want a confident woman in your life, as any woman who would be with you and not insist that you start living in the present day is going to be a doormat. So why not start today and hopefully repair your relationship with OP and get it back on solid ground?

If you're not willing to do this, then I think OP has a choice where this is something that she is willing to live with or she is not. She can't change you, and any changes you make have to be 100% your idea or you will resent her. I think that you need to decide if you're ready to start living in the now and honoring your present day commitments. If you're not, then you're not ready for a new relationship that does not include your ex-wife.

Disneyfan's picture

I don't agree with everything Locke is doing. However, I think it's crazy to change what works for you and your kids in order to please someone you just started dating. At this point you're still getting to know one another.

What happens if the relationship ends in a few weeks or months? Should he be expected to change the way he deals with his ex-wife and her family each time there's a new woman in his life?

That fact that this is a new relationship is the main point to me. I think it would be easier to walk away than to force someone you just started dating to change the way he interacts with his former family.

Cadence's picture

I agree with your post, but doesn't every relationship needs to start somewhere? He's divorced so he needs to start from scratch. Every relationship is going to be new until he finds something lasting, and to get to something lasting, he needs to prioritize the woman in his life.

As for whether Locke is ready to make those changes that OP needs to see is another story. If he's not, then I agree that OP should walk away rather than try to change him to meet her needs. Maybe there is potential between the two of them, but the timing isn't right. Maybe they can find one another again in a few months, or maybe there's a guy out there who is already capable of meeting OP's reasonable need to be the #1 woman in her relationship.

New second wife-step-mom's picture

ajp1999 and bf,

Your story sounds alot like mine.

I would like to tell a little bit of my story. DH and I had a LD relationship but right before our wedding I noticed that DH (then BF)would always accept BM calls when we were together (just in case something had happened to SS13). I had a talk with DH about this and he agreed to back off from talking to BM and assured me that him and BM did not have emotional ties.

Well, then we married and on our honeymooon BM called DH to find out when he would be back in town. She was already told this, so that was our first argument. Then, I found out that BM had lived at DH's house even after the divorce, that DH and BM would take SS out to dinner together, that DH and BM either talked on the phone or seen each other every day and that BM had a key to OUR house. BTW, BM also did not take all of her keepsakes before I moved in.

We have been married 5 years now and needless to say there have been countless arguments because DH and BM were the monkeys that still have ahold of the same tree. If she needed money she would call and DH would hand it over with no questions asked. If she wanted to call and talk about SS she would and then go off on whatever else she wanted to talk about that had nothing to do with SS. She would insist on having meetings with DH and would want to come in OUR home. When she got in there she would act inappropriately to my DH and DH would not say one thing to her because he was afraid to offend her and he didn't want to cause any rifts with BM. So I would be required to sit there and take whatever DH and BM dealt in whether it was conversations not about SS or BM patting DH on the leg in our home because DH did not want to have to pay her CS and he wanted to co-parent with BM.

Then the icing on the cake was when SS got a little older and seen that I insisted on a few basic boundaries for BM he hated me because those boundaries had never been put into place before me, I was the enemy!!! Oh and then BM started insisting on having private conversations with DH because she did not want to talk in front of me, obviously about me.

I have fought my way to have a few boundaries but I know in my heart DH only did it because I insisted and fought for it, not because he really wanted to. I now know that he tried harder to please BM and not get her angry then he did me.

Now 5 years later I can tell you I am not so sure it was worth it to fight for something that your mate can not do just because of his love and respect to you.

There is so many similar things in our stories that I could tell you, for instance when BM wanted the baby book, when they did their taxes together, all of the special little arrangements they made just the two of them.

All the while, DH insisted that he was finished with BM because she had an affair and he did not want her back. Strangely, I do believe that DH was probably finished with BM to a certain degree but still very attached to her emotionally and liked the attention of having 2 women. BM was finished with DH but she needed him financially and very much wanted to keep him on a string in between her men because it was profitable to her financially.

It is a sad story and a sad and disappointing life for the "other" woman.

New second wife-step-mom's picture

I would also like to add that when the majority of this stuff was going on BM had a live-in BF.

locke's picture

I just found out my mom may have breast cancer, my Aunt just passed away a couple of hours ago, and some other bad news. I have had enough of a beating for one day and I'm taking a break from this thread. I do appreciate the constructive comments and there was some good info in some of the posts. I am willing to make compromises but I do not agree that I should give my ex a dime. I do not want her becoming dependent on my money for anything, if she does, I'll be paying that for 14 more years which I think is unfair since we have 50/50.

locke's picture

I know my responsibilities, I assure you. I am a great dad to my boys and they want for nothing. I see to that, I assure you. My ex and I share 50/50 custody and split child expenses largely down the middle. My ex doesn't want the child support, thus she gives it back to me. I have already stated this. You have no idea the sacrifices I have made and the things I have endured for my kids' sake. You make it seem like I am some sort of deadbeat dad who leaves his kids needs hanging in the wind. NOTHING could be further from the truth, I assure you. I don't put out a dime to support my children? Where do you get this stuff from? Oh, and thanks for the lesson on how babies are made.

AllySkoo's picture

I think I have one of the "easier" smom gigs on these boards, so I'll chime in from a moderate viewpoint. Just so you know where I'm coming from, I've been married to DH for 6 years (together for 8 years), he was divorced for 2 before I met him. I've got 3 stepdaughters who were 8, 11 and 13 when I met them. His ex cheated on him (and married the guy she cheated with). His ex isn't psycho - I may not *like* her (or understand her choices), but I don't hate her. The kids have periodically given me problems (which is why I sought out forums), but I have no particular issue (usually) with BM.

Now, ajp1999 - "Should" you have problems with all that? Well... you don't HAVE to. It's not necessarily wrong if you do, but it wouldn't be all that weird if you were OK with it either. BM has been in my house to pick up the girls, didn't bother me. They've had to supply tax information to each other for CS stuff - as long as MY financial info isn't included, it doesn't bother me. (DH and I keep finances separate.) We've actually done to a hockey game with his ex BIL and wife. They're nice. I can see why DH wanted to stay in touch, it's fine. DH talks to BM periodically. Hell, he puts her on speaker phone sometimes if he wants my opinion on whatever the subject is! So you don't HAVE TO have a problem with it all, it doesn't NECESSARILY mean you're second place. But.... you feel that way. And THAT is a problem. It's not really about the crap you listed here - that's part of it, sure, but not the real issue. The thing is that my DH *always* makes me feel like he and I are a team. Remember I said he puts BM on speaker phone? Because he *values my input*. And shows it. And for whatever reason, you're not feeling that from your boyfriend. Maybe things will change, maybe they won't, but I think you need to set a timeline for yourself (and him). "If things aren't better by (pick a date), we need to split up." Figure out what exactly will make you feel better. See if he can do that. It might be that he can't, so be ready for that.

Locke - You're not really wrong, but you're not right either. There's nothing inherently wrong with the way you're dealing with your ex-wife. The problem is that your girlfriend isn't happy. So what are you willing to do? Yeah, she might have some "boundaries" she wants when it comes to the ex coming to the house or calling. And it sounds like you took those to heart and implemented some changes. Good for you. But she's still unhappy enough to come here and seek advice. So what ELSE can you do? It doesn't have to be about your ex you know. You don't have to start WWIII with her or blow up your world. Is there anything else you can think of to show your girlfriend she's special? That you value her and what she thinks and feels? Only YOU know what you can do there. Maybe it means you ask her opinion about summer camps. Maybe it's cooking her favorite meal which she knows you hate. Who knows? But how can you let her know DAILY that you're thinking of her? That's really all she's asking for - to know that you're thinking of her and her feelings. It's just centered on the whole divorce thing because that's where she feels it most. But if you make her feel like she's completely your teammate and partner and that you think of her and her feelings, then she can deal with your ex a lot better.

The thing is, I think you guys aren't just on different pages, you're on whole different books. It doesn't sound like you want the same things or value the same stuff. You might both be happier with a different relationship. Tough to tell just from a few posts though, so I wish you both the best!

Edited to add: So sorry about your aunt, and I hope your mom is OK!

askYOURdad's picture

I really hope the OP and Locke read this... this is very solid and helpful advice. Thank you for sharing, it benefits more than just the OP!

New second wife-step-mom's picture

Op,
I just realized I gave you my story but didn't really answer your questions. So here you go.

A few days a week ex comes into house to drop off kids -- NEVER should happen!

The exes parent are going to stay with him several times a year for a weeks span each time - - NOT! If he wants to invite you and go to dinner with them and the kids (without the EX) that should be up to you. How do you feel???

The ex occasionally asks to borrow things --- NEVER! She has other friends or family and if not too bad.

The ex does his taxes. They have some deal worked out where they split all money from taxes ------ ALL of the SPECIAL deals need to come to an end! Their lives should be seperate.

She still has some items in his house that she has to get. And they have been divorced two years --- Just another thing that needs to come to an END. Another method of staying emotionally attached!

Phone calls daily 90 percent about kids other ten may be other stuff. My internet is not working etc

-- THERE should NEVER be conversation about anything other than NECESSARY conversations about the CHILDREN.

If she needs small amounts of money she texts him.
_________
---Shouldn't happen! EVERYTHING should be either court ordered or pre-determined. She can send a weekly/monthly statements mailed to the house and he can mail her back a check. Limits phone and person to person contact!

Last but not least there is some weird thing where I feel like he walks on egg shells to make her not upset or she will try to get more money from him. So my feeling do come after hers in my mind. He says no that he is just trying to keep the peace.

----- You feel that way because he probably does!!!! Yep, you are more than likely second place and how she feels trumps yours because he's afraid what she will or will not do!!!

20YearsAsAStep-Mom's picture

Tog is spot on. Bf is controlling and not good for your mental health.

locke's picture

I never said I was correct nor did I say she was wrong. If you read my original post I simply said I was clarifying some things. Also, if you read closely you'll see I said I know not everything I do is perfect. I acknowledge I may not do everything perfect and I'm willing to reach compromises. I am not rigid (I actually told my ex she is not allowed in the house anymore nor can her parents stay at my house). I did not "hijack" any thread. My GF sent me the URL to this website and her post, I commented on it. I see now what a hostile environment your community can be. There are some who offer some good ideas and suggestions....then there are others who make personal attacks against people they don't know. Also, I'm not sure if this has occurred to you but maybe my gf and I have had offline personal discussion about our feelings that we do not see a need for you to take part in.

AllySkoo's picture

" Also, I'm not sure if this has occurred to you but maybe my gf and I have had offline personal discussion about our feelings that we do not see a need for you to take part in."

Um.... so what? I'm genuinely bewildered why you'd even add that. OF COURSE you guys talk outside of this forum, or at least we all hope you do! And OF COURSE we aren't privy to those conversations. And... so what? All we can do is offer comments or advice on what you DO share with us, which should be.... obvious. So what do your "offline" conversations have to do with the price of tea in China?

locke's picture

That was meant for those who want to classify my feelings for my GF based solely on what they read here.

Disneyfan's picture

Why is it wrong for a husband (or hell even a BM or SK) to come here and give their side of the story?

I agree that the OP should walk away.

moeilijk's picture

What's wrong is to make it into a he-said/she-said issue, where vague things like feelings are debated in terms of whether someone is a good/bad person for whatever they feel.

No problem coming on if the OP's BF wants to listen/share under the same terms as the OP originally did --- or to start his own post.

Had he come on saying, "I saw it this way, my take on it is this, I don't understand why we're not agreeing," that's one thing. But he came on saying, "she's wrong, I'm right, I'll prove how she's wrong, and if you still think she's right then I'll label you bitter or attacking"

Personally, I wish we had more views to some discussions. Sometimes it seems we get a poor beat-up SM with no boundaries and now a baby, a possibly cheating spouse, a step kid who pees the bed, another who is violent, and her income goes to buy BM more tattoos going toe-to-toe with the pro-BM faction who think the SM should get a second job so that DH can take bed-wetter and knife-wielder to get matching tattoos.

AlreadyGone's picture

??'s for the OP...

How did your SO find himself here? Did you show him the advice you received and suggest he post himself? Or did he check up on you and decide that he wanted to be heard? I don't want to make assumptions before I have the facts.

OR

Has everyone here been drawn in to a trolling scenario?

Again, not trying to make assumptions.

ajp1999's picture

Just FYI. I created this post and gave the link to my bf so that we could both get some third party advice. I didn't know he was going to join the discussion.

Disneyfan's picture

If you both want advice, then you both have to be able to post.

You gave him the link so he came and gave his side of the story.

AlreadyGone's picture

Thanks for clarifying the situation. Believe it or not, it helps to have all the facts before passing judgment or giving advice. Smile

It seems as though you both need to have an open and honest conversation with each other about what your expectations are. Perhaps that should have happened before you posted? I only say this b/c it's clear that you are on different pages with each other at the moment. It isn't good to get in to the whole 'he said-she said' dynamic on any forum, since much of what is put in posts can be triggering for everyone. (Which is why you both got such opposing advice.) I'm sure that you both have valid concerns and POV's but, adding more confusion by bringing in outsiders probably isn't going to help either of you.

As a SM, you will have to learn to pick your battles carefully. The truth is, YOU will carry most of the burden, and not all of us are cut out for that task. Having said that, your SO needs to understand that he can't have everything the way he, his child, his ex, or his/her family wants it. Compromise is your only option, if your relationship is to survive.

Already we have heard BOTH of your 'perceptions' and they have been in direct opposition with each other. Maybe couple's counseling would be more beneficial than the anonymous advice that you'll receive here....... JMHO.

***No offense to other forum members is intended. I know that most of you are caring individuals with a wealth of experience and very thoughtful suggestions. Wink

Rags's picture

This situation definitely does not pass the test of reasonableness or the smell test IMHO. Something is amiss with the over exposure and over familiarity in daily life between your BF and his XW/BM.

I am sorry but his XW does his taxes and they split the return? WTF is up with that? :? :O Fine on splitting the return but when you split the blanket and divorce you do not share your post divorce financial information with your XW. Find a neutral CPA and both submit your information and have the professional do the taxes then split the cost. Are they divorced filing jointly or some such crap? I do not think that is even an option.

After divorce the one moving out gets their shit and leaves never to return and for damned sure should not be allowed to use your BFs house as her personal storage facility.

I would nip this crap in the bud were I you. It just stinks like old skanky underwear to me.

rahrah2019's picture

What's the big deal about the Christmas ornaments, you ask? This exact thing happened to us, BM texted DH wondering if he knew where her "kitchen Christmas ornaments" were. I'll tell you how it made me feel at the time. I'll preface it by saying that every couple months (this thing probably being the second or third thing she came up with) she was texting or calling asking about random items. It made me (as a new wife) feel that she could just insert herself into our life at will if she was not put in her place. The first time she asked for something after I was in the picture, my DH blew her off by saying, "I'm not sure where it could be." I was unhappy with that, because it leaves the door open for further questioning. Then she asked about the Christmas ornaments. DH was about the same way, and that's when I asked him if it would be so hard to say, "The only items we have in our home are things we have a use for. Everything else has been donated or destroyed." I felt that those words would let her know that she need not bother asking about anything in the future. Why should your new girlfriend have to feel like your ex can barge in on your life whenever she likes?

I forget if it was you or someone else who asked the question about changing boundaries for each new relationship. What if it doesn't work out? Then are you supposed to change the boundaries again when someone new comes along? Well, yes and no. First of all, if you set up healthy boundaries (ones that make your gf feel as though she is the priority), then chances are you won't have to change anything for anyone else. But each person is different, and possibly someone new might require more or less. I'd also like to add that when those boundaries aren't in place, it's very confusing to the child involved. Children, by nature, would like their parents to be together. When you act in a way that blurs the line of it being over, it's just not healthy for the child. The child will also start to show resentment toward your new relationship, as new gf will be viewed as someone who is in the way of her "family." I think that is as big of a reason as your new relationship itself to set up healthy boundaries.

Much like your story, locke, my DH's wife cheated on him. She was estranged for a couple years prior, and walked out on DH and SS. Much like you, my DH likes to keep the peace. When reading your story, I became grateful again that my SS is nearly 13 and not 4. And I couldn't help but relive the stomach-twisting of those wretched conversations about Christmas ornaments. It's not just Christmas ornaments, that's what you need to know.

locke's picture

Sometimes is may not be about Christmas ornaments...but sometimes it is. I was in my garage getting all of my Christmas stuff out and placing it on the ground when my ex pulled up in my drive way to drop my boys off. She saw the Christmas ornaments box and it reminded her she never got any of the kids' handmade ornaments. I told her to take a few. She did and then left. That was all there was to it. She doesn't call all the time saying she forgot something.

locke's picture

I defend myself because you people are attacking me and my actions. Not once have I sided with my GF? I have simply tried to clarify some things that were stated. As a matter of fact I have told my ex she isn't allowed in my house anymore nor can her parents stay at my house again. You make blanket statements like "your loyalty is misplaced" etc. yet the total sum of what you know about me is a few posts I made. You make judgements about people based on a little information like you have all the facts. You don't. You are entitled to your opinions of course but I do think some of you read way too much into simple things. Instead of replying to my post about this whole Christmas ornaments deal, you change the subject to something else and attack me and make blanket statements about me instead of acknowledging that sometimes people just forget to separate Christmas ornaments when divorcing in the summer.

rahrah2019's picture

And like I told my DH, if those Christmas ornaments meant so much to the ex, she wouldn't have walked away without them. Funny how they try to show the new gf their place in your life at such convenient times. I asked my DH, "Did BM call five times a night to check on SS when she was out whoring around on you?" No, of course she didn't. She somehow knew that daddy was completely capable of taking care of him then; but now that there's a new woman in the picture, she suddenly has to check in. Never mind the kid is now practically a teenager, where he was eight at that time. They pull out hokey reasons to insert themselves in your life and show the new gf their "place." It's your job to make sure she knows her place in your life is completely in the past. Why would you not want to provide that much comfort and reassurance to your new gf?

locke's picture

I understand. Some posts on here have been more useful than others but I get defensive when attacked. One user basically stated I was a deadbeat dad who didn't want to pay his child support.

Instead of making blanket statements about my feelings for my GF, I wonder why nobody asks a question. I answered almost every question asked of me. Also, some have said I don't care about how my GF feels. I wonder if it has not occurred to them that perhaps we have had discussions about our feelings in private? Instead of asking, "have you guys been talking about things?" or "has any progress been made?" I read things like "he doesn't care about you" and things like that.

I don't mind my ex NOT coming into my house anymore other than the fact it makes my mornings more difficult to navigate. As for the ex-in laws, I still like them, I'm not sure if that is a bad thing or not but as I stated, when they asked if they could stay at my house when I was gone, I told them "no". My GF (OP) told me to tell them they could. When I told them no originally there was no more discussion from my end about it. That was my intent in coming here. She sent me the URL and I saw that some things may have needed some clarifications so you guys would have more facts to deal with. That is all. I didn't mean to offend anybody or start some sort of war with any of the people on this forum. If you read my original post I believe I said things like I don't have all the answers nor do I admit to everything I do is the perfect answer. I am open-minded and willing to make adjustments. I have learned that some on this forum are less so.

I think there are several members of this site who sound very bitter about their ex. I am not that way. I was wronged in many ways by her but I moved on a long time ago. I don't hate the ex nor do I like her. I view her simply as the mom of my kids and chose to work cooperatively with her on raising them. I noticed several members speak very poorly of their ex. I question if they hold on to some resentment maybe. I do not.

This Christmas ornament thing is a perfect example. To some, there is something sinister about me getting Christmas ornaments out of my garage, the ex dropping my kids off and seeing what I was doing, reminded her that she never got a couple of the kids' homemade ornaments. That kind of thing happens. Now, I could do what some of you may have done and made a big deal about that or I could have simply said, "ok, take a couple". She did and left. That's it.

Divorces are messy and ugly oftentimes. Sometimes, not. Everybody's situation is different though there are probably echoes of commonalities here and there. Now, some of you may have made a huge deal out of the Christmas ornament scenario, maybe got into a big fight about it. Others, however, may have realized that sometimes you really do forget to separate Christmas stuff when it isn't Christmas. Sometimes things get overlooked.

I would also point out I am guessing most of you are women and may look at things with your heart whereas men typically look at things more logically. Maybe that is part of the disconnect.

QueenBeau's picture

Your divorce is messy because it is affecting your future (aka current gf).

If it wasn't messy, you would be moved on & everything would be ok.

Just FYI. Carry on.

locke's picture

Uh...I have moved on...a long time ago. She forgot some Christmas ornaments so that means I haven't moved on? And actually my divorce went pretty smoothly all things considered.

QueenBeau's picture

"She forgot some Christmas ornaments so that means I haven't moved on?"
A note from my pregnancy hormones: "Please show me where I mentioned these damned ornaments you are so hung up on. Don't worry, I'll wait.....

FUCK the ornaments."

Back to myself:
I'm not talking about the christmas ornaments.
You just keep coming back to them. I not once mentioned them. Please, read my comment & respond to ME personally not everyone who ever replied to this post.

You are texting with your ex & talking to her daily. Her parents are chummy with you. & she, until recently, was just waltzing into your house.

Which is fine while you're single. But as you try to move on, it is causing problems in your current relationship

Thus, your divorce has become messy - because you are divorced yet your situation with your ex is causing problems in your current relationship.

Unless you think your current gf is the problem instead?

locke's picture

I mentioned the Christmas ornaments because you responded to a post where I was using them as an example.

You make it seem like my ex and I text about the weather or our favorite movies. The vast majority of texts are kid pickup times and locations and are limited to like once a day. There is an occasional text about something money related and relative to the boys.

Her parents are chummy with me? So what? OP doesn't have a problem with that. She had a problem with them staying at my house which I told them NO.

The ex wasn't "waltzing into my house". I had asked her to drop my 4 year old off on the sofa and to leave so I didn't have to wait around all morning for them to show up without getting ready. You make it seem like she has a key to my house and just rolls in whenever she wants. This is not the case and furthermore, I have recently halted that and now I wait around by the front door until they show up and before I can get ready.

QueenBeau's picture

OP feels these relationships are inappropriate. A CO with more specific pick up/drop off times & days could eliminate the need for scheduling texts. Switching to email communication for money related issues could help too, because people don't check email as often as texts. Usually if I get a text I stop what I'm doing and read it. maybe that's why OP feels this is disruptive?

Do you think maybe OP is thinking about a future an marriage iwth u & that's why the tax thing bothers her? I file taxes with my DH. I am private about the amount of money I make (even though it is a good amount). Maybe she wouldn't want Bm having access to that information? I sure wouldn't.

You can stay on here justifying for months, but if she's not ok with it you risk loosing a gf.

I don't know if that's a bad thing, I don't know how serious your relationship is or how important it is for you to sustain it.

Please, get off of here arguing with people you don't care about & fix things with your gf.

AllySkoo's picture

"I would also point out I am guessing most of you are women and may look at things with your heart whereas men typically look at things more logically. Maybe that is part of the disconnect."

Oh my. Are you SURE you're not trying to start a fight? Wink

locke's picture

I don't think there is any further point in me posting anything here. There were some things people posted that was worth reading and I thank them for that. As for some others...I'll just say their posts were less helpful. I am working things out with OP to the best of my abilities. I wish you all the best.

christinen's picture

A few days a week ex comes into house to drop off kids - NO. BM is NOT allowed in my house. She can drop SD off out front.

The exes parent are going to stay with him several times a year for a weeks span each time - WTF? NO! When you divorce, you also divorce the ex's family.

The ex occasionally asks to borrow things - NO. Again, an ex is an ex.

The ex does his taxes. They have some deal worked out where they split all money from taxes - Hell to the No. The ex no longer gets to be involved in your bf's finances. They can split the tax money without her actually doing his taxes (my DH and BM used to do that too before we were married). It is no longer her business.

She still has some items in his house that she has to get. And they have been divorced two years - Eh. Tell your bf to box up the stuff and give it to her. No need to keep dragging it out.

Phone calls daily 90 percent about kids other ten may be other stuff. My internet is not working etc - Phone calls should be about kids only. No personal stuff.

If she needs small amounts of money she texts him. - NOOOOOOO

Bojangles's picture

Locke overall it seems like the key issue you're having with your gf, and the reason why you have got some flak here, is that your approach comes across as defend first, reassure last. I think if you'd come on saying yeah I can understand why x and y are difficult for my gf and her feelings are important so I can change those but this is what happens with z and I can't see how I can change it, you'd have got a different reaction. You're all logic and reason and not expressing understanding of how your girlfriend feels. Unfortunately relationships are not about logic and reason, they're about how we feel and communicate. Your gf clearly feels that you have a tendency to be dismissive of her concerns or feelings, and then you compromise, but in a reluctant begrudging way which leaves you in a lose lose situation - you changed stuff but it still hasn't made her feel valued and reassured.

It takes a huge amount of practical and emotional commitment to be a stepparent, and absorb your partners children and his commitment to those children into your life, especially when you have no children of your own so that the additional effort and compromise is very much one way. In return the parent really needs to go above and beyond in demonstrating appreciation, sympathy and support for their new partner. That means sometimes even if you can't understand your partners point of view, you have to prioritise caring about how they feel and acting accordingly over having the last word, or arguing the case for the defense. Because every time your gf makes an effort with your children, and compromises on her time with you, instead of the carefree child free activities she could be doing if she were with a man with no children, she's prioritising your feelings and theirs over her own.

Yes it's easy to explain why the Christmas decoration incident is perfectly logical, but your girlfriend raised a number of big and small issues, and it is the accumulation of those issues which is probably causing problems between you. The sum is greater than the parts so to speak. Your financial arrangements with your ex are a messy compromise, not a clear cut legal agreement. That's going to make any new partner feel nervous, particularly when there is the sense that the wish to avoid paying CS is inevitably going to lead to a 'don't upset the apple cart' approach with your ex. You've already made some practical changes in terms of your ex's access to the house and your relationship with the in laws, maybe there needs to be a change to the way you listen and respond to your GFs concerns, and a review of the informal financial situation with your ex.

Cocoa's picture

when proper boundaries are in place, BM will definitely become angry because after all, she is the kids' mother, right? when you remove all the goodies she receives from your BF for being that person, she will become upset. BM should be treated no better or allowed any other privileges than some woman from the office. the woman from the office would never be allowed to enter your home on her own, would never ask about ornaments once shared, would never call about anything other than business, and the business in this case is the kids. BM will be angry at first for having all her "rights" revoked (which is called becoming emotionally disconnected). you are going to have to begin going by what the court order says. this needs to be your BF's bible. no more benefits from income taxes. i'm surprised you've managed to stay in this relationship this long without appropriate boundaries. this is just some woman reaching into your BF's life whenever she wants. I would insist BF has a talk with her, laying down the new rules and he needs to go to no to low contact with the ex so that she doesn't see him as a form of support in ANY way, other than child support. and, if you decide to leave this relationship, NEVER date a man with kids who does not follow the court order.

ajp1999's picture

wow.. thank you all for your thoughtful comments. I've heard many good points being made. I really appreciate all of you taking the time to comment. Smile I'm new to dealing with some of this so it's nice to hear others views.