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Too much contact with BM?

Lavender4414's picture

I frequently post about my BF’s enmeshment with his in laws and all those struggles. Those relationships seemed so over the top and inappropriate that now that they’ve faded a bit, I realized they kind of overshadowed another issue; the amount time my BF is in contact with his ex. 

I’m very aware the need for contact raising two young children. But how much is excessive?  I’m suddenly aware that the phone calls range from 3-5 times a day and can be 5-15 mins long. There are multiple texts in between as well. She often calls with the kids when she has them and they all talk and laugh together as a family. (It’s cute, but also weird for me when we are laying in bed together)  He doesn’t do that when they are with us, so it just seems odd. Things are going so well between us, but I think it’s too much. They are in constant contact throughout the day. It is mostly about the kids.. I believe.  Sometimes family stuff. As I mentioned in other posts her family is pretty overbearing. He also frequently leaves the room and speaks lower than usual.  Because its mostly about the kids, I feel like a jerk making a thing out of this.. but.. I also feel a little foolish not to.  I don’t think there is anything going on. And I know it’s a great thing that they get along. 

Any thoughts ? Is accepting this behavior part of the territory ? Or is it over the top ?

Notup4it's picture

I don’t really understand the need to talk daily. Is it him doing the contacting or her?

Can you ask him to tone it down? There is some sort of enmeshment going on. Does she like you? Nice to you?

Lavender4414's picture

Her and I have zero relationship, which is her preference at this point.  We’ve only briefly met face to face one time. 

ldvilen's picture

You are not a jerk.  You just don't like being in polygamous relationships, that's all.  You don't like being wife or GF #2.  None of us women in the US were raised to be or act like a literal second wife.  So, why should anyone have that expectation of you.  Why should anyone have this expectation of any woman?  It has nothing to do with the kids, although that excuse will be whipped out more often than not.  My guess, in this situation, is that it has to do with mom and dad wanting to experiment and see if there is anything better out there.  They touch base every so often to go over how each other’s "plan" is going, and yes, to touch base on the kids too.  They may eventually get back together or they may not. 

In the meantime, no one here, including your BF, gives a cup-of-rice about you.  He is interested in himself, BM and his kids.  You are more or less a free babysitter or willing soft-eyed puppy to experiment on.  Harsh, I know, but I get very sick of mom and dad getting passes on just about every amoral behavior imaginable all because of being divorced.  Check out that new series: Splitting Up Together.  Mom and dad can be separated, live in the same home, date and spawn with others, and everyone in the U.S. really loves it!  They want to see if mom and dad ever get back together.  No one is concerned about or the feelings of GF #1 or GF #2 or BF #1 or BF #5.  It’s all about mom and dad and the kids.  And, if you ever do marry this guy and become a SM, sad to say, it won’t be much better. Sad Scratch one-s head

momjeans's picture

My guess, in this situation, is that it has to do with mom and dad wanting to experiment and see if there is anything better out there.  They touch base every so often to go over how each other’s "plan" is going, and yes, to touch base on the kids too.  They may eventually get back together or they may not. 

 

this! 

Lavender4414's picture

I don’t foresee this happening. But who knows.  I would honestly feel sorry for him if that occurred. She devastated him.  I wouldn’t be able to forgive what she did. 

hereiam's picture

Three to five times a day, every day? I don't think my parents talked to each other about me that much when I was young. And they were married to each other!

I mean, what could need that much discussion?

notsurehowtodeal's picture

and lowers his voice so you can't hear the conversation is a huge red flag. If they are just talking about the kids, why does he keep it from you?

How can you manage to stay in bed with him when he is talking to his ex and his kids? I'd get out of bed and stay out of bed until that behavior stops. You are right, that is just plain weird, in addition to being disrespectful of you!

Lavender4414's picture

It is weird. I feel like if I mentioned it he would say his kids are calling him .. and what would is he suppose to do etc..

 

notsurehowtodeal's picture

is not answer the phone. If he insists on answering, he should tell the ex/kids that he will call them back. He should not talk to them while he is in bed with you!

strugglingSM's picture

Your BF and his ex are still psychologically together. They are still engaged in a relationship that goes beyond the children. It must also be confusing for the children to wonder why mom and dad get along so well, but are not together. I can pretty much guarantee they are thinking that mom and dad are getting back together. 

When I first met DH, he was speaking to BM daily on the phone. She was rarely sharing information about the kids - she was mostly using him as an emotional outlet - to either complain, tell him he was a horrible person, or try to use him for sympathy and support. She was already remarried at the time, so no need to keep talking to an ex whom she purported to hate. 

I pointed out to DH that his relationship with his ex was likely very similar to what it was when he was married to her, they were just not living in the same house - in fact, they may have even been talking more than they did, when actually married, since they would avoid one another when they lived in the same house. 

I also told him that I was not interested in dating a man who was still in an emotional relationship with his ex and that counselors would say that if two people need to speak daily after a break up, one or both of them has not moved on. He told me that he talked to her because he hoped that it would help his kids out if he let her get some of her aggression out on him. However, he also stopped taking her calls, because he decided he wanted to have a serious relationship with me. 

If this behavior makes you feel uncomfortable, then your BF should pay attention to your needs, as well as his own. If he doesn't, then you should consider how long you can put up with this. 

Kona_California's picture

Wow girl, my SO communicates with BM a fraction of that and I have worse reactions. It's completely valid to feel uncomfortable. Another woman is taking up your time with your SO and they have a close relationship. Each time she calls and he answers, it's as though she's in the room with you two. It's understandable to not want that. You should have a talk with your SO and let him know how all this is making you feel. Come up with clear boundaries and he needs to communicate them to her. This is what my SO and I have in place, and it took a little bit but this is how he is now:

  • No outreach to BM unless she needs to know something about the kids. No communication about aaaaanything at all outside of absolute, needed information about your kids. Period.
  • All communication stays on email or text. No phone calls unless a major emergency
  • There should be no going into another room and speaking on the phone so you can't hear
  • Absolutely no communicating at all when you're in an intimate setting. I don't just mean physiclaly intimate, but emotionally intimate, such as in bed together or when you two have dates nights, etc
  • Time frames on when it's acceptable to communicate, to avoid late-night messages. We say from 7am - 10pm. Again, messages or calls breaking these boundaries are ONLY for emergencies

Your SO will need to lay all of this out for BM somehow as well, so she's clear and not confused by this change in their relationship. 

I'm curious to see how he's having you be incorporated into BM's family's lives so I'm going to read your other posts. One thing I caught, he should know that saying "in-laws" no longer means the BM's parents. In-laws refers to family of your SPOUSE. They are no longer married, so I would have a problem with his Freudian slips myself and correct him. They are his "ex's family." That's it. Not his in-laws. YOU are his future, he should be focusing on meeting YOUR family and thinking about how they might be his actual in-laws someday. 

Grrr I'm mad FOR you lol please update how things are going!

Lavender4414's picture

Thank you so much for your reply.  I agree about all those boundaries. I need help. I don’t know what’s right and what’s wrong in this situation.  The problem with the interruptions during intimate times is with the kids. She usually gets on the phone after a convo with the kids.. so  How do I put my foot down about when it’s appropriate to communicate with his children ?  It doesn’t feel right!! 

And thank you. The “in law” thing has been making me insane the last few months. Especially when we talk about getting married. 

Im going to just blurt “” uhhh they’re aren’t  your f***king in laws!!”  out of fury sooner than later.  It’s completely insane.  

Despite all this. He’s actually really awesome and constantly tells me I’m number one and the best most important thing in his life.  In every other single way he does right by me. It’s heartbreaking that your best friend and love could be so clueless to your needs though. 

Kona_California's picture

UGH god how annoying lol Yes she might need help but he is not the person she goes to for help anymore! She needs to turn to her family, friends, child therapist, neighbor, mailman, ANYONE else except the ex for advice on parenting if she's so clueless.

I'm not sure if you two have honest conversations about how you feel, but this is huge and really needed - often - to make sure everyone feels comfortable in a long-lasting relationship. In order to impliment these boundaries, just walk up and say "boo. I need to talk to you. I love you so much and think you're [insert the things you love about him] but there are just a few things I need to talk with you about that have been on my mind." when you have his attention, make sure to use lots of "i" statements. "When you talk to BM about things that I don't think are necessary, it makes me feel uncomfortable, secondary, and sad. I'd like to talk about some boundaries I think would really help me feel comfortable and important to you. What do you think about [insert list of boundaries]?"

He will probably push back and be a little defensive at first, so make sure to reassure him again that you think he's a wonderful man and you want to build your future together with him. Let him know the way he's doing things is making you feel like your future is on pause. Not only that, but by working together on fixing an issue, he will show actions that indicate he can be in this relationship for the long-term using healthy problem-solving. You will also feel closer because of it. 

I would also bring up the "in-law" thing ASAP so it doesn't come bursting out lol just use an "i" statement. "Boo. When you use the term in-law, it makes me feel like things aren't over with you and her and it hurts my feelings.  I wish you would refer to them as her family, since if we get married, my family would be referred to as the "in-laws."  As petty as it might sound to you, it would mean a lot to me." Boom. Totally reasonable and he can't say no to that! Good luck Smile

 

qtpie013178's picture

No interruptions should be allowed during intimacy. Have him put the phone on silent during those times. If it’s that much of an emergency, they need 9-1-1, not to speak with him.

elkclan's picture

your situation is really complicated. The BM in your life is just now reconnecting with being a mother. She probably feels really insecure. There are probably a lot of messes she needs to sort out now for abandoning her kids. She wants help to do this. 

Your BF KNOWS his kids are feeling anxiety about re-connecting with mom. He wants to be there for them. He probably also misses them since they've gone from full time kids to part time kids. He doesn't want them to feel like he's not available like their mom wasn't available. 

However - he needs to back the eff off - let BM do her own emotional heavy lifting. Which is probably something she's not had to do much - she's probably been enabled by her over-involved parents and by your BF.  I'd also guess that she IS trying to re-establish an emotional connection with your BF - through their shared kids. He may not forgive her behaviour, but she is used to wheedling and getting what she wants. He is uninentionally encouraging her and encouraging his kids to think that this is possible. Boundaries needed! 

If he hasn't done intensive therapy - he needs to. He obviously has trouble drawing boundaries. It's hard, I do too! Therapy in this situation isn't fixing a broken person but coaching them to develop skills which aren't necessarily easy or natural. 

I don't know how you take the first step on this - but you have a right to ask for changes. You sound like a really nice and understanding person, but you have the right to meet your own needs and to ask for your needs to be met. Your bf also sounds like a really nice person who overdoes and doesn't want to offend. I'm sure he doesn't want to offend you either. 

TrueNorth77's picture

I dealt with this as well, although mostly it was BM texting/calling/emailing/pigeoning (any way she could contact him, she would do), and then them fighting. Sometimes it was chatting. Either way, it drove me insane, and disrupted OUR time way too much. We had many fights about it. You are definitely not alone, and my SO needed some "help" realizing that this was not ok and it was hurting our relationship. Women are not dumb, and your BM knows damn well that all of this communication is keeping your SO from being present with you. She is probably over there just eating it up, loving that he is always available to her. Your SO needs to know how it makes you feel, and that it is hurting your relationship.

There is NO need whatsoever for them to communicate this much. My SO and BM have 2 kids- SD9 (who has a pretty serious medical condition that sometimes warrants extra communication), and SS12, and even then they now only communicate via an app once or twice a month. That's IT. But to get there, I had to put my foot down. I was always angry and frustrated about the constant interruptions in our life from BM. My SO fought it for a while, but eventually realized I was right. The lack of communication has been AMAZING. We have our life back.

Sandybeaches's picture

I wonder how old are the kids?  and how long have your BF and the ex been apart?

I do have to say that most men are totally oblivious to all of this crap until someone points it out to them.

It may not mean that they are still attached in any type of relationship at all.  It could be that the ex sees that she is still in a relationship and that could be why she acts like you don't exist. Your BF may very well have moved on in the relationship with you but doesn't know what the boundries are supposed to be and if she says she is calling about the kids he may believe that and not see it as a problem.  

I think it is definatley a situation that needs a conversation so that everyone is on the same page.  You need to know and sooner rather than later, if he is in the relatiosnhip with you or he is still with the ex.  It may hurt but it will hurt more later if you don't find out.  If he is with you then you need to talk about boundries because this crap with the ex rarely ends without someone slapping a period on it !!! 

Lavender4414's picture

I know this is a delayed response, I haven’t been on here in a bit.  Kids are almost 6 and 8 years old. 

SO and BM have been apart for 4 years..  She had an affair and left him with the kids who were babies.  

Merry's picture

It's not good that you don't feel like you can tell your BF how you feel. He should WANT to make you happy. You're not rejecting his kids. "SO, when you answer your phone when we are being intimate, I feel like I am not important. I'd really like it if you would let it go to vm and call back later if you need to." See? That's not about his kids at all. It's about YOUR needs.

Don't get caught in the trap of avoiding confrontation--you'll turn into a doormat full of resentment. YOU HAVE LEGITIMATE WANTS AND NEEDS TOO. Don't allow yourself to be in second place.

Lavender4414's picture

I’ve been working on talking things out more. He’s defensive but understanding for the most part.  It has got a little better but BM keeps pushing the envelope. I’m going to make another post about the latest! 

Anon9876's picture

I had a mild problem with this early in my relationship.

His ex would call and he would pick up and it would always be to argue over something or another. Sometimes she would pick a fight because he as with me. Other times she would say she was 'gonna move in with us'.

It was wild. She could not let go of the fact that he had truly moved not from her and I think she really missed having her own personal punching bag. She loved telling him daily that he was a POS, etc.

So, I finally told him there was no reason for all of the arguing and she needed to stop calling and texting him all the time.

His daughter then tried to worsen the situation at times saying 'mom wants u to call her' or 'come outside and talk to my mom' or 'I want u and mama to do this....' etc. She liked to make me uncomfortable and knew  me and her mom didn't get along. Deep down she believed because they were in contact that they might get back together.

Anyway, I had a big talk with SO about him not contacting his ex. He began ignoring her calls and texts and would only respond if it was strictly about the kids. My SD didn't ikebana that he wouldn't etc up with her mom or do things with just them, but oh well.

There is no reason to talk to your ex everyday. Only people who are still emotionally involved with that person do that.

His ex seems to be keeping a stake in him. It sounds like she's not over him and she's using the kids to maintain and closer than acceptable relationship with him.

If his kids want to call then they need to do so with their mom out of the room.

She needs to learn boundaries and stop contacting him so often. A text a day is ufficient enough to tell him how his kids are doing.

But really if they're ld enough to call she should not contact him unless she is making plans about the kids or further discussing the kids.

I'd watch out for her. She doesn't even want a relationship with you. That's shady.

Your SO should take steps back from her if he wants a relationship with you to wprk. There is not room for 2 women in his life.