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Possible relocation, are we "allowed"?

gettingthere's picture

I'll try to keep this short while still making sense.
SO and I live in the state SK was born in, BM moved to another state after separation. SO has primary custody as BM voluntarily agreed to it, and joint legal custody. SK is not in school yet.
I am from out west and we currently live east coast but SO has always wanted to live out west. He has thought about starting to look for a better paying job out west.
We are cautiously thinking about maybe moving in the new year so we have time to set everything up far in advance.
After end of Jan BM does not have time with SK until the summer (due to her keeping him from SO and to get the holidays back on track she agreed to this and it's in the revised custody agreement). We are thinking to move during that time as it will not effect her ability to see SK and we want to allow time for SK to adjust to new place before next visit.
Since we don't live in the same state already can she stop us from moving? We have no intention of changing the visitation schedule or amount of time etc, we understand it is a greater distance but we would be willing to help cover the extra cost of travel.
Minor things to add are, she is currently not working, has announced she is trying to have another baby, no family in our state to stay in contact with for SK, there is no relocation clause in the custody agreement and we have been very open to Skype calls and trying to have her more involved but she calls on average once every 6 weeks.
What can we do to set ourselves up so *if* there is a fight we can be confident we have made the right plan for SKs future and can show it's in the best interest to keep custody the same after the move?

***ALSO.. we will be legally married before the move if that changes anything and I'm wondering if me being pregnant changes anything?

DPW's picture

I think you might have a hard time finding a judge that would allow this. I could be wrong. Do you have a plan for transportation for visits?

Alternatively, you could entice BM somehow (e.g., you do and pay for all transport) where she agrees to it on her own.

gettingthere's picture

that is what was worried about, do we need to consult the courts prior to moving then? This is a new idea so we are still in info gathering stage and have no idea.

notsobad's picture

I don't understand why a judge wouldn't allow this. There is no family where you live now, BM moved away from you and skid, you are not changing the visitation and you are willing to pay the extra cost to get skid to BM.
Plus, your SO is hopefully going to have a better job, so your quality of life will be better, how is that bad for anyone?
Does the CO say anything about relocating?

I guess you need to talk to a lawyer but unless BM decides to be a bitch and put up a fight I don't see a problem.

gettingthere's picture

No we have checked and it does not say anything about us moving away. IT DOES SAY if she were to move closer she is able to apply for changes to increase time but she had made it clear she is staying here she is unless her new bf moves, and we can't plan for a "what if" if you know what I mean.
We emailed the lawyer that was appointed to skid during court and she said technically any move over 50 miles would be open to being fought.
I guess I didn't see the issue either but I needed to see if someone would say "this is a bad idea and here's why..." It will come down to money for BM, it has in the past with any changes, the first thing she brings up is money. She will fight I think which is why we want to start getting ready now and planning.
If he can get a better job we looked at housing prices and I have enough saved that we could actually buy which would be a step up and show stability for skid, also I doubt it matters but my family is out there and they adore skid and are very involved in our lives, traveling out here for visits and Skype calls etc

notsobad's picture

So she said it's open to be fought.

Do you think BM will fight it? Would she have the money to fight it?
Because she's all about the money, just tell her that SO will be making more money and her CS might go up, does she get CS?

I definitely wouldn't say anything to BM, and don't talk about it in front of the little one.

gettingthere's picture

I dn't think BM on her own would fight it but her friends and family will encourage her to. She has not shared all the stuff we could present in court so they see SO as the evil ex who bullied her etc. She is a constant victim so everyone will rally and convince her to fight, then she will so she doesn't look bad for "giving up" on her kid. She has stated she is worried what people would think of her for not having custody of her kid. She would not have money to fight us on her own but the big X factor is her bf who *may* have some savings or good credit to get a loan to fight, which he would do.
There is no CS currently and she does not have him enough to file for us to pay, it would end up being her paying us.
We are not going to bring this up with her until we have decided and have signed contract with a better job (just in case she tries to fight we would have proof) and we never speak about her negatively in front of skid, I am not impressed by her choices but I am firm on not speaking about any custody issues in front of skid. Right now she is responsible for travel whichwould be the reason she fights, saying that the cost is more than doubling so she couldn't afford to see him, therefor we are not letting her see him so we thought if we offered to split or cover the difference it may help... we hope?

Rags's picture

I would call your atty for advice just to understand any legal risks. However, I would make the move regardless. In my experience there would be no need to even take it to court as BM has moved out of the jurisdiction and the visitation is already of a long distance format. I would suspect that there would be no issue. My wife had sole physical and legal custody, DipShitIot had 7wks a year of visitation (5wks summer, 1wk winter, 1wk spring). We never lived nearer than 1200miles to Sperm Land and we moved where ever and when ever we wanted and never asked anyone for permission. Sperm Land courts had jurisdiction and issued our Custody/Visitation/Support CO. We did send the Sperm Clan our new contact information and address anytime we moved but only once we arrived at our new home. Interestingly, DickHead moved once moved out of state (Sperm Land) and did not inform us. Visitation continued but the Skid spent that time with SpermGrandHag rather than the Sperm Idiot which always was the anyway even when the Sperm Idiot lived in Sperm Land. We found out a couple of years later after he had moved back to SpermLand. Had we known DickHead had moved we would have stopped visitation completely since the SpermGrandParents did not have visitation and the Sperm Idiot was not taking his visitation at his new location anyway. I would have enjoyed handing them their idiot asses on that one had we known. Damned, we missed that Sperm Clan ass baring opportunity. }:)

If BM were local to your location then things would be a bit more complicated regarding an out of state move for you and DH.

It is my understanding that if both parties move out of the jurisdiction that the state where the kid is a full time resident can assume jurisdiction if the CP petitions. So, I suggest when you move you pick a state and county that gives DH the most leverage as the CP over BM as the NCP. I suggest Williamson County Texas. When we moved there when SS was 2yo it scared the shit out of the Sperm Clan. Their CS would have tripled had we actually changed jurisdiction. Which is why the Sperm Idiot and Sperm GrandHag never told us when DipShitIot moved away from Sperm Land. We would never have changed jurisdiction from Sperm Land. Though CS would have tripled visitation would have increased significantly also and we would not have exposed SS to the shallow and polluted end of his gene pool any more than absolutely necessary no matter how much money it would have gained.

So my advice is to go for it. Enjoy our move West.

notsobad's picture

I think I'd go with the beg forgiveness, not ask permission model as well.

I really doubt that she would bother to take SO to court over the move, even if she had the money. And I'm not sure a judge would say you have to move back! You wouldn't have the money to move again and it would only be seen as a punishment.

Sadly, this is the MO of a lot of BMs. They do whatever they want and then claim it's the status quo.

gettingthere's picture

Yes, not to sound like a bitch but I feel like if she were in this position she wouldn't wait or even give us notice. She would feel because she is the mother that she can up and go.
My plan is to have the following set up;
-Research school districts
-Have skid on wait list for good preschool
-Have a few properties we could afford and speak seriously with a realtor to show we want to buy and have stability
-Have SO with a good job opportunities or better yet have him sign a contract with new job
-Continue to build our savings to show we have the means to provide and budget long term for skid
-Set up an education fund for skid
Any other tips on things we could do to look good just in case?

gettingthere's picture

I think we are leaning towards moving the more we chat over the last few days so you're right, a call into our lawyer is the next step to cover our bases. BM being out of state and no family here, SO having primary all add up ( to us anyway) to think there would be no issue. I thought I would put it out there in case anyone had a similar experience, also I am trying to avoid tunnel vision of just wanting to get out of here, I was thinking if anyone brought up something we hadnt thought of it might change my mind but I feel like we should be able to move about since she is bare minimum invloved.
Also I mourn your lost chance to change the visitation, ugh, we already know she is leaving us in the dark about a lot of things so I would not be surprised to run into a similar situation down the road. We are also dealing with a toxic family on BM side, expecting skid to hear all about how SO "stole" skid (even though she left) and loads of horrible false info put into his tiny head..... not excited but we think if she has another kid everyone will drop skid and "start fresh" with new kid... my stance is get involved or step away and save skid years of promises and disappointment.

simifan's picture

Long story short, moving opens you up for lawsuits; your DH would have the advantage in court but it is still court and anything could happen.

You say mom is in a different state, but don't state how far. If you already have a "long distance plan" - over 100 miles away, yes she can contest the move, but more then likely it would not win. It would be entertained by the court. She can also petition for custody as a move would qualify as a life change in the child's life.

gettingthere's picture

YES, thank you for the reminder, it was the "life change" I keep seeing when I google that had me worried but I forgot. Does it matter if she agreed that my SO was better for skid only a few months ago and that her suicidal issues were as recent as a few weeks ago? I keep thinking she would not be seen as stable but I am scared of going to court and spending loads of money only to move back to be closer to him if she got him.
Currently the distance is 600+ miles

gettingthere's picture

Yes I definitely see your point.
Right now she drives 12 hours (each way) to get him. She informed us today she may not have the money to get him for her next visit (last one until mid Jan) so I don't see her being able to afford flights. If she misses his next visit and continues not to call does that help us or hurt us?
We were going to start trying to have a baby but do not want to complicate things further but would it help us to continue with our original plan and try (please note we are NOT thinking about having a baby simply to help in court, we had stopped birth control before but now are taking other precautions until we get this decision made, as to not overwhelm skid or BM)
The custody agreement states she must pay for travel which I see as her major fighting point. Does it seem fair to offer to split the travel? Or maybe collect child support and we pay for flights (using that money plus our own)? Do we ask her to pay what she pays now for travel and we cover the rest? Any thoughts would be great, I'd like to approach her with a few solid options for her to think about so she does not jump right to court.

gettingthere's picture

This seems like a great way to handle it and hopefully avoid court. How much notice do you think is fair? W were thinking a month?

notsobad's picture

Yes, but how much is his life changing? He's not in school, there is no family that he's being moved away from. BM wants to have another baby but isn't pregnant yet, so no siblings to move away from.

I would say this is the perfect time to move. Once you are settled and he's in school, has your family around him, then it will be life changing to move him.

simifan's picture

You say BM agreed to SO being primary a few months ago... If he has recently gained custody, it would give her a better chance in court. 6 months is status quo. Your DH certainly has the advantage (provided he has been primary for at least 6 months), but yes it is a life change & opens up the custody issue if BM chooses to do so. She could easily argue she gave DH primary to keep him stable in a known environment & moving changes things.

gettingthere's picture

Sorry, to clarify, we went in to revise the custody order and the revised version (where she agreed he was still better suited) was a few months ago. He has had primary custody for about a year already. We have moved house and I am his caregiver during the days so I feel like removing him from our family unit would be hard on him, more so than leaving the state with our family unit if that makes sense. She informed us he had a difficult time last visit and constantly asked for us as well. I hold hope she may see he is good here even if we as a family move? Or am I being overly hopefull?

gettingthere's picture

Moving without telling her first is not the road we want to take. The most we would do is except an offer and give her a months notice, I don't believe she can file anything to keep us here or to take him (in terms of any emergency filing). We have put a lot of effort into civil coparenting and although we are not happy with her side of things we want to stick to not giving her anything to use in her victim mode or use in court to show we are difficult. Putting a call into our lawyer tomorrow as well.