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Mini wife? Partner refuses to deal with 17year SD he acts like love sick puppy

Lc891's picture

I previously posted some of the issues we have been facing. Little long winded sorry will keep to some basics 

My SD is highly manipulative, tells stories has no empathy. My partner knows all of this her teachers previously pointed this out. He himself said he had noticed from a younger age she can be very calculating. 
she shares videos on Tick tock that are unkind like... "my face laughing when dads gf falls down the stairs" 

She was fine with me until her dad began saying no, she put this down to me and she has been relentless. Also her mother became funny and partner said she was jealous as originally SD and I got on and liked me a lot. I've daughter a year younger and I'm 10 years younger than her mum so I think her mum didn't like she was really enjoying it here. Her mum became rude when I would collect her, slamming doors etc.
I booked us concert tickets for my partner my daughter and SD. We had all been really excited. SD insisted we wore T-shirts she got her dad to buy, but was really smug. Turns out Her mum booked tickets for the same concert same day turned up with the t shirt on too.

She will sit on FaceTime and make remarks about me to her mother while I'm around. 

 

She is in his ear saying she doesn't want him to marry me because she doesn't want me to be her step mum. He told me she tries to paint me as thus awful person which he says he knows I'm not and he knows this is lead by jealousy.

They lack some serious boundries, I read on here about mini wife, which defo has traits of SD  but he is not better. 
we spoke and he agreed sometimes he probably does treat her a little like a gf at times, he romanticises her and actually acts like a love sick puppy! He agrees he does this. At 15 and half years old she would drop trousers and knickers in front of him and get changed. He had to speak twice to her about it.

she comes over, doesn't say hello or goodbye. Ignores me. I say hello, I've knocked her door to ask she would like anything- ignored. She was awful on holiday we now all have divided. She and my SD don't communicate and we had to cancel the next holiday and can no longer do anything as a 4-So I have disengaged

 

 

At Christmas he and I were meant to be away as we cancelled our original trip with all of us going away due to her behaviour- she was spending Christmas with her mum (she lives couple of hours away) our flight had an issue, and instead of trying to sort it, he left me drove to where she lives and left me alone across Christmas and spent it in a hotel with SD by her mums. He returned and SD had written a card to her dad pretending to be her mum and stepdad, addressing to her dad wishing him the best Christmas. She binned some of the gifts I got her and kept some. 

When he and I are away she calls and FaceTimes so much more, apparently she told him it's because she knows there is an issue and she is letting me know she the important one. 
 

He struggles to set boundaries and follow through, she will say things like "I just want to be your little princess like when I was younger"

when I point out all the things, he will try defend or even then suggest I'm being over sensitive.  Then we can have a good conversation and he will say he knows it's wrong and he struggles to do it differently. But it all goes out the window. Our relationship is on its last legs. 

this trip we rescheduled and were due to leave last week, however due to an injury he couldn't fly he was hardly able to walk, we agreee we could do something as we need some time and we have booked it off and he is able to move better etc, It was his birthday the other day we booked cinema tonight and to go away for two nights in couple of days if his back continues to heal. Well getting ready to go to cinema, she sent a text saying she had booked a ticket and coming on train now. So now tonight's plans cancelled on the spot. he has to travel on a train to London. 1 hour 20 mins from us pick her up and then take her back tomorrow. 

 

I am hurt and angry at him, I said why would you drop everything when you are in so much pain, we have plans too that were based around what you are comfortable with 

he said he was doing what's best, I asked for who? He said well it's not for me (as in him) cause I'm in agony travelling.  So I asked again best for who? He said for SD as it's what she wanted and she is my daughter 

 

i guess im wondering anyone been in similar situation? Has it all worked out? There is so much more to it and while her behaviour is outrageous, I am angry with him, he is the parent and the adult. He can't say no to her, gives her everything she wants! 

Do men like this ever change, do SD chill out? She is 17!

or is it time for me to walk....
 

Hope this makes sense 

Rags's picture

That was an instant divorce move IMHO.  Fortunately, you did not marry this POS non man, failed adult, failed partner, and failed father.

Respect yourself and commit to living YOUR best life. That is what we each owe ourselves.  That cannot happen while you wallow around in your SO's shallow and polluted gene pool as he caters to his X and coddles their noxious failed family spawn.

Not only did he abandon you at Christmas, he has repeatedly done it since. As behaviors are the best predictor of performance, I would bet every Cent I have that he did it before Christmas as well.  Any number of times.

He, his X, and their noxious spawn treat you like shit that they just scrape off of their collective shoe anytime they feel like it. Know this. It is that entire shallow and polluted gene pool that is shit.  Time for zero tolerance, call the locksmith to re-key the locks when he leaves to return his spawn to mommy.  He can know when he returns that  you are done.  This only works out if you continue to sacrifice yourself on the altar of SParental martyrdom to this dumbass, his X and their rotten crotch product.

Stop that.  You owe yourself and your DD to live your best life.  Living well is also the best revenge and IMHO you should relish in living that revenge. Write him/them off completely, and get on with living your best life.

If you need more clarity.  This is a 15yo not a 5yo. A 15yo who is dropping her skivies to shake tail at daddy.  These are some serious incestuous desires vibes.  At the very least he has admitted to emotional incest.  Get yourself and your own DD out of this mess. NOW!

Bad

Take care of you.

Give rose

Rumplestiltskin's picture

Yeah, wtf about the showing him her full frontal vajayjay. No normal 15-year-old raised by a normal father would do that. Something is off here. I am almost worried for the SD. I wonder what has happened to her. 

Rags's picture

Bad

I had the the same thoughts regarding what has happened to her. The thought of this being entirely due to her own thoughts and at her own initiative is beyond repulsive.

CajunMom's picture

Abandoned you for Christmas? That would have been his "goodbye" from me. 
 

Seriously, get yourself a good counselor. You need an impartial  person  to clearly show you what you are mixed up in. It's not good and it will not end well for you if you continue with this man. He needs to live alone with the mini-wife he's created. 
 

Count yourself fortunate. At 17, her role has been defined and she won't budge from it. So, don't walk away. RUN!!! If you stay, be prepared for a life of troubles all at her hands. And your SO. 

Harry's picture

The ''''honeymoon ''''.   Hate to see this relationship in a few years.  SD is ''''controlding''' your SO and yours life.  She saids  jump you say how high.  You already are not happy, in this relationship.  Where do you think it's going from here.  These kids don't  go away at 18.  They keep this happy family not including you for there life time.

Time to move on, you see that

Thumper's picture

Run

What you SEEEEEE, is what you have. 

It is that simple. 

Make a plan, keep that plan to yourself and move on.

 

 

 

 

Merry's picture

This doesn't magically get any better and will in fact get worse. 

My DH chased his daughter like she was a girlfriend too. Not to the extent that yours does though. She would give him orders and he would comply--nearly every aspect of life from trying a new recipe to buying a birthday gift for his sister. She controlled all. I became invisible when they were in the room together. Everything SD did was always the best, the most amazing. It got old.

Took several meltdowns on my part, then a final "choose your full time wife" ultimatum because I wasn't going to sit on the sidelines any longer while he chased her attention and worshipped her.

The more he included me, and the more she didn't get her way, the angrier she got to the point of convincing herself that HE was the selfish one and she had been mistreated her whole life. She didn't talk to him for about three years, and communication is still rare. My life is peaceful. He can have a relationship with her--I encourage it. But if neither of them put any energy into it, oh well. Not my problem to solve.

Suggest you live your life. If he cancels plans with you to chase after her, you go ahead with the plans anyway with a friend or by yourself. SD doesn't control you. It will take the fear of losing you for him to make any changes, and even then he might not.

Im sorry you're in this club. It's not a fun one. 

tryingjusttrying's picture

I have had similar experiences with a very jealous, angry SS who tries to be DH's mini-wife. He has said of himself at 15 yo that he is a "dady's boy" which prompted his friends to laugh at him, so he never said that again. He has tried everything to exclude me, disrespect me, be in charge, and replace me as the other half of the partnership. I held a lot of resentment, but I kept it to myself because I thought I would be the evil stepmom if I objected. Dh believed that too because I think like many people in society, kids are always the innocent party no matter what toxicity they interject into the family system.

But I've been a lot more vocal in the last half year or so, which has made me less stressed and my dh more stressed. I'm off-loading the anger and stress to the people they belong to. I'm not going to be the one to suffer for everyone's dysfunctions anymore.

I've been reading a book about healthy "primary relationships" (marriage or any long term romantic relationships), and it has really put words to what I can expect and how I've been feeling. Just a few thoughts: The couple should NEVER allow "thirds" (children, exes, addictions, friends, etc. etc.) to get in the way of the primary relationship. According to the author, Stan Tatkin, the #1 job of the bio parent in a blended family is to protect the stepmom "from all corners, particularly from angry children, angry exes and others that would seek to split the new partnership and target the new kid in town. The stepparent is an easy target for all those who resent the changes in the family structure." Mismanaging thirds is "one of the most insidious causes leading to the demise of all adult primary attachment relationships."

Another quote: "Mismanagement of thirds is in the top tier of threatening behaviors that plagues romatic partnerships." It is no joke. If the husband can't manage the children well, there is hardly anything more destabilizing. The problem is that bioparents usually have so many blindspots, guilt, etc. that they cannot hold their kids accountable for their part. They allow kids to insert a win or lose dichotomy, and they usually win. I'm learning that by standing up for myself, there can be a win-win - but the stepmom has to be the queen bee. If she is treated anything less than "top dog" the reaction is never neutral, it is always experienced with humiliation to be robbed of one's rightful place.

I hope this helps. I'm feeling anxious about my own situation, so I might have come off too strong. But I want to encourage you to stand up for yourself. I held back for 6 years thinking that I should be more understanding, and I regret that. Once I started pushing back, dh was upset, but his eyes are starting to open. Good luck.

Rumplestiltskin's picture

Yep. I'm sick to death of the mismanagement of thirds, fourths, fifths, etc. If your man is consumed with pleasing his kids, his ex(es) his mother, his sister, and the random single lady at work or at the gym, it doesn't matter how sweet he is to you. How thoughtful. Because you are not special. He is sweet to everyone, even those who treat you like sh!t. And if he won't set boundaries on those in his life who undermine and treat the stepparent like sh!t, that's not sweet, is it? 

Trudie's picture

"He is sweet to everyone, even those who treat you like sh!t. And if he won't set boundaries on those in his life who undermine and treat the stepparent like sh!t, that's not sweet, is it?"

This hits hard...truth!!! I know that some people want to remain 'sweet' at all costs; I'm not sure that they even realize this is an act of self betrayal. And I don't believe they even realize they are betraying the stepparent. Dysfunction breeds dysfunction until someone does the work and starts the slow roll of change.

If you do me dirty...you are dead to me! The same goes for those I love; I am fiercely protective and I don't forget. That may sound brutal, but life is short and I am not wasting time on those who have proven they are not worthy of my time, consideration, and attention. I'm cordial and I move on....

Trudie's picture

"But I've been a lot more vocal in the last half year or so, which has made me less stressed and my dh more stressed. I'm off-loading the anger and stress to the people they belong to. I'm not going to be the one to suffer for everyone's dysfunctions anymore."

And this!!! ---> "I'm not going to be the one to suffer for everyone's dysfunctions anymore." <--- This is it!!! I don't even know you and I am so proud of you! This is healthy. This is growth. Yes, let your husband sit in his discomfort over the situation he helped to create and helped to enable. You didn't cause it. You can't fix it. However, you can react to it in a healthy way and be the impetus for change. That is what you are doing!

You are not too strong. You are doing the work and it shows. Some people may not be comfortable with the 'new you' and that is okay. Not your problem! Focus on asserting yourself with honesty, kindness, and grace; how it is received is up to the receiver. Keep pushing back!

Which book are you reading by Stan Tatkin? I would like to purchase it.

tryingjusttrying's picture

Thanks Trudie. : ) I've really developed a lot over the years, thanks to this discussion board, and reading a lot. I had a lot of blind spots, assumptions, and made lots of mistakes. But thankfully, I kept posting and learning. I actually feel that confronting and addressing the insecurities that were brought out by my relationship with SS has taught me a lot about myself and life. So I'm grateful to have had that opportunity.

I do recommend the book. It's called In Each Other's Care. Happy reading!

Trudie's picture

I like your outlook, you are choosing to learn from a situation that has been very difficult. Sometimes these difficult situations show us what we're made of and lead to tremendous growth like you mentioned.

The book came right away, thanks to Amazon. I just need to find time to dig in. Thank you for the recommendation!

Rags's picture

Someone you enjoy spending time with that is a friend on the spot when the SO goes chasing their failed family progency when canceling plans with you.

Don't ever cancel your own plans. Go, meet new people, invite the work spouse, a close friend, a casual acquantence, a neighbor, etc.  That way the seed is planted in the pea sized brain of the failed family spawn chasing SO that their absence is insiginificant to you enjoying your life.  

Of course it would be ideal for the SO to engage meaningfully. However, never let them destroy your bliss.  Have fun with or without them, and more importantly, in spite of their idiot choices.

At some point they will figure out that they are making themselves insignificant, or you will figure out that they are insignificant, and changes will be made.

Never sacrifice living your best life.  Everyone owes living well to themselves regardless of what circulates around that truth.

IMHO of course.

ESMOD's picture

Well.. that's why we date people for a really long time. .they may eventually show us the kind of person they are.

do you want this dysfunction in your life.. it's a yes or no question... I don't think there will be any real way to "fix" this.. so if your answer is "no".. then.. you know you have reached the end of this relationship.

If you can deal with the drama.. you can stay and disengage.. but you know what you are getting into at this point.

Evil4's picture

I have a mini-wife on steroids (35). I've been in the fame with DH for almost 30 years. Starting out and probably the first 20 or more years I had extremely low self esteem from being raised by a narcissistic sociopathic father who chose everyone else over me. Through intensive therapy I discovered I was repeating the pattern in my marriage to a man who was obsessed with his mini-wife. I had tried everything under the sun to get my DH to realize what he was doing and how it impacted me and how much agony I was in. What I hadn't done though, was leave or even threaten to. Until...

Something happened where I got in touch with my self worth. I had one foot out the door and was actually creating an exit plan, so why not try one last thing: an epic nuclear melt-down. I let DH have it. Pulled no punches. Used very harsh blunt wording about how I "will be treated like Queen Shit of Turd Island before the sun sets today," and "you need to remember which one of us you're f*cking." Oh yeah, I went there. I even told DH that if he went to SD and said that he's only with me for sex I was convinced that she would have sex with him if it meant having him all to herself. I won't go on with everything else I said or my response will be novel-length but I threw everything at DH about him and his "very sick mini-wife." Yep, I said that. Also mentioned how she's "extremely, extremely, extremely (insert about 10 more extremelies in here) arrogant and that in all of my years working with the crimnally insane, I have never seen anyone more arrogant. Oh yeah. I was quite ashamed of how nutso I was but on the other hand I felt so cleansed after.

I share a bio DDstb25 with DH and I didn't want her to repeat the pattern with her future relationships, so I decided that I would leave and have the epic meltdown on my way out. Only the epic meltdown worked. It's been ten years and there were a couple of slip-ups but a slight reminder and DH rights himself immediately. However, there have been no slip-ups for several years now, so it's all good. I still have a ton of resentment though. I'm not sure that'll ever go away. Not a day goes by that I don't regret marrying a man with brats, one of which is an enmeshed insane mini-wife. Even though DH and I have a completely different marriage, I'm well aware that I should have left anyway because of the resentment that has never really gone away. I even have a secret account and have an escape plan in the event that I decide to leave and spend my golden years in peace. It's a relocation plan and I would relocate so I wouldn't have to worry about running into SD anywhere and seeing her damn face again.

So, even if you have an epic nuclear meltdown if you're amendable to that, and even if it works, there would stll be a ton of resentment and it would take a very long time to not have that hair-trigger worrying response in the event that your SO falls for your SD's tactics. And believe me she will ramp it right up to get your SO back into her clutches.

Also, the root cause of the mini-wife crap is a deep issue within the father. For years just when there was even a slight sign of evolvement in SD or the relationship, DH would sabotage it to knock things back into status quo. After a ton of marital therapy, it came up that DH "just couldn't afford to heal." Reason being that he might lose SD to BM and never see her again. I feel that I'm in a rare case where my DH chose me over his fear of losing SD. That's not the norm with mini-wife dads. They have something within them that drives their enabling of the mini-wife dynamic. It's usually intense fear or guilt. 

I would suggest to you to put your DD first and not let her have your relationship as a model or she'll be repeating that dynamic in her relationships. If you don't want that agony on your DD, then take her and go.

Good luck!

tryingjusttrying's picture

I just wanted to tell you how much I related to your post. My dad was a malignant narcissist (maybe the same thing as a sociopathic narcissist?), and that experience really set me up for a lot more abuse in my adult life. In particular, my dad would lash out at me for any frustrations or upsets he had, and made it my fault and responsibility. So when SS did the same, I took it - he got jealous, and attacked me constantly in so many ways, and my dh basically told me to take it because I was the grown up, and that if I was nicer, then maybe he would stop. I became angry and resentful, which became further proof on the part of dh that I was the problem.

No more.

I also related to your anger bubbling over. Probably, if you had allowed yourself to express yourself more, it may not have been so explosive, but it makes sense that your frustrations would boil over like that. Like you, I finally took a stand, and I'm amazed that it has been okay. Dh isn't happy about me being more vocal, but he's not going anywhere. Just as my dh has his fears, I had my own fears, which both colluded into silencing me. My dh and I love each other and get along really well otherwise, so my fear was losing him or disrupting our relationship. His fears and guilt are so complex, I don't know how to unpack it - I think he has several sensitive spots including his own childhood as well as guilt and fear over how his ex's parenting has lead SS to become a young adult who has many undesirable traits. He wants to either pretend it's not there or try to compensate, neither of which is possible, but both of which ends up being tools for gaslighting me.

Thanks for your thoughts on resentment. My dh wants me to get over resentment stemming from actions just last month, much less from years of getting targeted (dh still mismanages and SS is still passive aggressive, micro-aggressive). I wondered if it was just me that couldn't let go. But I can see how it could stay with you for a very long time. In my opinion, if SS never makes amends or appologizes, how am I to forgive and forget? I hope for my own sake that I will, but I have to forgive myself first and allow myself to process the years of mistreatment.

Anyway, glad you found your voice, and that you had a husband who was strong and loved you enough to do the right thing and stand by you. Thank you for sharing.

ETA: It's important to stand up for yourself not just for your own sake, but for everyone's sake. It's not healthy for the disney dad and mini-wife to remain enmeshed, and needs to be called out. I also think that SS needs a lot of work taking responsibility for his own feelings and reactions and learn to cope with them functionally. That's not going to happen if dh continues to allow SS to blame others, be the victim, etc. I read that another word for "entitlement" is "learned helplessness". SS should feel empowered to be happier, make his life better, not wait around for me to change or disappear.

Trudie's picture

I read your story with fascination. I am so glad you got in touch with your self worth! Although it solves some things, I understand that the resentment still lingers. Future-wise, I hope you are able to make the right decision for you. Blessings to you!

BanksiaRose's picture

And leaving you at the drop of a hat at Christmas (that must have been so lonely!) and on your date night which you already modify to suit his sorry a$$...  If this is the earlier stages of the relationship, the honeymoon, what's it going to be five years down the line???

Rags's picture

It keeps things direct and focused on what they do regardless of why they do it and does not waste time, effort, or emotion on why they are what they are..

Not once during my divorce did I ever give a thought to why my then STBXW was a seriously adulterous whore. That she was made her a write off.  I did invest a ton of effort in engaging a couples therapist and trying to fix things.  Though fixing her was never a consideration. Fixing the marriage was my intent. I did not know during the 5mos of couples therapy that she was cheating. When she walked out of the last couples session  after 5mos of weekly sessions proclaiming that she did not have a problem with sex, the incredible therapist and I gave each other a knowing look. From that point, it was about me and figuring out how to get back to being the man I liked being and living the life I liked living. It had nothing to do with her at that point.

5mos later when we left the courthouse following our final divorce hearing I held the door for her,.  Then as we got to the road I stepped off of the curb, walked across the street, got in my vehicle, and drove off. The last sight of her I ever had was as I drove away I checked my side and rear view mirrors as one does when driving. She was standing on the curb sobbing. I felt nothing. Which made a major impression on me. Usually I am a caring person and do not want anyone upset.  At that point realized how freeing not giving a shit about those who are not additive to my life is.  I never saw her again.  As I stepped off the curb she had reached out and put her hand on my shoulder. I ignored it and stepped into my new life adventure. When I stepped off of the curb she broke into sobs.  She was a nasty biotch in the hearing to the point that the Judge ripped her a new asshole.  

Even with the divorce final, nothing about her changed.  Though I never layed eyes on her again she was like a bad case of jock itch that kept calling.  One call to cry and looking for emotional support. The next a nasty attack in response to some perceived slight.  This cycled for about the next 3yrs.

IMHO, never waste time or effort worrying about why nasty people are nasty. That they are nasty is really all that matters other than scraping their shit lives off of our shoe which is what we owe ourselves.

This may be a selfish position.  It likely is. However, we must defend ourselves from what they do and who they are. Why they do what they do or are that way really is irrelevant.

IMHO of course.

Trudie's picture

"IMHO, never waste time or effort worrying about why nasty people are nasty. That they are nasty is really all that matters other than scraping their shit lives off of our shoe which is what we owe ourselves."

I truly understand this! Here's the "but".... I am fascinated by the hows and whys of the way the mind works! Professionally, gaining insight leads to positive treatment outcomes. Personally, I ride the fence...if you do me dirty, you are dead to me...but there's that part of me still interested in the why. Maybe because I'm scholarly. Maybe becaue I like to problem solve. Maybe because I am just plain curious!

"This may be a selfish position.  It likely is. However, we must defend ourselves from what they do and who they are. Why they do what they do or are that way really is irrelevant."

I do not see this as selfish...I see this as a core belief. I stand firm in my core beliefs because I know that I give as good (or better) than what I require in return. If you can't meet my standard of behavior or practice basic human decency I am cordial and move on.

Rags's picture

of complex equipment and organizational failures then continually optimizing their performance, you just made me realize that my philosophy on the blended family crap is counter to what I make a very good living doing.

Shok

Unknw

I think this is because when it comes to the behaviors of toxic people, what causes their toxicity is not what I am focused on solving. Ending their crap instantly is my goal.  Resolving their issue is on them. I really don't give a crap why they do what they do.

Unlike in my professional life where finding the cause, resolving it, continually monitoring performance, and continually optimizing it is my passion.  The linchpin to that is implementing continual compliance in the form of digital behavioral compliance monitoring systems.  They do what they are paid to, how they are paid to do it, and when they are supposed to do it.  The behavioral accountability system never sleeps, it monitors the processes they are accountable for, and it notifies the entire organization when they deviate from the processes.

An interesting element of all of this is that those who utilize the best practices far out perform those who do not. To the point that they complete their core job duties in far less time which frees them to innovate. Those people thrive, prosper, and advance. Those who fight the practices weed themselves out.  The biggest challenge is locking in this model as organizational culture.  Leaders often balk at the final step where they have to address firmly those who fight the best practices.  Business, even capital asset focused business is about people. Human behavior is the single biggest influence on the effectiveness of the organization and assets including how reliable available, and productive physical equipment is.  Systems optimization works. Regardless of if it is a human system or an equipment system.  Best practice works everywhere. The key to continually optimizing the practices is localizing them for the environment where they are applied. Implement the basics, continually optimize from there.

In personal life I cut to the accountability and consequence point.  I explain once. From then on it is instant consequence.

Their choice.  Follow standards of reasonableness, or suffer.

Fortunately, in personal life I find it relatively rare that I have had to go all in on this model. Except with the SpermClan who is fortunately history for all of us, and upon occasion when someone in my IL clan gets too big for their britches and plays on my brides big hearted love for them all. by bringing their toxic crap forward.

It may be a bit of surprise, but I hate conflict.  That is why I focus on compliance.  They either comply or they do not.  If it is an equipment failure, the root cause of that failure is critical to resolving the issue.  With people, compliance is what drives improvement.  So troubleshooting to the human compliance level is the efficiency point.  Why they choose to not comply, is not critical. That they comply, is critical.

Usually those who choose to not comply are the ones who are invested in the status quo and fail to see that better, is better for them too.  Organizations that are committed to good enough rarely invest in what I do.

In the blended family world, IMHO it should not be tolerated to not improve for the toxic side.  They commit to the status quo of toxic, they suffer.  Pain changes behavior.  What drives the behaviors of the toxic I couldn't give a crap about.

Pardon

Good luck with fixing their core issues.  You are a far better person than I am.

Dash 1

Make sure your lifetime supply of Excedrin is in hand.

Wink

 

Trudie's picture

The fact that Professional Rags and Personal Rags are opposites is very interesting! 

Conflict...ugh! I am wondering if your take on toxic behavior is to end it...therefore ending conflict too? I understand that. I, too, hate conflict. However when thrust into it, I will stand toe to toe with the offender and not back down. I attribute that to the fact that people behaving badly angers me; there is simply no need to act this way. All things can be said with grace and compassion; my goal is to shut the behavior down this way. If that doesn't work, then consequences. Or, as a very wise person from my past taught me, "put the hurt on them". Smart people learn to not take it to the 'consequece' level. And there are also those who never learn. 

Rags's picture

"Put the hurt on them"... indeed.  Be nice, until it is time to not be nice. So to speak.

An interesting thing we get from some of my IL clan, usually the IL clan outlaws (Spouses) is that DW's sibs are intimidated by her.  Not that she is domineering. It is that she is incredibly successful while they are not and they cannot understand ho wit is that they "work so hard" and struggle while in their perspective the does not work as hard and succeeds.  Of course they have no cognizance of the work a dual major BS, then grad school, then a top tier professional certification, and working 1000hrs of OT a year takes. BIL1 will upon occassion try to compete with his big sister on elements of work. Hours of OT, he wins in short spurts but gets his doors blown off on an anual basis.  CPAs, particualarly those that are Tax focused and have tax planning and a broad client base work a crap ton of hours.  Rarely though occassionally he will try to bow up on either DW or me that he made more than us on a paycheck.  We don't talk about it.  Until he just keeps pushing at which point I will comment that if he worked another 300 hours each week he would still have made less than half of what I made or his sister made in a pay period.  There are a number of factors involved. BIL1 works in agriculture which is not subject to the OT laws of non agriculture industries. So, OT is straight time. Period. Dot.  Second, he does not understand that salary professionals make what they make whether they work 20hrs a week or 100hrs a week.  It also happens that DW, though salaried with bonus and equities, earns straight time OT above 40hrs a week.

Every time BIL1 starts his run up to the biggest.... paycheck, most OT, etc.... smack down I tell him not to go there. He keeps poking the bear until the bear calmly swats him.

Even my DW said this in the early stage of our marriage. How her family works so hard and "bad things always happen" while my family succeeds and bad things don't happen.  Of course bad things happen, we just are adept at adjusting and engaging on improveing rather than banging our heads against the same wall.

I had to tread lightly on that topic at that time.  Since then, DW has had major success academically and professionally while her family are all doing the same things over and over again while expecting different results. Generation after generation.  This is of course "not fair" from their perspective. Their frustration simmers unil they get mean. That is when I pull out the mirror and put their noses against it.  DW, like her family, tends to ignore the crap. They all invest in the facade. Which is fine with me as long as they keep it nice and are respectful.  It is when they make the mistake of  deviating from nice and respectful that I burn down the facade. Interestingly, over the years, DW has developed a recognition of the tipping point and will address it often before I have to.

They do not like that very much.

Since the few years after the end of the Custody/Visitation/Suppor CO I have very little if any conflict or tension in my life other than with my IL clan and their drama.  Though the SpermClan  went mostly radio silent with my son when he aged out and we picked him up from his final COd SpermLand visitation, they did get weasely in their attempts to guilt him into repaying 16yrs of CS because it had denied his 3 younger also out of wedlock SpermIdiot spawned half sibs the nice things that SS had benefited from.  Interesting considering that for a year of that 16yrs CS was $110/mo and then was $133/mo for 9 years.  That pittance, in their pea sized brains anyway, had paid for top schools, nice homes, nice clothes, sports teams, etc......  The final 8yrs CS went up significantly. First to $785/mo for two years, due to the SpermIdiot dodging CS review hearings and ultimately physically running from being served by the Constable, then dropped to $385/mo for the final 6 years.  SS expressed guilt and anger a couple of times over the CS years about this. Though by the time he aged out he had gained clarity on them and their manipulations.

When the conflicts have occurred, neither me, nor my bride have ever lost our temper and only once has an F-bomb been dropped by our side. That was when my DW was incredibly hurt by BIL1 and his bovine bride and DW finally called them out by asking them what their F'n problem was.

Never again.  It bothered her more that she lost her cool than they were what they were.

In professional situations I find that engaging with a historicly high performer under the old practices, getting them on board the new culture, then highlighting their success builds them into a believer and they drive mass compliance from their long term peers.  I have tried this with members of my IL clan. To no avail.  The clear difference is that something that is a condition of employment drives compliance where something that takes personal commitment and major personal change requires a full personal commitment and action by the individual.  One effects pay, the other they have to earn things for themselves.

If I am making any sense at all in this long blatherous digression.

Though challenging, driving change and improvement professionally is far easier than driving it in others who are part of my personal life.  

Scratch one-s head

Trudie's picture

This does make sense!

I understand treading lightly where the ILs are concerned; there have been times when I would have loved to tell them what I really think, but I remind myself that I don't play in the mud...it's just not worth it. 

Lc891's picture

Thank you all for your responses. It's given me some food for thought. I think I know it will never change, I don't why I hold on to the hope of change Sad

Nothing happened to SD for her to get undressed and dressed in front of him, infact it's one of the only things he can see is wrong and was extremely uncomfortable with it and had to address with her a couple of times. 
 

I hold my partner mostly responsible for our situation, however SD is a huge part of it and partner has allowed this by not being able to put boundaries in and follow through. SD manipulation is so powerful, it's not something I've seen in someone of her age. Her own teachers from a young age raised concerns 

 

What I realised they both do, which he sort of agrees is they both distort reality and create a false one. In the sense of not taking responsibility and placing themselves as more the victim and twisting what actually happened. 
 

SD tells "stories" and lies. She will turn any conversation back to herself where she is the centre of attention. Suggesting funny scenarios she helped make or helping an elderly person which didn't happen etc. At the dinner table she tried this and my daughter called her out as she was present at the time of this "story" she said "That absolutely did NOT happen, what are you talking about" SD said "yeah" and repeated part of story to Which my daughter laughed mad again said " none of this happened we were out together" SD just literally changed the subject to something else about her. No embarrassment, not bothered and moved.

My partner and SD both do this whole move on like shit didn't just hit the fan. He for example has a "word" about the behaviour, she gets defensive then blames anything else and the next breath asks if he will help pay for her holiday and he agrees! His eyes, we spoke about the bad and that's that. I say you just reward bad behaviour!  SD has no time to sit with it and literally in the next breath asks for money etc and he just gives it.

 

This is on him, I told him he enables and infact encourages her behaviour as he is REWARDING it. 
I have come to notice recently he tends to "gaslight" me in the we situations. I don't understand his over the top ways now. It's like the longer this has gone on the more he wraps her up YET he says HE noticed from a young age she was very calculating and manipulative and ask for me to point it out as he knows sometimes he doesn't see it. But when it is pointed out her tries to defend it, suggest it's not the case... it's like he knows she is these things but then refuses they exist when they are happening. 
 

Every year she forgets his birthday, I've always reminded her and Infact bought the presents. Since everything ramped up I haven't. So this year we were due to be away. We didn't make it as partner was unable to fly. So few days after his birthday I book dinner and he booked the cinema tickets. I come to shower as it's nearing time to leave and he tells me she just text him and she getting the train as a surprise to see him. I said what about our plans again? This wasn't your weekend, we aren't mean to be in the country and you are physically struggling so a 1.5 hour train journey there and 1.5 Back to get her is crazy! 
I said, I'm sorry but she has an agenda she never does anything unless it's something about her. She is due next weekend. Turns out the following weekend she has planned a party, and last time my partner had told she could borrow a speaker. So really she came down to get the speaker. She left the next day, didn't stay the weekend but got the speaker. It also now means plans we had on the weekend that she wasn't due here have to move as she put it of sync no covo etc 

Yet it's me that's not fair

i apparently being too sensitive, blah blah 
Sorry for the rant, I guess I know the reality

i Am not just blaming her, my main and real problem is with him. This IS HIS doing but she absolutely plays her part

 

 

Rags's picture

dance going.

He created his shit spawn and IMHO it is time for you to turn up the heat and make him suffer for it.  Make them  both suffer for it.  You go forward with the plans you made. Be direct. We are leaving so she will make this trip for no reason. Tell him that you are going whether he chooses to come or not. Then do not discuss it beyond that.  Then leave.  In fact, amplify the things you do on that trip, share it on social media, meet new people, have drinks with them, have fun.  

Lather, rinse, repeat.

Time to rub the ill trained puppies noses in the stench filled stains they make on their own life's carpet and keep it off of yours.  Don't forget to swat them on the ass while doing it.

Proverbially of course.

Time for zero tolerance, bare their asses instantly, tolerate no bullshit, and call their DARVO crap loud and pubically.  Call out the noxious spawn instantly calling her a liar.  When daddy gets his fee fees hurt over that, bare his ass too.

Take care of you.

Give rose

 

BanksiaRose's picture

And if I might add, both sound like they have antisocial personality disorder (AKA psychopathy) traits - habitually lying and making up stories with the goal to paint themselves in a favourable light, showing no remorse or even spontaneous embarrassment when caught - then just moving on, transactional relationships (i.e., using you and each other to achieve a tangible goal). 
 

You are being abused in this relationship. There's nothing redeeming in this guy, from what I can read in your posts. Is this relationship more just a habit now?