I’ll probably catch some SERIOUS HEAT for saying this but I think this case is VERY INTERESTING…some could/will argue that when a mother –to-be does the EXACT same thing...they call the person a “doctor” instead of a hitman and call the procedure abortion…okay….LET ME HAVE IT!!!
I don't think you shouldn't have to feel like you can't have your own opinion without receiving heat!!!
I'm pretty liberal when it comes to abortion (except partial birth abortion-that I'm against) and the right to choose, which also mean the right to not have an abortion either. I just want you to know, us liberals..aren't going to tar and feather you for having formed your own intelligent opinion:)
I meant that kind of tongue-in-cheek…I can take the heat (if i get any) :O} I used to think that I was ULTRA liberal…but over the years I think that I’m leaning more middle of the road, my life experiences I suppose…I’m not 100% against abortion and I’m definitely not 100% for it…but I thought it was an interesting parallel and I agree with sympotheticbiodad that the issue will definitely become “when does life begin” … how can you charge someone with attempted murder if the “person/thing” they were going to kill is not yet a “living being” in the eyes of the law Make a GREAT Day!
That's going to be a hard one. You have a point Nise, it goes back to the original all important question: At what point is a fetus a living being? This crime is especially hanus and procecuting it is going to bring out a lot of people on both sides of the issue.
I personally haven't made up my own mind when it comes to abortion so I guess I can't have a solid opinion on this one. I do beleive a person should have a right to do whatever they want to their own body or life as long as it doesn't adversally impact the rights of others, but I'm at conflict with myself when it comes to the right of a Mother to terminate her own fetus. It definately all comes down to the generally accepted definition of life. Unfortunetly there isn't one.
I was just thinking about this. A few months ago they had a show on Dr. Phil that was really interesting. A man was not only fighting to not have to pay child support but taking his case to the supreim court. He felt that his rights about fathering are not equal to that of a woman. He said that the girl was on birth control but still ended up pregnant. He wanted to sign over all rights including financial obligation because he was not ready emotionally or financially to be a father. They had discussed options and he made it clear that he wanted her to have an abortion and she agreed. At the last minute the girl changed her mind and decided to keep the baby. He went on to say that women have choices. They can abort, keep the child or even adopt it out. But men don't have any. In his view they both had sex but her options determine his life. He thought that since she decided to have the child that she should take full responsibility of the child.
Any thoughts or comments???
After reading some the postings and living through it myself I do think it is unfair that men get little choice. Sometimes I wonder did my dh's ex just have a child because she knew it was a meal ticket. She gets paid a lot of money from my DH...more than a lot make in one month. Once a decision between both has been made to abort and if she changes her mind at the last minute I think it is her problem alone. That goes the other way as well...if both parties decide to make a child together then both are responsible. We live in Canda and I remember our lawyer telling us it is a scary place to live if you are a man...women have all the rights.
I think this is along the lines of what I’ve been thinking/feeling for a long time…men/father’s don’t have any rights…true enough people will say, if he doesn’t want to be a dad he should keep it in his pants…but the same goes for women…if you don’t want to be a mom, keep your legs crossed…BUT if you uncross them and slip on that banana peel and land…well you know where…you ALWAYS have the option to abort or adopt out….I think that a man should be allowed to sign over all rights and financial obligations if they choose to IF a baby is born out of wedlock AND before the child turns a year old. I think this would make women more responsible and choose more wisely since in the end we (women) are the ones with the most “choices”
Additionally, if the father decides that he does want to remain an active role in a baby born out of wedlock, then child support is NOT calculated on the standard of living of the two parents, but rather the actual costs of the child plus daycare.
Also, if the state will go after fathers automatically for child support regardless of a parenting plan, then they need to establish visitation schedules just as easily as child support payments!
I was wondering why more unmarried men don't exercise their right/responsibility to wear a condom. I realize that they are not 100% effective, but why wouldn't they take a little extra precaution.
I don't get it either! The majority of guys seem to recognise that there are 'predators' out there looking trap them by this very method. Maybe it comes down to the little head doing the thinking .....
I don’t think the issue is one of birth control b/c birth control goes both ways, Men should wear condoms and Women should require them…I think the issue is more gender bias (both natural bias that are biological…and man made biases that have worked their way into our court system) that are AGAINST men in most cases…and in favor or women REGARDLESS of the situation!
I understand the guy on Dr. Phils show. Both a man and a woman make a decision and "end up pregnant" wheather the pregnancy is a result of not using protection or faulty protection- is not the focus, although each should be using their own protection. The point is that womans choices are beyond that of the heat of the moment. Where as men are held to that moment.
Comments
hhmmmmm
I’ll probably catch some SERIOUS HEAT for saying this but I think this case is VERY INTERESTING…some could/will argue that when a mother –to-be does the EXACT same thing...they call the person a “doctor” instead of a hitman and call the procedure abortion…okay….LET ME HAVE IT!!!
Nise...
I don't think you shouldn't have to feel like you can't have your own opinion without receiving heat!!!
I'm pretty liberal when it comes to abortion (except partial birth abortion-that I'm against) and the right to choose, which also mean the right to not have an abortion either. I just want you to know, us liberals..aren't going to tar and feather you for having formed your own intelligent opinion:)
Candice...
I meant that kind of tongue-in-cheek…I can take the heat (if i get any) :O} I used to think that I was ULTRA liberal…but over the years I think that I’m leaning more middle of the road, my life experiences I suppose…I’m not 100% against abortion and I’m definitely not 100% for it…but I thought it was an interesting parallel and I agree with sympotheticbiodad that the issue will definitely become “when does life begin” … how can you charge someone with attempted murder if the “person/thing” they were going to kill is not yet a “living being” in the eyes of the law Make a GREAT Day!
I know you can take the heat..
but I just don't think we should have to for our "opinions". So, I wanted to take the heat off, before you got any!
Wow, Hard One
Here's a link to the original article: Father hires a hitman to kill his unborn child
That's going to be a hard one. You have a point Nise, it goes back to the original all important question: At what point is a fetus a living being? This crime is especially hanus and procecuting it is going to bring out a lot of people on both sides of the issue.
I personally haven't made up my own mind when it comes to abortion so I guess I can't have a solid opinion on this one. I do beleive a person should have a right to do whatever they want to their own body or life as long as it doesn't adversally impact the rights of others, but I'm at conflict with myself when it comes to the right of a Mother to terminate her own fetus. It definately all comes down to the generally accepted definition of life. Unfortunetly there isn't one.
I was just thinking about
I was just thinking about this. A few months ago they had a show on Dr. Phil that was really interesting. A man was not only fighting to not have to pay child support but taking his case to the supreim court. He felt that his rights about fathering are not equal to that of a woman. He said that the girl was on birth control but still ended up pregnant. He wanted to sign over all rights including financial obligation because he was not ready emotionally or financially to be a father. They had discussed options and he made it clear that he wanted her to have an abortion and she agreed. At the last minute the girl changed her mind and decided to keep the baby. He went on to say that women have choices. They can abort, keep the child or even adopt it out. But men don't have any. In his view they both had sex but her options determine his life. He thought that since she decided to have the child that she should take full responsibility of the child.
Any thoughts or comments???
After reading some the
After reading some the postings and living through it myself I do think it is unfair that men get little choice. Sometimes I wonder did my dh's ex just have a child because she knew it was a meal ticket. She gets paid a lot of money from my DH...more than a lot make in one month. Once a decision between both has been made to abort and if she changes her mind at the last minute I think it is her problem alone. That goes the other way as well...if both parties decide to make a child together then both are responsible. We live in Canda and I remember our lawyer telling us it is a scary place to live if you are a man...women have all the rights.
Skye22
Skye22
I think this is along the lines of what I’ve been thinking/feeling for a long time…men/father’s don’t have any rights…true enough people will say, if he doesn’t want to be a dad he should keep it in his pants…but the same goes for women…if you don’t want to be a mom, keep your legs crossed…BUT if you uncross them and slip on that banana peel and land…well you know where…you ALWAYS have the option to abort or adopt out….I think that a man should be allowed to sign over all rights and financial obligations if they choose to IF a baby is born out of wedlock AND before the child turns a year old. I think this would make women more responsible and choose more wisely since in the end we (women) are the ones with the most “choices”
Make a GREAT Day!
I second that!
Additionally, if the father decides that he does want to remain an active role in a baby born out of wedlock, then child support is NOT calculated on the standard of living of the two parents, but rather the actual costs of the child plus daycare.
Also, if the state will go after fathers automatically for child support regardless of a parenting plan, then they need to establish visitation schedules just as easily as child support payments!
I was wondering why more
I was wondering why more unmarried men don't exercise their right/responsibility to wear a condom. I realize that they are not 100% effective, but why wouldn't they take a little extra precaution.
Birth Control
I don't get it either! The majority of guys seem to recognise that there are 'predators' out there looking trap them by this very method. Maybe it comes down to the little head doing the thinking .....
The real issue....
I don’t think the issue is one of birth control b/c birth control goes both ways, Men should wear condoms and Women should require them…I think the issue is more gender bias (both natural bias that are biological…and man made biases that have worked their way into our court system) that are AGAINST men in most cases…and in favor or women REGARDLESS of the situation!
Make a GREAT Day!
I understand the guy on Dr.
I understand the guy on Dr. Phils show. Both a man and a woman make a decision and "end up pregnant" wheather the pregnancy is a result of not using protection or faulty protection- is not the focus, although each should be using their own protection. The point is that womans choices are beyond that of the heat of the moment. Where as men are held to that moment.
Exactly!
Well said!
Make a GREAT Day!
I'm sorry, I didn't mean to
I'm sorry, I didn't mean to wander off the issue, it just brought about a question in my mind.
I do believe that men should be granted the right to choose whether or not they want to become a parent.