Level with me...AITA here?
I almost feel I should ask this on reddit lol- sorry for the long post. Overthinking things you know as usual. But I do know my group here keeps it real and also understands dynamics and some of you know of my long past issues with SD>
FOr a quick recap- SD and I get along quite well now, she is maturing in some ways, and is very kind to me and respectful to both DH and I, we've come a LONG way from our eventful and acrimonious past.
As another reminder- SD was the kid that always received extra/double/nice gifts for every bday, holidays, etc...because she has a lot of extended family. I was always amazed how a kid with 2 relatively broke parents (DH and BM) could rack up so much stuff. She always had way more gifts and cool stuff I couldn't afford for my kids- but I never expected others/family to get for them, I provided what my salary and modest CS afforded. We don't have a lot of family here for them, my ex's family all live overseas so they never have been involved in any way w/the boys. SD grew up to expect nice things, and lots of gifts and has a chronic huge sense of entitlement. She has the mentality that everyone else will help support this unplanned pregnancy it seems. THey are 20, never should have gone forward w/this pregnancy if you can't afford it. She immediately jumped on food stamps, she worked until she was 4 months and quit, and is 'job searching' (not). Her fiance works hard.
Dh and I were kind of annoyed w/the comments she made about 'gifts' can wait for gifts, my friends will get me gifts, can't wait to get the registry done (shower isn't until October)- and then showed us a picture of a 7 piece bedroom set she wants (convertible crib, changing table, chair, etc) it's close to 1k. She said she wanted us to pitch in as she wants the family to all go in as a group gift so her friends can get the other things off registry (yes,it's rude, you don't tell people WHAT to get for you or who can get what).
Anyways, if you add in her all her family (bm's parents are divorced) so that's a lot of grandparents, adding his family, etc) we probably wouldn't have to pay more then $100-150 I would think max (I'm sure my MIL will also contribute). To be honest w/me out of work and only DH working money is tight-though $100 is probably close to what we would spend, it was more likely in the 60-70 range. Ideally I wanted to really get her some baby carriers or a baby wrap because they were a LIFE SAVER when mine were infants.. Or a playpen-she has a pitbull so keeping little one protected will come in handy- not to mention they are so practical (can travel, be in the yard, etc).
At first I wasn't opposed -but the more I think of it the more upset I get- and DH happens to agree- in fact he said he's afraid she'll be just like BM and use the kid as an accessory and will become an entitled golden uterus. Kids knocked up with no place of their own or stable income/jobs should NOT be buying or expecting OTHERS to buy a 1K baby bedroom set. A normal situation with broke kids, they would get things second-hand or hand me downs. She has several friends that popped babies during teen years that I'm sure wouldn't mind sharing.
That 1k could buy so many other essentials she will find super practical and needed, clothes, diapers, a swing, a playpen, stroller, car seat, carriers, if she didn't choose this expensive item she could get things that would really help them out long term, kwim?
I know it's part of the millennial/Gen z thing to expect big/expensive things- that the world 'owes' them - Expectations to fork out hundreds (and more) for destination weddings, bachelorette trips, and huge gifts for registries. This was not the case when I married and had kids at all. They were modest, it didn't burden others and it was expected we provide for our own progeny.
Back when I had my shower (only had one for my firstborn as was tradition)- I didn't get big gifts, but lots of clothes, paci's, diapers. I got a lot of things from family/friends that were passed on - the crib, the changing table (bought a new mattress/pad myself). My ex and I both worked, had a home and still bought 90pct of items ourselves. We didn't expect others to give these items. WE didn't feel entitled.
So, what would you do? Are we aholes if we don't contribute to the group gift-because to be honest it's a tad more then we'd like to pay, but the biggest thing is on PRINCIPLE> We don't want to keep feeding the entitlement thing. If you can't afford a kid and all that comes with it, don't have it and expect others to provide these for you, and brand new, expensive at that!
She does not want more kids, of course life can happen, but it seems so wasteful! Yes, my dad got me a glider w/my 1st- we all hated that squeaky things- my 2nd son he got me a nice lazy-boy recliner (godsend).....but again, we were married, had a home, worked, I was 25 when I had my 1st (planned) 27 w/my second (unplanned)- and we did the majority of big ticket items ourselves. As long as the crib fits safety standards and operates ok, I see no issue with a hand me down. I'm torn honestly. The whole thing is nauseating and on principle I just want to bow out and let them all get a ridiculous expensive set and we get something we find could help her out (and more cost efficient). CUrious what others thoughts are on it.
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Yes and no in being an AH.
Yes and no in being an AH.
You don't have to contribute to something just because she wants it. However, your issue seems to be that she acts entitled so you want to not get her something she wants (which is also for the baby) because of that entitlement. That makes sense for you, but if your DH agrees that her entitlement is HIS reason for not giving, then he's an AH.
He helped raise her to be entitled, plain and simple. I get so effing tired about older generations giving Millennials and Gen Z crap for how they behave. They behave that way because they were brought up that way. WTF did parents expect would happen when they just allowed their kids to be spoiled and not work for anything? They won't suddenly become adults who think they don't deserve nice things when *every adult in their family* reinforced that they should for years and years.
Certainly your DH doesn't owe his DD money towards her crib, but it's an AH mentality to all of a sudden now act like her entitlement is an issue. He certainly doesn't have to contribute if he thinks something else would be appropriate, but he shouldn't use his own failures as a parent to punish his daughter, or to think less of her.
A gift should be given freely
A gift should be given freely and willingly by the giver. I say give what you want, if anything. What's the worst that could happen? She probably won't even remember who put in for what if she's that entitled.
NTA- get the gift you want to
NTA- get the gift you want to get and that's that let her pout.
Also, I don't think it's a gen x/millennial entitlement thing. She is a direct product of their parenting or lack of parenting.
The oldest stepkid over here always asks for the reasonably priced items that we volunteer to buy (laptop for college, little house gadgets) etc.
My neighbors son just graduated and he has been cutting lawns and saved up to buy himself a riding mower/tools. He will be paying for his college himself working for himself. I've seen that kid out with a push mower for the last 3 years building his clients.
As to the entitlement, I can
As to the entitlement, I can HONESTLY say that for all the other failures my DH had with SD (guilty parenting mainly)- he never did go overboard w/gifts, clothes, items- in fact he held firm to that what CS is for. His gifts were small/modest/cheap as that's all he could afford, so he never did feed that beast. He actually would go small because he knew the extended family/godmother, etc would all go over the top (his parents included).
He had SO many arguments with his parents about over-indulging, but it was their decision. I also have to say some of those younger generation are just wired that way or learn this from social media/their friends, etc My oldest son is quite entitled (not to sd's extent but still I abhor it) and I never indulged that kid. They lived w/the motto life isn't fair. They would get upset at SD's bragging and showing off all her gifts all the time. My youngest on the other hand, never requested much of anything, if he did it was 'needs' or he would help contribute towards it, he's great at saving money. That kid honestly doesn't have an ounce of entitlement, raised the exact same way. I'll admit, with my oldest- his entitlement issues didn't show up until in conjunction w/his drug and mental health issues, as a younger teen/kid he was just like my youngest-and never expected more then I could do, kwim?
I talked to an old co-worker/friend of mine the other day, he has a 20 yr old son and he's old school like me- never indulged the kid and he is so distraught w/the level of sheer entitlement and snobbery his son displays. He's like I promise you I never raised him like that. He can't wrap his head around it.
I don't know- maybe it's a direct product of divorce- not only parents, but surrounding family/society that does the whole 'poor COD' thing and over-compensates, but I've seen it in intact homes as well (not as much though). How many parents do you see competing to give the biggest/most expensive trip, gift, etc. DH never played that game, he was cheap lol
In SD's case, it's not like DH can 'punish' her (ground her, etc) for receiving gifts from others. He made it clear it wasn't the same for our house. There were plenty times I stopped my own mom from getting her gifts because there was NO NEED for my mom to gift her given all she would receive from her extended family. It was on principle, for both of us. I have SO many gripes with him about what he allowed w/her, lack of discipline for disrespect, etc- but he never did feed the entitlement thing. He would call her out on it- the biggest items I think he ever got her was a pair of cleats and some roller skates- so yeah, there was zero over the top gifting from him. It came from all the grandparents/step-grandparents mainly/bm's siblings and her godmother.
There are other things that contribute to it IMO- the over the top sports attending by an entire family army every weekend IMO is one of them. That was another things SD had a lot of- my in-laws were particularly bad about doing ANYTHING she wanted, driving her all over creation for whatever little thing she wanted- a fair, a race, a rally, a bday party, on and on....it was endless. DH would refuse to hop around like that, she or BM would call his parents, and they would go against my Dh's call EVERY time- they were BIG contributors to this as well. A lot of that stopped when my FIL passed away.
Also, BM was a horrible low-life scheming person, it was ALWAYS about what she could get over on people, jobs, friends, family, insurance company scams, food stamp fraud, etc.... her own family was like that so it was just passed on generation to generation. SD learned at a young age to gravitated towards the most well off kids in school- so she'd get invited to their homes, give expensive gifts, take her on fancy vacations, etc.....at her age now, she doesn't really still have friends of her own socio-economic status, kwim? She's been to million dollar homes because she chooses friends with money, great cars, etc. Again, BM taught her this from a young age. So I think she may see these kids getting these things and just has completely unrealistic expectations or sense or reality.
I'm not saying it's wrong to have friends of all socio-economic status.. When her choices from a young age were ONLY the rich kids, that's what I'm talking about. She was able to tag onto their activities/events. I know there is a term for it, but that is 100pct bm and kins doing. My in-laws had tons of faults as I mentioned, but that certainly wasn't one of them-never had a scheming bone/take advantage in their body.
So if you don't give her the
So if you don't give her the 100 dollars towards the furniture what do you think you will gift her instead? Seeing as you know the money is going toward the furniture what does it matter? I would be less inclined to give "gift cards" or money if you are concerned she will use them for frivolous items for herself. I had a young mom listing maternity clothes on her registry. DH and I opted to gift her two months of diapers.
I wouldn't do gift cards. I
I wouldn't do gift cards. I was honestly thinking of a front/back baby carrier, a playpen or a swing, those were my top choices, perhaps because I recall those being my most prized items for my own -but also I know they are super practical and get a lot of use and two of those can be used at home, yard, travelling, going to grandparents, friends, etc. ..but I could chose the price (huge price discrepancy and things are SO much more expensive then they were then). I guess I feel that a bedroom set also is a parents responsibility-big furniture like that should be-and you should only aim for what you can afford. This is just another high demand/priced want, certainly not a need. Does that make sense?
It does and your items are
It does and your items are practical and make sense, but you also have to remember usability. I know I never used my kids pack and play despite thinking we could use it everywhere. Reality was it was too cumbersome and hard to transport. You said she has a dog they might end up with the baby gates or the baby gated play area. I never used the baby carrier, I usually either carried the baby or DH did or we used a stroller . If they are huge on hiking I guess baby carrier makes sense. I did use the swing like nobodies business, it was a life saver for fussy baby nights.
Yeah, see, I used all those
Yeah, see, I used all those items a lot. My sd's personality is VERY active and busy, also very OCD and is constantly moving around and doing things. The carrier would allow her hands free to still get around and do all those things, even walk the dog. She can get up and clean and a fussy baby quiets down. I also used it for grocery trips or quick ins/out- I HATED lugging that huge infant carrier that goes in the car seat- talk about a pain and heavy! It was easier to just snap it on and tuck him on me and go. Yes, the swing is the best for sure as well- it's great for infant ages- the playpen I guess is more for when a bit older, you need to do something and don't want baby crawling all over or interacting with dogs, etc...they are secure with their toys.
From what I know, big ticket items are never expected at a typical shower-it's more of an anomaly. Like car seats, strollers, furniture, they are more set for smaller items. NOW, if a grandparent volunteered and said this is what I want to get, then ok- but to put/list it on there and then say 'this is what I want my whole family to do' is just so rude and entitled. Big ticket items are THEIR responsbilitiy-and if you can't afford it, get second hand items. I mean there are bedroom baby sets on FB marketplace that are in great condition for under $200! Their choice to procreate and keep a baby when not being able to afford it was THEIR decision, and certainly shouldn't be everyone else's problem or expense.
NTA
SD can suggest but you decide, including what's affordable to you right now.
That being said, if you figured you were going to spend about that much anyway then sometimes it's simpler to go along and not sweat the small stuff. At then end of the day the baby and SD will use the furniture so maybe just easier to give her what she wants. As you know in steplife things like mismatched expectations around gifts can cause a lot of drama. So maybe best to just go along.
That was my other thought as
That was my other thought as well-just as you said. My concern with that is (besides principle) that it sets precedence down the road for these expensive group items for babys bday, christmas, etc. Then they are planning to marry next year so same expectations, etc. If we give in now, rather then them expect it next time, they know well dad/stepmom do their own thing, kwim? IN other words, we don't really want to become HER grandparents and start from birth with giving things the PARENTS should be able to afford and provide, not the rest of extended family. It will just continue the cycle w/the little one expecting all family to give beyond living realistically with what the parents can do. I want our legacy and example to be different then what SD had- for HER and for her children. THat it's important to live within your means, and you shouldn't expect others to provide what you should, or above your own pay-grade.
We do not plan at ALL to be the grandparents she had, and not what my dh's parents did. We will have boundaries and WE will choose when to babysit, I won't' have a kid dropped off all the time like bm did with SD. Like SD did with her dogs (and would leave them days, not bringing food, etc). I will likely (if they stay in this state) even buy a few second-hand items to have at my home - like those highchairs that attach to the table to save space, a playpen, stuff like that- my mom did the same. We don't intend to spoil the kid rotten w/big ticket items.
The next thing will be little Toby is turning 7 and want s a new laptop and iphone lol. I want her to understand she won't dictate what we gift or spend or do. It was HELL creating boundaries, we're at a good place, I don't want to backwards by making the wrong decision.
If that's the case
Then yeah set the expectation up front. She likely believes from her own experience that doting grandparents should be ATMs for the baby.
If that's not what you guys expect to be, then simply don't do it. Follow you gut and give what you believe appropriate
My opinion
With 5 kids, 9 grandkids and 3 great-grandkids in our blended family, I have found it a good idea to set an amount in my mind for each occasion. This amount is not based on anything other than what I think is appropriate. So, everyone probably knows that I give $x for showers, $y for weddings, $z for birthdays, $w for Christmas. Our kids have varying types of in-laws ranging from ridiculously over the top to normal to none (dead).
I, like you, hear of crazy over-indulgence and I see racks of baby clothes that will never be worn, excessive toys, more "stuff" than anyone can use, etc etc. Whatever. I have also heard many broad gift hints. Whatever. Some of these families feature parents who don't work or who are ridiculously underemployed. Whatever. I'm positive my ex and I made choices and decisions that made my family want to tear their hair out, too.
Because you have several children in your family, I heartily recommend this policy. Another advantage is that it seems fair (my step religion is parity). Let's say your bio child has a baby. Later, you can always get the baby carrier when its just you and them. But for the public occasions, I go with the amount I use for all of them and incidentally, I do cash, that's always welcome.
That's actually a good idea,
That's actually a good idea, publicly giving the same amount but privately doing more if needed. My thing, being tight for cash, was to save "big" but necessary items for Christmas and birthday for my 2 kids. Like a phone, a computer, bedroom set, nice shoes, etc. But if (and that's currently a big if) i will someday have 4 stepkids, holidays and birthdays will be an issue if i'm expected to be the same across the board.
No
You should give your bios more then steps imo. Your SO should handle his bio gifts. You can give them something small and he can reciprocate.
But no way to giving his kids the same as yours. Only exception is really young kids should get similar, as they wont understand. But your SO's kids are mostly older.
The way i've been handling it
The way i've been handling it is i give SO's kids gifts like i do my nieces and nephews. I usually spend about $40-$50 per birthday and Christmas gift for my sister's kids, and it's on "gifty" things like toys and accessories. For my kids it's usually a couple hundred but it's for nicer daily use things like electronics, shoes, and furniture. If SO and I get married, idk what i'll do. I've been single a long time before this relationship and my patterns are pretty ingrained. I've started getting SO's boys, who live at home, somewhat nicer things. $80 earbuds for SS17 and i refurbished an ipad for SS11 for about $150. Both have since been lost or broken though, and one of the SDs didn't even bring their Christmas gift home, it's still at SO's house, so i may scale back for skids.
I get the feeling you are right
This is the start of joint big ticket gifts. Everyone chips in for the Honeymoon to Hawaii. Everyone chips in for a new SUV . It's for the baby and all that stuff she needs to carry for the baby.
Nta. With people going
Nta. With people going through things like baby furniture and gear so quickly, it's foolish to buy brand new. There are plenty of places you can get quality furniture for free! Your local Buy Nothing group, Craigslist, etc. I got so much free stuff thst I then handed down again. Better for your pocketbook and better for the environment. buy what you want and don't feel pressured into group gifting.
These 2 prospective parents don't have a house
These 2 prospective parents don't have a home of their own, do they? Why would they want 7 piece furniture suite? A good gift would be help towards a rent deposit.
Seriously, they need to get their priorities straight.
Yes, this is true. At the
Yes, this is true. At the moment they live with my MIL in the basement- it's large, but only their bedroom (which is huge) is available- the other rooms are filled w/my BIL's junk. I gave SD the name of a junk hauling place to get them emptied out. They don't know yet if they will stay there or move out of state with his family. Even then, if they did that, they'd be living with in-laws until their place was built. So yeah, technically no place of their own.
You should give what you want
You should give what you want and can afford. If you're opposed to the expensive furniture on principle, don't contribute toward it.
When I was expecting DD1, I didn't have a shower and DH had none of the paraphernalia from when SDs were babies, so I needed everything. My wealthy parents could have easily bought their first grandchild the best of everything, but instead they directed me to buy/sell groups and FB Marketplace in their affluent area, where I was able to get gently used, high end baby stuff for a pittance. They also bought me a new carseat, but keeping me from spending our last dime on new baby stuff I thought I had to have was a greater gift, in retrospect. I think it's pretty common for new moms to go overboard and think they need more/better than what they do.
Give what you want, that's
Give what you want, that's the fun part of gifts. The giver gifts what they choose to gift.
What does your DH want to do? This is his child, he should have the tie breaker say.
Are you the AH? I think you can straddle that line, but only if you examine your motives and are honest about them w/ yourself.
OT:
Your topic made me think back. My older son was matchy matchy. Everything that was available 36 years ago, he got. But my younger son? I learned by then that as long as he was safe, well fed, well loved, and lacking none of life's important stuff... he'd be fine. I don't think anything matched or was trendy for him. Lol, the first one is so different from the second.
I found this also that I
I found this also that I think would be awesome. The baby normally sleeps in parents room the first few months anyways- even if she has a great room setup in the nursery-she won't want to go there in middle of night from her room to change baby, etc....this would allow them to have baby sleep next to them, change it right there and later have the travel playpen...thoughts? https://www.amazon.com/Portable-Playard-Comfortable-Mattress-Changing/dp...
That's what I used for DD.
That's what I used for DD. Not that exact one, but essentially a pack and play. I had a Chicco one (used and dirt cheap, but in excellent condition). DD was in our room for over 6 months, and there was no way a crib would fit in our room, but the pack and play worked well. She slept in the suspended bassinet part for a few months then we removed that and had the mattress at the bottom. My cousin's baby slept with them in his pack and play until he was a year old.