Step Talk

I read the SM wanting to humiliate the SS in front of his friends by showing her power, she needs to grow up and remember being a kid instead of acting like a bully.
I had an ex friend who locked her SS in the closet and made him miss supper, thankfully the social services saved the kid from the abuse.
Sounds like social service has more work to do after reading some of these post. If these kids spoke up to the higher powers, no parent is better then abuse.
If you feel the Skid is troubled suggest some professional counseling, or public assistance, do not add to his troubles. If the parent neglects his child has a problem, seek help at school to see if you can find someone who sees your side.
As a step parent you are forming this kids future. If they are unadjusted they need professional help, not extra time alone, they already feel they do not fit in your house and it is your job to help the transition. The balancing act of too much fun all the time and normal time is hard to find.
You are either forming mature adults or prison inmates.
It is a thankless job, but part of your life, like it or leave it.

In no way am I knocking anyone's choice of parenting and disclipling. Every situation is different and brings with it its own set of frustrations. I too have never laid hands on my skids, although I have wanted to do out of frustration at times. The role of SM has been my most challenging role in life, but it also brings with it many rewards. I have been called mean, unloving and hateful because of my discipline methods. I too take things away, send to their room and have even done some crazy techniques, still without ever laying a hand on the child. I have also dealt with a BM who on a consistent basis has tried to undermine my relationship with the skids and fed them hate and lies. Because they were too young to understand, they naturally fell into believing that I was the enemy and made every effort to let me know. I also realize that since DH and I were custodial and I was a SAHM, I was responsible for the bulk of their care. We tried the whole co-parenting with BM and she never wanted anything to do with it or us. We always allowed full access to the kids and she was not contributing anything by way of CS, only chaos and confusion. Did I then resort to some clever punishments? You bet your sweet a$$ I did. Do I regret it? Not in the least bit. So where I may not totally agree with Rags and The Tower (although I liked it), I understand that some situations cause for drastic measures, sort of an intervention type deal. I also think that when you get the skids EOW and their lying and nuances drive you nuts, try having them all the time. When theya re with you all the time, there is no escaping the craziness, unless you leave the marriage totally. So again, what do you do? Act in the best way you know how. It is evident as displayed here on ST and other blogs for step-parents that being a SP brings with a different challenge than being a bio-parent. I for one, sought advice from friends, neighbors, teachers and the church and found no real help. There isn't a whole lot of information out there on dealing with the crazy life that blended families bring. I think the very fact that a lot of us are here seeking further answers and willing to share our stories is evident enough that we seek change and community for blended families. For me, I totally believe in the whole hold your kid accountable whether it be bio or skid with hopes that they will grow into mature and productive individuals. The reality of life is that when they reach the real world, no one gives a damn that their mother wasn't around or they didn't like their SM because she was mean or my cat Fi-Fi got hit by a freakin car, yeah who cares. At some point you have to wake up, accept things as they are, decide if you are going to keep the status quo or require some changes and move the f#ck on. If that makes me mean because I love them enough to hold them responsible for their actions, I'll take that. If it makes me mean for making them not just good students, but GREAT students, I'll take that. If it makes me mean because I accept nothing less than their cooperation and respect, then I'll take it. Because my kids are pissy little sh#ts at times, but they ARE GREAT kids and that is in spite of all the poison BM has fed them. It has taken almost 8 years, but THEY GET IT. Too many of us want a happy ending, but we give up on the fight too early. And I know the reality for some is that, things may never get better and in that instance you have to know when to say when and look out for self when you've done all that you can do.

Step Mother's Motto this week is:

You don't have to LOVE me, you don't even have to LIKE me... But you will RESPECT me.

I posted a reply to the original tower post, after realizing she was for real, (he?)

The reason the methods were shocking wasn't because it was an old room with an uncomfortable chair, or even that he had to go into the room to refocus. It wasn't that he had to write sentances, or that you took things away.

It was the AMOUNT and the ISOLATION you gave him.
Going to the room for say, an hour- and having to write 100 sentances for a very big thing? More understandable.

Not for months straight of his free time- that's NOT understandable.

Thousands of sentances? Not understandable.

Meat-tenderizing his Ipod? (Srsly.)
Burning his cards? (Somewhat more understandable- but still... burning them? You couldn't have thrown them away?

I think why everyone is so uncomfortable with the methods is because of the sheer extreme of the punishments. If not taken to the extreme you did, they are widely used.

I think if just one method was used, and not for the time you said, it would be normal.

I hope you realize your behavior isn't normal, and that your SS might need some mental help after what you've put him through.

And sadly yes- sounds like you did earn that evilstepmom thing. Which is a bummer- because the rest of us, (although we sometimes wish for a Bahama vacation,) truly care about our stepkids.

Rags no offense but I have been reading your posts about your methods of punishment and I as a custodial SM of three and a SM of 3 more I found your methods of punishment quite alarming. Let me start off with what I don't agree with and my reasons why. I agree with Catch you do sound very angry.

1. It is ok to make a child write sentences. I am from the old school of discipling myself. I just don't agree with the long periods of time and the fact of not letting a child even pee. That is child abuse. I got that out of the mouth of a person I know that is a CPS worker.

2. I dont' agree with destroying their belongings. Running their clothes under a lawnmower or bleaching them to prove your point. You are not the one paying CS or even paying for the clothing. As a custodial SM I can tell you this. If my husband sent his kids over to see their mother (who doesn't pay CS most of the time) and thier clothes that WE paid for got destroyed we would be going back to court and suing their SF so fast his head would spin. Not to mention my husband who read your post said if SF were to do this to his kids he would make sure there was a tire or 4 destroyed on SF's car. Just so SF would know EXACTLY how his kids feel and how wrong that is to do. Take their belongings. Store them in a place they can't get to. But it is not your place to destroy them. You are teaching your skids that even with lying two wrongs make a right. Not true.

3. Do you really want your skids to "fear you" and not really respect or love you? Do you want your Skids memory of his childhood to be of "The Tower" or do you want this child to grow up knowing you loved him even though they are not biologically yours? All of my skids love and respect me. They are very well behaved and my oldest is a straight "A" student. I never ever laid on hand on them or had to do excessive punishment. I commanded their respect yes. No they dont fear me. I get a "yes mam" ever time I ask them to do something for me. They do things for me out of love. I get breakfast in bed, requests for SM/Skids days out. They love spending time with me.

3. I had an EX who had the very same methods of discipline. He punished them even if they just farted. He was punishing my kids out of resentment and jealousy of the children and not out of love. I divorced him so fast he didn't know what was happening. My kids and I resent and can't stand this man to this day. My oldest SD got married a few years back and my oldest son refused to go to the wedding. Why? Because he was now a grown bad ass soldier wanting to kick his ex SF's butt. Trust me he would have probably killed him since my son is trained in the special forces and in hand to hand combat. It was scary. He was seriously wanted to give him the same treatment he received as a child so guess what my son didn't go. Neither her did my SD's father. He stood her up at her own wedding and had her in tears. Just remember kids grow up and they will always remember how you treated them. My SD now resents her father and so do all of his Skids. Oh they all feared him but I can't say they love him.

I would take a different approach to your discipling than you are. There is nothing wrong with creative punishments but they still have to be within boundaries not going into actually abusing a child. As a SM or SF the ex's would LOVE to send us to court with the charge of child abuse. Dont' give them a reason to.

It is better to keep your mouth shut and let people believe you are stupid than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

Despite your PM to me assuming that I will not respond, I most certainly will. I have never been one to shut up out of fear that I might hurt someone's feelings, especially if it means compromising my values. You sir, are a child abuser. Just as you said in your PM to me, if your behavior consitutes child abuse, then you are proud to bear it.

Good thing that we use anonymous screen names around here because CPS would be all over your ass for what you have done. We all have done some creative discipline and I myself have had my SD write out sentences, but NEVER extreme like you. I have grounded her to her room for an afternoon, but she was allowed to spend family time with us and go pee by all means. Love and nurturing and postivie reinforcment do really work. All there are many other forms of discipline that can be used. I have thrown away toys for whatever reason, but I never forced SD to mutilate her belongings. You are teaching rage and anger and violence.

You have stated that your SD is a fine young man now. My guess is that he does it out of fear, not love. And I personally would much rather have my SD acting up and being disprectful on occassions and still get the "I love you mommy" and cuddles and hugs and kisses than to have complete good behavior (which is insane for anyone... children or adults) and little soldiers running around the house because they fear the Nazi style punishment they will be subjected to. Call me crazy, but I prefer to love my children and nurture their psyche. You mentioned that your parents taught you this. As with most abusers, they were abused as children themsleves. When we grow up, we have the choice to continue the cycle or break it. You have just reaffrimed that I made the right choice by choosing to break the cycle with my own children.

May God save your soul.

"Having a family is like having a bowling alley installed in your head." ...Martin Mull

StepMom2be.

Amount and isolation? He was in a climate controlled room in a brand new house. The desk was a wooden antique school desk out of a one room school house in Nebraska. His Mom and I were at home with him the whole time. As I said, if he was goofing off when he was supposed to be working he could work when he was supposed to be goofing off.

When we went out to dinner he went with us, when we went on holiday he went with us. Camping, boating, etc ..... He went with us. But, he could not do what he wanted to do when he wanted to do it. That was the punishment. The TOWER and sentences were put in place to keep him focused on the consequences of his actions and to prevent him from daydreaming past the lesson on behavior. This kid has the most amazing imagination. He uses it often and well. Sentences reigned it in so that he could learn when it was appropriate and when he needed to sinch up his jock strap and get to work.

He was never not allowed to pee. He just could not sit on the toilet making paper airplanes out of toilet paper. He had to do his business and get back to his sentences. He is the type of kid that would spend hours in the bathroom doing all types of creative things with toilet paper, the shower curtain, towels and the toilet brush.

As for thousands of sentences, yep he wrote thousands of them. Over the course of ~5 years. Even if I am liberal in the total number of sentences he wrote he averaged no more than a few hundred per week, and for several stretches not for several months at a time. If he was using his head and making good decisions he could do what he wanted with his free time. If not ........ TOWER time and sentences.

As for my behavior not being normal. I agree with you. It is in fact, as supported by the results of my SS being an honor student, a nationally recognized student leader and musician, exceptional. During the years that the TOWER was evolving he would periodically bring home honors performance. Now he does it of his own accord because he recognizes the benefits of good decisions and hard work. These days I pretty much just stand around handing out praise and reward rather than consequences for his bad decisions. He still will through a brain fart every once in a while and bring home a D or F. But, they are few and far between these days.

His teachers year after year have thanked us for being involved and caring parents. In fact his former school had a policy that any time a grade of less than C was earned by a child the parents were supposed to call to set up a Parent Teacher Conference. We were the only parents to ever follow that policy that was printed on the bottom of every report card that school sent out in more than 5 years. So, I have no regrets about the TOWER. Do I wish that my SS would have delivered to his potential without it? Absolutely. But, he didn't so he wrote a bunch of sentences while neighborhood kids were outside goofing off. BTW, a large number of those kids are pregnant, adjudicated delinquents or HS drop outs. My SS has never been in trouble a day in his life beyond detention for reasonably minor violations of school rules.

His performance is not due to my parenting though I did have some influence. His accomplishments are entirely his. I just kept him focused on being accountable for his own actions. Good or bad.

Nurturing and love is not made up only of coddling. In my opinion coddling does no one any favors, especially children. Nurturing is not just protecting and caring. Kids need boundaries, structure and consequences as much as they need care, affection and protection. Nurturing and love includes all of these things. IMHO. With the exception of coddling. Coddling is a waste of everybody's time.

It is my opinion that many (note I said many and not all) of the "troubled", counseled and medicated kids out there are the victims of lazy parents and that there is really nothing wrong with them.

If a kid needs help get the kid the help they need. But do not accept unacceptable behavior even from a troubled kid. You will not be doing them any favors.

Unfortunately I have to fire many adults who were once "troubled" kids every year. Then did not learn accountability from their parents and I do not have the time, money or patience to teach them. I hold them accountable and they suffer the consequences of their actions. If they perform the job I hired them to do they keep it. If they excel they earn more than their lower performing peers. If they can't be accountable for their own actions enough to perform I fire them.

Employers are not in business to provide jobs we are in business to solve problems for customers. An employee who does not take accountability for their performance is just another problem to solve by either development or termination from employment. I have never terminated anyone for a single incident of poor performance. I guide, I counsel, I warn, I develop, I reprimand and every once in a while I reward one of the poor performance who gains clarity on being accountable. If parents had done their jobs mine would be a whole lot easier.

If more of them had been punished by their parents to spend a few hundred hours per year alone in a room in an uncomfortable antique school desk writing " I will do what I am supposed to do when I am supposed to do it." then maybe I would not have to fire them for violating the drug policy, stealing, violating safety rules, attendance, fighting, quality violations, etc.

In the real world not everyone gets a trophy. Only the people who earn rewards with performance get a reward.

Just my thoughts of course.

Crazy,

I certainly can understand some of your discomfort with some of my methods.

However, I can assure you that my SS speaks his mind very well, with well thought out and informed authority. I get "I love you Dad" all of the time. When we are watching the news at the end of the day after cleaning up after dinner he will often toss a pillow in my lap, lay down on the couch and have me scratch his back and rub his head. We go hiking together often. He is one of my favorite people. He calls me whenever he needs help support or input.

As for abuse, read my response to StepMom2be. You may gain some clarity on things you know nothing about. CPS has been to my home and spoken to my son when we called them when SpermDad sent him home from summer visitation with bleeding sores on his rectum from ungodly diaper rash. They checked in periodically for a few years including during the TOWER phase. In fact, a member of the SpermFamily was admonished a few years later for filing a false abuse claim against us for the TOWER. The CPS officer stopped by, talked to my son, had him show how he had to write sentences, laughed and left. Then admonished a Sperm for making a false report of abuse. So I am cool with CPS.

As for Nazi, nope, not even close. Devoted loving hard working dad, husband, son, brother and uncle who does not coddle or allow people to avoid accountability. Yep. Not I said coddle not cuddle. I am the biggest teddy bear on the planet for those who have my respect. I have no use for those who will not be accountable for their own actions.

Teaching your kids about accountability is not abuse. It is an element of love in one of its highest manifestations. IMHO.

As for my soul, I can assure you that God and I are tight.

Write back any time, I can run with this one all day long, week long, or month long. I can write the hell out of those sentences.

Best regards,

I think the problem here as with any written account is that things can get lost in translation especially when you don't have the nonverbal behaviors to properly communicate it. Sometimes you don't have the time or the words to say it clearly when it is a long drawn out situation. Maybe that is why my posts are probably like dissertation projects in trying to get the total picture across. In any event, I am big on accoountability and respect. I think outside of that, most everything flows somehow from these two character traits. I think what was missed in the initial post was the fact that the thousands of sentences was written over a period of time and not say in a day or week, which would imply that the kid was not allowed to do anything but write day in and day out, sort of like Cinderella.

I too feel the need to hold kids accountable so that they do not grow up to be irresponsible adults, we as a society have enough of them walking around pretending to be grown-ups and we can't afford to nurture one more.

Rags, in any event, I think your initial translation was misconstrued about the writing and I think the whole destroying of SS things resonated out of control on your behalf. As mentioned earlier, we all have resorted to some extreme punishments, but in doing so, we also have to know our own boundaries.

Step Mother's Motto this week is:

You don't have to LOVE me, you don't even have to LIKE me... But you will RESPECT me.

Princ,

The TOWER was an evolutionary process. Confiscating and pitching things of value to him did not work. I agree that destroying the game cards, I-Pod and Cell phone were completely ineffective. No possession was important enough to him to make an impression. His time is what he valued. When we took that away, he got the message.

Thanks for the input,

Best regards,

I can go on all day myself.

Here is a definition of emotional abuse from a Caseworkers handbook. Here is the website in case of any questions. The caseworker I talked to specifically stated that long drawn out groundings where you don't let a child out of a room for long periods of time IS child abuse.

Emotional Abuse - Constant berating and rejecting treatment, scapegoating a particular child, AND BIZARRE/CRUEL RITUAL PUNSISHMENTS (e.g. locking a child in the closet, tying a child to a bedpost and demeaning a child).

http://www.pantucek.com/cps/cpswork.pdf

I am curious did you mention to the Caseworker mowing and bleaching your skids clothes? I dont think so. I suspect you only explained the writing out of sentences which wouldn't be considered emotional abuse unless you don't let the child out long enough to use a bathroom.

Let me explain. My husband and I are both from the old school. We are older parents. My own kids are grown. We both had great wonderful loving parents who never did anything to us besides love us but they were strict and didn't take much BS from us either. My husband grew up on a farm so strict disciplining and hard work was a way of life to him. Just like my own mother. My DH and I have our own share of problems which don't involve the skids but we do agree on one things. We are strict and loving to the children. My husband is an ole Army SGT so he could have treated his kids like little soldiers if he wanted to. But he realizes kids are kids and that may be misunderstood as abusive. We don't spank skids AT ALL. We give them groundings and take things away. That has been effective with them. There is no need to destroy their things. I agree with Actualiza. There are boundaries to all punishments. I wouldn't want my skids referring to DH as "Daddy Dearest".

It is better to keep your mouth shut and let people believe you are stupid than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

That was a tongue in cheek response to a request for creative punishment ideas.

I have never destroyed my kids clothes in any way. I have taken bales of the them to Good Will when he outgrows them or they go out of style but I have never destroyed his clothing. However, he has destroyed some of mine. From the perspective of incomplete information that would make him a parent abuser I suppose.

Now for the rest of the story. When he was a toddler through about 10 years old he loved to pick at a thread or small hole in my yard work shirts or weekend wear. He would shred the shirt and giggle the whole time. It was a fun thing that we did and we have several pictures of me in shirts in various stages of shred.

With more complete information and assessment perspective a situation changes does it not?

If you read all of what I wrote you would know that he was never prevented from going to bathroom. He just had to write the sentences assigned in the same amount of time whether he went to the bathroom or not. That was designed to prevent him from daydreaming on the toilet for hours on end. There is not abuse, emotional, physical or otherwise in our home. He is praised when he earns it and suffers the consequences of his actions when appropriate.

We are strict and he is loved. So, it sounds like we have similar perspectives over all. We just seem to differ in the details of what is acceptable and what is not.

I certainly need to learn from you that it is easier go with short inputs and responses than to try to explain a complicated topic when discussing touchy issues such as parenting.

Your description of you and your DH is wonderful. I am sure you are wonderful people and I respect your DH's service to our country.

I suggest we just agree to disagree on this topic. You are blessed to have children (bio or step) that did not require much discipline or consequence. For those who have kids that are a little slower on the uptake as far as accountability, we have to do more than ground, confiscate and lecture.

Some parents focus on raising children to be quality adults through giving an example and teaching accountability and respect, others like to coddle, therapize (I know, not really a word) and medicate. And anywhere in between. I focus on example, accountability, respect and performance.

As I said in one of my many verbose posts, kids need boundaries, rules and consequences as much as they need support, protection and praise. Or something like that. I have written so much on this topic over the past several days I don't remember exactly what I said.

Again, please rest assured that there is no abuse or neglect in our home. Except of political candidates we do not agree with! Wink Wink. And then it is only respectful verbal abuse.

Good luck and best regards,

I realize you don't know all I have been though in the 4 years I have been married to my DH and I am not on here to always make my point. But my skids were NOT always well behaved. When I first met them they were total undisciplined heathens! DH and BM were going through a custody battle when I met my DH. His story could make a great Lifetime Movie for the cause of men's rights. No one wanted to dare touch these kids because of the fear of being called a child abuser. Even though he never spanked them he STILL had that accusation thrown out at him in court. It didn't stick. Why would a mother abandon her children and disappear for 2 years and leave their children with a child abuser? I went through much of what a lot of Step Parents went through with this site dealing with a crazy vindictive Ex and I am still going through it. It is a constant battle. But somewhere in all of the court battles and chaos the skids and I bonded. Their mother abandoned them and they see me now as their mother. I still have had to deal with their abandonment issues on a daily basis. They were a lot of groundings and drama to get them to the wonderful children they are today. But I had to tread lightly on how I punished them and I had to have my DH's support every step of the way when it came to the children's discipline. I am blessed that I was able to win their love and respect. Being a Step Parent doesn't always have to be a bad experience and it doesn't have to be us vs them. It took a lot of hard work on both my husbands and I part to get the children to a life that is as normal as possible.

Maybe you didn't make yourself clear in your posts but it did sound like you were actually telling people to destroy Ipods, throw the skids stuff in the toilets, etc. Maybe I read it wrong but I dont' think so. I dont' even know what the term "Tongue in Cheek" means. I am not trying to be a smart ass. I just never understood the term. Did that mean you were just joking? Dunno. Anyway good luck.

It is better to keep your mouth shut and let people believe you are stupid than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

I find it rather amusing that you are contradicting yourself now....I merely took the words that YOU wrote, not out of context, but as YOU wrote them. Now you are changing things around.

Examples:
Rags wrote on 9/04/08: The TOWER was an empty room in our home with a heinously uncomfortable antique wooden school desk

After my response, Rags wrote this on 9/07/08: Amount and isolation? He was in a climate controlled room in a brand new house. The desk was a wooden antique school desk out of a one room school house in Nebraska. His Mom and I were at home with him the whole time.
****Sounds much different now, huh!*****

Rags wrote on 9/04/08:All weekend, after school and sports with only 15minutes off for meals with the family. The TOWER does two things, it is a consequence and it removes the aggravating presence of the rebellious kid from the rest of the family. It gives Mom, Dad and siblings a break from the stress of the trouble maker.

After my response, Rags wrote on 9/07/08: When we went out to dinner he went with us, when we went on holiday he went with us. Camping, boating, etc ..... He went with us.
***Again, the tone is much different***

Rags wrote on 9/04/08: He asked me once what he should do if he had to go to the bathroom. My answer "Write faster for that hour".

After my response, Rags wrote on 9/07/08: He was never not allowed to pee. He just could not sit on the toilet making paper airplanes out of toilet paper. He had to do his business and get back to his sentences.
***I can go on and on ....***

Additionally, Rags has said these things about himself. THESE ARE NOT MY WORDS, THEY ARE HIS!!!!

"It is no wonder why we get the title "Wicked Step Parent". I am so evil. Mwwwwhahahahaha!"
AND.....
"If any of this constitutes abuse then ........... you are damned right I am abusive."

I could go on and on and on. You the funny thing is, I am standing up for the rights of children. I am in the process of organizing a non profit organization to help the fathers who have been crapped on by our system and the children who slip through the cracks. When the courts walked away and let Madison's abuser go free, DH and I knew that something was not right. What bothers me soooooo much about the post of the TOWER is the abusive undertone it takes. No, nothing Rags did would be constituted as abuse if done in moderation. But everything was done in extremes and now that I have called it all out, the tone is changing and the "clarity" is now being shed.

Rags is a seasoned stepparent. I am a seasoned stepparent, as is Cruella, Sita, Dawn, Vickie.... but there are many new and vulnerable stepparents here looking for ideas and answers. I would think that posts like the TOWER are not quite what direction that new stepparents should be thrown into. But, that is my own opinion and we all know opinions are like assholes.

And Rags, when it comes to a subject that I feel this passionately about, I too can go on and on.... but that would only be bringing more attention to this madness.

"Having a family is like having a bowling alley installed in your head." ...Martin Mull

I wanted to be able to go to sleep and not have more of this to wake up to.

Thank you,

Dawn